Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) What a pile of cow dung. Its a Microsoft device, yet when you install a Microsoft operating system (Windows 10, released after the Surface was) the drivers are missing. What kind of system is that? And you can't even find an easy way to download them. Links are dead, or wrong, instructions are wrong, files are missing, a total shambles of a product. Have MS learn nothing from Apple. (lets not discuss it) On top of that, "Your product key has been blocked". The user should not have to find the drivers, and why is MS still using product keys like its 2000? Im sorry my Surface will be thrown in the fire if it carries on. Edited October 30, 2015 by Nixon77
Arthur Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 And you can't even find an easy way to download them. Did you try these? www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=49040
Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Author Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) Did you try these? www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=49040 Thanks, Yes I have tried these ones, for the Pro as well. (and MS have even called them "Surface 3 Wifi", even though it contains over drivers, so easy to find) I get a driver install error, windows cannot install the driver. Edited October 30, 2015 by Nixon77
JoHimself Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 Its a Microsoft device, yet when you install a Microsoft operating system (Windows 10, released after the Surface was) the drivers are missing. What kind of system is that? I don't really know what the solution to this would be. If Microsoft included the drivers on the disk they would be surplus to requirements for most people installing the OS. Users for whom the drivers would be useful would be installing old drivers after 6 months or so. Windows XP was still in widespread use 10 years after launch, would 10 year old drivers for a 10+ year old machine really be useful to anyone? Do they justify inclusion on the disk? I understand this is a rant of sorts so you're not necessarily after a solution. I also agree that manufacturers should do better when it comes to looking for drivers, but then look at HP.
Arthur Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 MS have even called them "Surface 3 Wi-Fi", even though it contains other drivers, so easy to find That's because there's also a Surface 3 LTE which requires different drivers. Google does the same thing with the Nexus 7 and 9 so that you can tell the models apart.
Arthur Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 I get a driver install error, windows cannot install the driver. Did you update the firmware first?
gshaw Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 We found them eventually for ours and working OK with Win10, although it does often seem that MS (and some other companies) need an "attention to detail" department to sort these niggles at source. So often it's left to bloggers making unofficial guides bringing everything together rather than the companies doing it in the first place. Adobe are another one; the only guide to hooking up ADFS to their Federated ID system is written by a random guy on Wordpress whereas their support pages contain nothing of use
Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Author Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) I don't really know what the solution to this would be. If Microsoft included the drivers on the disk they would be surplus to requirements for most people installing the OS. Users for whom the drivers would be useful would be installing old drivers after 6 months or so. Windows XP was still in widespread use 10 years after launch, would 10 year old drivers for a 10+ year old machine really be useful to anyone? Do they justify inclusion on the disk? I understand this is a rant of sorts so you're not necessarily after a solution. I also agree that manufacturers should do better when it comes to looking for drivers, but then look at HP. If the drivers were included on the disc, then the user would not need to go and find them. Apple "drivers" come included with the OS, its easy, why don't MS just to that. If its a Microsoft Surface, it makes sense to make sure your OS includes the correct drivers for the device. For more advanced users, they can replace the drivers as they wish. Most users will not be able to go out and find the drivers easily, I am only able to because I have a LAN adapter which happens to work with the Surface, if I had no other machine, I would be stuck, and all I did was upgraded to Windows 10. Oh and they don't work, I forgot to add. I did get the wireless going, apparently the drivers will install over update. Edited October 30, 2015 by Nixon77
JoHimself Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 If the drivers were included on the disc, then the user would not need to go and find them. Apple "drivers" come included with the OS, its easy, why don't MS just to that. If its a Microsoft Surface, it makes sense to make sure your OS includes the correct drivers for the device. Well the only supported hardware for Mac OS is Mac hardware, they only have a limited number of drivers they need to support. I maintain that people who don't have a Surface Pro shouldn't have to download Surface Pro drivers. Maybe a solution could be for Microsoft to have a special download just for Surface users. Part of the issue is that Apple are an expensive gadget company and Microsoft are a software and services company. I'm curious, did you upgrade to Windows 10? Because when I did that on my home and work PCs all the drivers and software were still installed.
sted Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 Well the only supported hardware for Mac OS is Mac hardware, they only have a limited number of drivers they need to support. I maintain that people who don't have a Surface Pro shouldn't have to download Surface Pro drivers. Maybe a solution could be for Microsoft to have a special download just for Surface users. Part of the issue is that Apple are an expensive gadget company and Microsoft are a software and services company. I'm curious, did you upgrade to Windows 10? Because when I did that on my home and work PCs all the drivers and software were still installed. Ditto once I removed SQL my surface pro just upgraded all drivers and software still on place
Dos_Box Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 I love mine!! Are you using the proper method with the official Surface ISO images? - Download a recovery image for Microsoft Surface
Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Author Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) Well the only supported hardware for Mac OS is Mac hardware, they only have a limited number of drivers they need to support. I maintain that people who don't have a Surface Pro shouldn't have to download Surface Pro drivers. Maybe a solution could be for Microsoft to have a special download just for Surface users. Part of the issue is that Apple are an expensive gadget company and Microsoft are a software and services company. I'm curious, did you upgrade to Windows 10? Because when I did that on my home and work PCs all the drivers and software were still installed. But Microsoft are now moving into producing their own devices. These devices used different parts from third parties, just as Macs. Macs have a custom design, but the chips etc are Intel etc. The new Surface 4 is expensive. But it comes from MS. Its got their logo all over it. Microsoft really need to up their game. People paying such amounts should not need to do MS's job. Surely they (MS) know what parts are installed and which drivers are needed. Its limited to so many parts. Its not like third party PC's from many vendors. I upgraded to Windows 10, from Windows 8.1. It is indeed meant to keep drivers, but for some users this is not the case. There is also a common problem in which the WinRE is messed up, meaning Bitlocker cannot be enabled without some work, again users should not have to do this. Microsoft really should perhaps stay a "software and services company". Edited October 30, 2015 by Nixon77
Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Author Posted October 30, 2015 I love mine!! Are you using the proper method with the official Surface ISO images? - Download a recovery image for Microsoft Surface Thanks for those links, I have not tried these, I might give it a try.
Dos_Box Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 Please see above, they do have special download images for the Surface family and you are supposed to use those, not go for a complete bare-bones reinstall with sperate drivers.
Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Author Posted October 30, 2015 Please see above, they do have special download images for the Surface family and you are supposed to use those, not go for a complete bare-bones reinstall with sperate drivers. Even to upgrade to Windows 10, I can't help thinking this would be too complex for most users. I have seen on MS forums many people just taking the Surface back to the shop to have it replaced.
2097 Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 I have the dell Venue 11 pro i5 version Installed windows 10 , no drivers required. Cost me £205 including the extra keyboard ( with built in battery ), refurbed of course i5,4gb ram , 128gb ssd Basically a cheap ultrabook with the laptop style keyboard
JoHimself Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 But Microsoft are now moving into producing their own devices. These devices used different parts from third parties, just as Macs. Macs have a custom design, but the chips etc are Intel etc. The new Surface 4 is expensive. But it comes from MS. Its got their logo all over it. Microsoft really need to up their game. People paying such amounts should not need to do MS's job. Surely they (MS) know what parts are installed and which drivers are needed. Its limited to so many parts. Its not like third party PC's from many vendors. I upgraded to Windows 10, from Windows 8.1. It is indeed meant to keep drivers, but for some users this is not the case. There is also a common problem in which the WinRE is messed up, meaning Bitlocker cannot be enabled without some work, again users should not have to do this. Microsoft really should perhaps stay a "software and services company". Microsoft are now moving into producing their own devices, for which they are delivering custom Windows 10 installers with drivers included. I say again, including drivers for your own hardware in the generic OS image is a waste of time because the drivers will be obsolete before the OS is. Imagine if this were implemented; next year the Surface 5 is released, the Surface 5 drivers would have to be included in Generic Windows 10 installers. Now you have the old version of Windows 10 with drivers for Surface 4 and below and the new one with Surface 5 and below. How does the user know which one they have? Far better surely to release Surface specific recovery images. Comparing Apple products with Microsoft ones isn't really a direct or fair comparison. Apple include drivers with their OS, Microsoft doesn't, there is a better selection of meat at my butchers than Sainsbury's Local.
Nixon77 Posted October 30, 2015 Author Posted October 30, 2015 (edited) Microsoft have include many drivers in their OS, generic ones, for many years. Its far better for a user to have a useable surface, than one that does not work hardly at all. Even if its working on generic drivers. And drivers update via windows update, so generic ones are replaced with newer official vender drivers. I agree its better for someone to the the image, but most home users want it easy and for it just to work, it does not "just work" for all users at the moment. Considering MS keep prompting the user to update to Windows 10. Microsoft are now releasing high spec expensive devices, (not as expensive as Apple), but I would expect something to take care of its self for that price. Edited October 30, 2015 by Nixon77
unixman_again Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 But Microsoft are now moving into producing their own devices. ... Microsoft really should perhaps stay a "software and services company". Point of order. They've been making hardware of various sorts since 1982, only 7 years after the company started.
Sagima Posted October 30, 2015 Posted October 30, 2015 I don't think it would have overly bloated the Windows installer to have included a wifi driver for their tablets in windows 10. I ended up sticking the surface drivers in the wim rather than trying to update it afterwards- far easier.
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