Has anyone got the Windows 10 Start Menu working reliably WITHOUT using Classic Shell

[mullet_man]

That does sound like an AppLocker issue (see video below starting from

). Are you able to move a PC into a different OU that doesn't have any AppLocker policies applying to it to test?

 

 

Thanks it does sound like that issue, but other machines are working fine.

 

I have my apps blocked by applocker via user groups than machines, am I doing it wrong?

 

My applocker rule is only applied to Win 10 machines.

[mullet_man]

Block it by applocker but im not sure if it will help you as it sounds like you have bigger things to deal with.

 

To update my *working* post, we still had a few machines fail with the startmenu / taskbar.

 

Theres another thread regarding GP scripts not working which kinda works in conjunction with this issue, that being windows 10 is just crap on a domain.

 

Ive since made 2 more services set to automatic and out the blue 4 of te 5 suites all came on with no problems however 3 of the 5 we cannot ping or remote file explore but they are definately on the network, other than that nothing else has changed.

 

Am just not sure what is it, because it's random I think it's just a win 10 problem.

 

Am gonna keep at it though, will keep updating here as I go.

[arh1a]

Just to let you know in build 1607 the start menu and task bar works no problem with a custom XML file. I even have the file stored on a hidden network share with no problems. Didn't have much joy with older builds of Windows 10 but with build 1607 it works perfectly.

 

Only thing I have found is if you want Internet Explorer pinned to the start menu you need to copy the shortcut into the start menu folder - C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs

[timbo343]

Let me update where we are with the startmenu problems with windows 10 which affects random machines.

 

Running LTSB2016 on student machines, we are still having issues where the startmenu / taskbar don't work. Even when we log the users off that have this problem give goes back to a black screen. Looking in the logs we are still plagued with a dcom error {D63B10C5-BB46-4990-A94F-E40B9D520160} which is linked to RunTimeBroker.exe that controls the modern apps and part of the start menu.

 

I prevented access to this exe via group policy so that no one could run it. Since doing this, this stops the tiles part of the start menu from working and was reported to us last night about how the quick icons no longer work.

 

Removing DENY everyone and granting everyone access to this exe shows the tiles on the start menu.

 

When we removed access to runtimebroker, overall we saw more machines working as they should.

 

Looking up the DCOM error last night a few sites said to alter the DCOM permissions. This hasn't really made any difference to the number of machines that dont work.

 

We had problems with a few other AppIDs and CLSID keys but preventing access to these referenced EXEs has stopped the DCOM errors.

[arh1a]

Just to add I'm using Windows 10 Education not the LTSB so maybe that's part of the problem.

[mullet_man]

Today i decided to check my two main IT rooms and I'd say 25 out of 30 in each room had non workings start menus/modern apps.

 

I've had a long shot hunch in the back of my mind about something so am going to test my theory as inspecting the event logs on a machine I noticed errors regarding apps unable to update.

 

Then i saw a tweet about this post a few weeks back

 

https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/windowsserver/2017/01/09/why-wsus-and-sccm-managed-clients-are-reaching-out-to-microsoft-online/?utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral

 

Which is about clients still connecting to windows updates even though they might be setup to use wsus so I've adjusted my group policies to include this

 

Do not connect to any Windows Update Internet locations: Enabled

 

My hunch being that apps are trying to update and failing maybe? Who knows just a theory on my part. Although I made this change a few weeks back and reimaged a machine not long after and that start menu is still working, possibly a coincidence but who knows.

 

Anyway I'll report my findings as I've left the clients reimaging.

[Arthur]

Do not connect to any Windows Update Internet locations

I wonder if this would be worth doing too...?

 

Turn off random Windows Updates during reference image creation

 

Obviously when creating your image Windows wouldn't be joined to the domain so wouldn't pick up that GPO setting.

[timbo343]

Have you also disabled the sync stuff. I cant remember what it was but the sync tries to sync everything. This could be an issue too.

[mullet_man]

I wonder if this would be worth doing too...?

 

Turn off random Windows Updates during reference image creation

 

Obviously when creating your image Windows wouldn't be joined to the domain so wouldn't pick up that GPO setting.

 

I create my image virtually and then capture that it's totally possible my image could have some of the "issues" mentioned due to it connecting to windows update during image creation.

[mullet_man]

You can turn off windows update during deployment too as it can connect while connecting to wsus so this could be an issue too.

[mullet_man]

Have you also disabled the sync stuff. I cant remember what it was but the sync tries to sync everything. This could be an issue too.

 

Sync stuff? Syncing updates?

[Arthur]

Have you also disabled the sync stuff.

Windows Update Delivery Optimization (peer-to-peer updates from other Windows 10 PCs on the same LAN / Internet)?

[mullet_man]

Ah yes I'd got the disabled early on.

[free780]

How many people are using loopback to implement redirected start menus?

Even if you redirected the start menu shortcuts have to exit in c:/programdata/Microsoft/windows/start menu/programs

 

Also .URL files font work like they did in 1511. In 1607 you have to edit the XML and add shortcuts to edge. I also noticed on 1607 that the startup folder on a redirected start menu run twice with loopback on.

[GroovyNerd]

I've had a similar issues but mine seems to be working stable and updates when changes are made.

I started by creating the start menu I wanted and running the Export-StartLayout powershell command. I then used Notepad++ (NOT NOTEPAD) to modify the startlayout.xml file to make sure that the directories and shortcuts are valid for every user that logs in, meaning that if you are pointing to items in their Start Menu the user MUST have the Shortcut or Application in that Start Menu. For Example, if you map SIMS.net to their start menu and the start tile. As long as a shortcut is present in the start menu the icon will show, even if the software isn't installed. At one point I had an issue where it was re-creating the shortcuts under the %UserProfile%\StartMenu during the Export which obviously isn't valid for all users. Once I've reconfigured the shortcuts to point to the appropriate start menu they work flawlessly.

Make sure at no point you edit with Notepad.exe. I find that this corrupts the xml way too often and I'll be trying to work out why the clients are not picking up the new menu and 9/10 times its because I forgot and used notepad.

[CHiLL]

The only apps I want to be pinned are:

IE

Chrome

Word 2016

Excel 2016

Powerpoint 2016

Publisher 2016

Access 2016

File Explorer

Snipping Tool

Calculator

 

So far I've got all of them to show up EXCEPT the Office apps. They're just leaving blank spaces where the icons ought to be. So far I've tried: (Using Notepad++)

• Using the shortcut location of: "%ALLUSERPROFILE%\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs\Word 2016.lnk"
  
• Using the shortcut location of: "%PROGRAMDATA%\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs\Word 2016.lnk"
  
• Using the shortcut location of: "\\students\startmenu$\Office\Word 2016.lnk" (This is where the Start Menu items are located, which work flawlessly, so it shouldn't be a permissions issue)
  
• Using the shortcut location of: "\\students\StartLayout$\Office\Word 2016.lnk"
  
• Removing the line from from the xml file as that apparently can cause other issues
  

 

None of the above worked and I'm a little stumped at this point.

[Arthur]

None of the above worked and I'm a little stumped at this point.

Have you tried manually recreating one of the shortcuts in "%PROGRAMDATA%\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs" to see if that makes a difference?

 

If it does, it could be due to the way Office creates the shortcuts.

 

 

Left = Advertised shortcut / Right = Non-advertised

[CHiLL]

Have you tried manually recreating one of the shortcuts in "%PROGRAMDATA%\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs" to see if that makes a difference?

 

If it does, it could be due to the way Office creates the shortcuts.

 

 

Left = Advertised shortcut / Right = Non-advertised

Unfortunately that didn't work . It also leaves a blank space like the others.

Edited February 13, 2017 by CHiLL

[timbo343]

Ours looks like this..

 

 

The office apps are linked to the start menu not the C drive.

[CHiLL]

Ours looks like this..

 

 

 

The office apps are linked to the start menu not the C drive.

Excellent, this has made them appear! I need to do more testing and whatnot before I can tick the Start Layout off my list. I did however have a could of 'Runtime Broker - Operation Aborted' errors, though I'm not sure if that's caused by this change. I'll need to do some investigating.

Edited February 13, 2017 by CHiLL

[timbo343]

Excellent, this has made them appear! I need to do more testing and whatnot before I can tick the Start Layout off my list. I did however have a could of 'Runtime Broker - Operation Aborted' errors, though I'm not sure if that's caused by this change. I'll need to do some investigating.

 

The RunTimeBroker is to do with the start menu and the live tiles. I found this out when i disabled the RunTimeBroker server and everyone complained about the start menu tiles not appearing.

[CHiLL]

The RunTimeBroker is to do with the start menu and the live tiles. I found this out when i disabled the RunTimeBroker server and everyone complained about the start menu tiles not appearing.

Ah OK, more testing it is then.

 

By chance, do you know how to find out the 'DesktopApplicationID' for applications I have installed?

[timbo343]

A quick google and found this... https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/hardware/commercialize/customize/enterprise/find-the-application-user-model-id-of-an-installed-app

[CHiLL]

A quick google and found this... https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/hardware/commercialize/customize/enterprise/find-the-application-user-model-id-of-an-installed-app

I saw that earlier when I Google, but when I tried it, it didn't work. It's been a long day, I might take another look tomorrow.

[timbo343]

Something ive found recently whilst on the subject of RunTimeBroker, on a few machines, we are seeing..

 

The description for Event ID 10010 from source Microsoft-Windows-DistributedCOM cannot be found. Either the component that raises this event is not installed on your local computer or the installation is corrupted. You can install or repair the component on the local computer.

 

If the event originated on another computer, the display information had to be saved with the event.

 

The following information was included with the event:

 

{D63B10C5-BB46-4990-A94F-E40B9D520160}

 

The handle is invalid

The key in this error relates to the RunTimeBroker. Unsure how to resolve this error though.