[news] Yahoo - Schools are using monitoring software.

[Garacesh]

It is a pretty simple question : do we tell if asked. Your answer seems to be the same as mine, yes we do.

 

Indeed, but when we're dealing the potential policy, FOI requests, etc, I feel it's important to be clear with your answers/explanations.

[localzuk]

The advantage for the parent is to know you are using a recognised product supplied by a reputable company.

 

Do they need to know every piece of software we use too?

Which is?

Not having the kids find out what we use.

[pcstru]

Do they need to know every piece of software we use too?

Need? It is up to them what they think they need and it is not for me to tell them what they need. If they ask, then IMO we should be willing to inform them.

 

Not having the kids find out what we use.

 

So security by obscurity. Good luck with that.

[pcstru]

Isn't this 'old' news? I'm sure this monitoring scaremongering has surfaced before

Yes it did and there was largely the same arrogant reaction that we have nothing to learn from these people while we ignore that we likely do not actually have the required policy and procedure in place.

[unixman_again]

Our AUP says we use monitoring software and web filtering software and have anti-plagiarism tools in place. We don't say what these are and we've never been asked. I suspect, nobody has ever read the AUP - they just sign it when they start at the college. Both staff and students sign

[hardtailstar]

Some of the comments on the article are interesting!

[simpsonj]

Some of the comments on the article are interesting!

 

I read the comments.

 

I regret that decision...

 

Still @hardtailstar you started a thread about this very FOI request back when it was requested in March! http://www.edugeek.net/forums/behind-red-door/167734-foi-big-brother-watch.html

[Dos_Box]

I would tell them what you use. 90% Would have forgotten it by the time they leave the building.

[hardtailstar]

I read the comments.

 

I regret that decision...

 

Still @hardtailstar you started a thread about this very FOI request back when it was requested in March! http://www.edugeek.net/forums/behind-red-door/167734-foi-big-brother-watch.html

 

Forgot about that.

 

We may of been one not give away much because at the time we were looking at changing/adding to what we use..

[synaesthesia]

Yes, if asked you should really say. If anyone can get around it, you have larger issues to worry about, such as how and more importantly why they are circumventing it.

Yes it's scaremongering, some of the people involved including Big Brother "Can't be bothered to actually research" Watch and those commenters are hilariously underinformed or have just lost their tinfoil hats.

No, you shouldn't say what you use in policies, correspondence to parents etc UNLESS it's going on pupil owned devices (that's another topic). That's nothing to do with security, that's just it'd be daft to put in names of things that may change often. Doesn't hurt to invite people to ask if they have any questions about it though.

I think we're transparent enough; the product names are emblazoned across all the relevant block pages

[DanTheLacky]

The comments make it sound like there are cameras watching the over the children at all times, I begrudgingly answered that Big brother freedom of information request, knowing full well it was going to be used for something like this, or to try and sell on the information.

[Arthur]

Spyware routinely installed by UK schools to snoop on kids’ Web habits

 

Over two-thirds of schools installed special software on school computers to spy on their pupils, responses to Freedom of Information requests have revealed.

 

According to a report by Big Brother Watch, "classroom management software" is running on over 800,000 computers, laptops, and mobile phones found in 1,000 secondary schools across England and Wales. A whopping £2.5 million has been spent on the programs.

 

Classroom management software allows the screens of an entire class to be monitored from a teacher's desktop, and for both the historical and real-time Web activity of a pupil to be accessed. Keystrokes can be watched, and alerts created to flag up "inappropriate" words. More generally, the systems can try to spot "bad" behaviour online, including signs of "extremism and radicalisation."

 

The civil liberties group's report noted that schools may be installing the software due to government pressure to adhere to obligations under the anti-extremism Prevent strategy, or in response to the recently published Keeping Children Safe in Education guidance.

 

Big Brother Watch is also concerned about the security of class management programs: "the safety of children isn’t solely about protecting them from searching for, viewing, or typing inappropriate words and images," it said. "It also involves ensuring that the personal information held about them and their education is properly secured."

 

^ That last paragraph makes it sound like classroom management software includes the same kind of personal information found in the schools MIS?

[X-13]

^ That last paragraph makes it sound like classroom management software includes the same kind of personal information found in the schools MIS?

 

Of course it does, it's written that way to generate outrage from people who don't know.

[localzuk]

Thing is, schools can and will end up in special measures if they don't have adequate monitoring policies (and associated tech) in place.

 

In a primary school, when pupils are always monitored directly by a member of staff in the room with them whilst they work, they wouldn't need something like Impero, as the logs generated by their filtering solution, added to the staff based monitoring should be enough.

 

But in schools where pupils can work independently? There is a requirement to have adequate monitoring in place. No ifs no buts.

 

Also, on an aside, do Big Brother Watch have any experience or knowledge of radicalisation and child protection? Sure they can comment on technology blindly, but without any experts in the relevant areas, its kinda pointless.

[Garacesh]

Also, on an aside, do Big Brother Watch have any experience or knowledge of radicalisation and child protection? Sure they can comment on technology blindly, but without any experts in the relevant areas, its kinda pointless.

It's almost as if people like to open their mouth even when they don't understand the words coming out of it.

 

It's a good question though. It's one thing to criticise everybody for doing what they're doing, but I'd be interested to see what (if any) guidance they offer.

[DJ-1701]

It's almost as if people like to open their mouth even when they don't understand the words coming out of it.

 

... Oh, sorry, I thought you were talking about Trump!

 

It's a good question though. It's one thing to criticise everybody for doing what they're doing, but I'd be interested to see what (if any) guidance they offer.

 

Bingo! Nail firmly hit on head!

[ReadTheNetwork]

Makes me think of when the news came out about Cctv in toilets.

 

surely people expect to be monitored at work? Adults get monitored no less than pupils.

 

News reports say we don't monitor enough... for example online bullying instances. Then saying we go overboard on next page. Maybe bit exaggerated 😃

[AngryITGuy]

I've just been sent the link to their report and remember completing the FOI request last year.

 

If anyone else is interested in seeing the report it's here

 

https://www.bigbrotherwatch.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Classroom-Management-Software-Another-Brick-in-the-Wall.pdf

[Garacesh]

Wow, this is all just complete drivel.

 

Although Classroom Management Software is marketed as something that can help maintain discipline in a connected classroom, some teachers feel they are being asked to snoop on their pupils’ every move.

[Citation needed]

 

The encouragement for schools to adopt a Bring Your Own Device (BYOD) scheme could lead to further examples of this software being installed on pupils privately-owned devices and for monitoring of pupils’ activity on personal devices being undertaken outside of the classroom. Use of software in this way, we believe, would be excessive and would cross the line into schools intruding into pupils’ private lives.

Yes, that would be excessive, but I highly doubt you'll find a single school anywhere that does, or would do, that.

 

As expected, this report criticises but offers no alternative.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Garacesh

[clockend25]

Spyware routinely installed by UK schools to snoop on kids’ Web habits

 

The article is a joke, but some of the comments below had me fuming.

Edited November 10, 2016 by clockend25

[pcstru]

Wow, this is all just complete drivel.

 

Although Classroom Management Software is marketed as something that can help maintain discipline in a connected classroom, some teachers feel they are being asked to snoop on their pupils’ every move.

[Citation needed]

Page 7 provides sourced quotes from teachers and teaching unions.

 

 

The encouragement for schools to adopt a Bring Your Own Device (BYOD) scheme could lead to further examples of this software being installed on pupils privately-owned devices and for monitoring of pupils’ activity on personal devices being undertaken outside of the classroom. Use of software in this way, we believe, would be excessive and would cross the line into schools intruding into pupils’ private lives.

Yes, that would be excessive, but I highly doubt you'll find a single school anywhere that does, or would do, that.

 

from the report :

 

Classroom Management Software has been installed on:

821,386

devices; computers, laptops, tablets or mobile phones

819,970 (99.8%)

school owned devices

1416 (0.2%)

pupil owned devices

 

 

 

As expected, this report criticises but offers no alternative.

The intention is to promote debate, not offer solutions.

Edited November 10, 2016 by pcstru

[pcstru]

The article is a joke,

 

The report is 18 pages of explanation and data from their research. Your critique of it fails to address ANY of the points they raise in detail. I know which one I would rate as higher quality.

[Garacesh]

1416 (0.2%) pupil owned devices

I very much suspect that those are not Pupil-Owned devices, they are referring to 1:1 device programs or pupil owned devices using BYOD being filtered by a proxy.

I cannot see any technician installing Classroom Management software such as NetSupport or Impero on a pupils personal phone.

[localzuk]

I think a lot of these articles are a bit confused about keylogging. AFAIK, tools like Impero don't "log" keystrokes. They monitor them in realtime, and compare to the library of alerts. If they don't match, they're discarded. I can't remember seeing a keylog when I had Impero at another school.

[pcstru]

I very much suspect that those are not Pupil-Owned devices, they are referring to 1:1 device programs or pupil owned devices using BYOD being filtered by a proxy.

I cannot see any technician installing Classroom Management software such as NetSupport or Impero on a pupils personal phone.

So the report contains data submitted by schools but you don't like that data so you are going to discard it on the basis that it does not conform to your view.

 

Ever heard of confirmation bias?