[sims] Quick Question about SIMS from Non-SIMS user

[ntm1275]

I've never used SIMS before, so I need to know whether there is a field within the database that identifies whether a pupil is a current member of the school or is a former member of the school.

 

Does SIMS have some kind of 'RollStatus' field that identifies this 'current' or 'former', or does it just use a 'leave date' to identify children not on roll

 

In other MIS systems I've used, they have a separate field that is populated with either C for current roll or F for former roll

 

If there is such a field, can you tell me what the field is called in the SQL database and what format the data is in

 

Any help would be much appreciated

[Esteban_Child_of_the_Sun]

I believe what you are looking for is

SELECT [current_roll_mode] FROM [sIMS].[sims].[stud_student]

and you get NULL for leavers, and current students are split between On Roll, Guest, Main, Subsid and Future.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Esteban_Child_of_the_Sun

[Meldrew]

IMHO, I would seriously, however, not go poking around the SQL database and use SIMSCommandReporter instead (which Capita support - help on its use available in various other threads). This can get all the data you want (and lots more), but doesn't require SQL queries direct to the SIMS database. I don't know what SIMS support would have to say if you were found to be doing this, even arguing that you are only making read-only access to the database. Certainly, I wouldn't be the person that was having to explain to my HT that our SIMS support is refusing to help because of tinkering I'd been doing.

 

Meldrew

[Esteban_Child_of_the_Sun]

I agree with Meldrew, but there are reasons someone would want to do this e.g. if they only had a SIMS DB and no-longer actively used it but wanted to get data out without installing SIMS.

[ntm1275]

I am not accessing or trying to read from the SIMS SQL database at all, no 'poking about' going on here and as a non-SIMS user, I have no access to any of the SIMS tools to achieve this

 

I am just trying to understand how SIMS identifies current roll and former roll pupils

 

We have a project on the go with GroupCall using Xporter and we need a few modifications to what is extracted out of SIMS, but as I don't have access to a SIMS database to look for myself, I thought I'd ask the question here

[PhilNeal]

It's managed through enrolment dates. There isn't a flag.

[CAM]

The field is called Registration Status and you can select Single, Guest, Dual Registration - Main or Dual Registration - Subsidiary. The latter two are used for students who are on-roll at two schools, with the pupil's home school setting them as main and the one they are visiting setting them as subsidiary. Guest shouldn't really be used but some schools still do and Single is a normal registration for a student in the school.

 

In addition, applicants are placed into application groups and have an Application Status of Applied, Accepted, Admitted, Withdrawn, Offered, Reserved or Rejected. Those set to Admitted get pulled into the school roll and are given a Registration Status whilst the others sit in the application group waiting for a place.

 

As Phil says, it is date based. So when a pupil is admitted they are granted an Admission Date and when they are made leavers they are issued a Leaving Date. When you use an Effective Date in SIMS, it tells the system to look at the database as if it is that date. So if a student has an Admission Date of 1/9/15 then they won't appear if the Effective Date is 31/8/15 but will show as on-roll from 1/9/15 and onwards until their leaving date when they will show as off-roll.

Edited April 7, 2016 by CAM

[ntm1275]

Thanks for the information

 

It's interesting to see how different systems deal with this question

 

So if SIMS uses leave dates to identify 'former roll' pupils, I assume that a school cannot pre-populate the leave date field before the the pupils has physically left or otherwise the pupil will be seen as no longer in the school.

I can see a scenario where this might happen

If a school has a lot of pupils leaving their school at the end of year 6 to move to a secondary school, the school might pre-populate the leave date field before hand, which would mean they are no longer in the school

If this is correct, then a SIMS school would have to make sure that the leave date is only filled in on the day the pupil leaves the school

[Esteban_Child_of_the_Sun]

I do use SIMS and we do pre-populate the end date for all students in Y6 around this time and it's never caused an issue. Hence me pointing out the DB field that SIMS seems to use in it's reporting engine for determining if a student is on roll with the school or not.

[ntm1275]

Sorry, I was assuming that @PhilNeal's comment would be the definitive answer as he works for Capita

 

So your saying that the [current_roll_mode] field can also identify former roll pupils by the the NULL value

 

Perhaps Phil can comment on this

[Esteban_Child_of_the_Sun]

I'm guessing there are stored procedures that update this field based on pre-defined parameters that look at the current date and date of admission/leaving etc. that are triggered from within SIMS under specified conditions. Therefore what Phil says is correct in that SIMS uses enrollment dates but the full answer is more complex than that. Therefore as long as SIMS is used (correctly) then this field in the student record should be as good as reverse engineering their stored procedures to generate your own On-Roll/Leaver list.

 

Having said that, GropupCall is a Capita partner and should do all this sort of work for you. You should just tell them the info you want and they should be the ones working out where to extract it from.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Esteban_Child_of_the_Sun

[Barcrest]

Sorry, I was assuming that @PhilNeal's comment would be the definitive answer as he works for Capita

 

So your saying that the [current_roll_mode] field can also identify former roll pupils by the the NULL value

 

Perhaps Phil can comment on this

 

I think you mis understood what he said, as the leaving field is a date Sims will only class them as a leaver after that date not if there is any date in that field.