IP Cameras

[FN-GM]

This is nothing to do with schools or anything. My dad wants to install 4 - 8 CCTV Cameras in his shop for security. I Suggested IP cameras he is keen on the idea so that is what we probably going to happen. All the cameras will be connected via Ethernet.

 

I am not 100% sure with them and i have a couple of questions, if anybody can answer them please do so.

 

1. Do the cameras need there own power supply or will they draw power from the Ethernet connection?

 

2. What specification of computer would i need to run 4 - 8 cameras and record them 24-7, what size of hard drives will i need?

 

3. Is there any software that you can run the cameras split screen and when you replay the videos you can click one particular camera it will make it full screen?

 

4. Do the cameras have sound?

 

Thanks for your help.

[john]

Okai

1. Some do some don't, think of them a little bit like Wifi APs, some do have POE injectors that you can use others don't.

2. Depends on the quality of camera, colour / black and white. Do you really want to record everything 24x7 or just areas, or when movement is detected

3. Depends on the software.

4. Depends on the camera, most software programs will allow sound.

 

I've used X-Vision in a job I did for someone a while ago - http://www.cctvstuff.co.uk/digital_recording.htm that was very good software and allowed sound, remote access, control of cameras etc if it was all supporting. But I did wire the cameras straight the machine using Coax rather than IP. But they may support IP Cams.

[FN-GM]

2. well we want them 24-7 just incase of a break in, they will be colour.

[john]

That web link I provided gives you a guide of quality VS space needed.

[meastaugh1]

In addition to record-on-motion detection, I believe some cameras include a buffer which allow you to record the x seconds prior to motion detection.

[monkey_boy]

I'd just like to point out before you spend a lot of money on your cctv set-up that in order to use a video in court as evidence there needs to be strict guidelines that are followed. For a video to be used successfully requires the detail to cause the defendant to admit that it is them on the video, ie, if it can be disputed it will be worthless. So bear that in mind when you spec up and install your kit.

 

On the other hand, if you want a setup where you can monitor for shoplifters and have a short timespan of recording, ie 12 hours while the shop is open, then you can lower your sights and your outlay quite a bit. If you go for a lower spec option for monitoring and deterring, then you would be just as well to set it to record when it detects movement at night so you don't waste HDD space, and it would be 'being resourceful' with what you have on the off chance of getting something useful, rather than shelling out for a big expensive setup that you later find out can't do what you were hoping it might.

 

I hope that makes sense! And this isn't meant to put you off doing what you're doing, but just trying to give you some balanced info when you weigh up the benefits vs costs of your spec.

 

 

MB

[john]

http://www.y3k.com/acatalog/l205.html has a useful chart on Quality VS Lense type and how useful the recording is. Y3K are a good firm who have been recomended to me and I know they are good. They also have http://www.ipcctv.com/ which as the name shows is all IP CCTV stuff.

 

One option that you may want to look at for the shop is using traditional Coax CCTV but running it over CAT5 with CAT5 to BNC Balluns, which make it a lot easier to cable but are just as effective and mean you can use the cheaper equiptment which may be more flexible for you.

[Joedetic]

Have you considered getting a professional company to come and install it because then you've got support if it all goes wrong.

 

http://www.richardscctv.com/ is who did the CCTV at my school and it was BNC to the CCTV server which was a 2U rackmount controlled via a web interface. That box handled all the archiving etc. They do all sorts of cameras some with remote telemetary and stuff like nightvision IIRC.

 

Also if you're doing your own solution there are guidelines in the DPA that suggest that you cant record other people's property (or something like that) so richards will setup blanking on your camera maps so that you only record your site etc.

[m25man]

You can have any conciveable combination of camera/recording system you want, ultimately it will always come back to price and you definately get what you pay for in the CCTV game.

 

This weekend the police set up one of the most sophisticated cctv systems ever seen for the 3 days of the Notting Hill Carnival in a local school. Facial Recognition Systems (forget ANPR thats kids stuff) this is true 24 CTU kit, under 7 seconds to get a match on the PNC from a CCTV camera.

I tell you now, if the bad guys could see this working they would all become painter and decorators overnight (but unfortunately the Polish got all those jobs).

 

They started plumbing in the fibre and broadband last Monday and it will all be out by tomorrow.

 

Personally I like the Mobotix Cameras as they are completley NIX based have an internal Ring Buffer 2 way Audio Day & Night Vision and a choice of lenses and will record to any type of network share you offer it.

As everything you need is on the camera there is no need for any additional hardware/software.

 

Google for the Mobotix brand and you will find lots of public cameras to view. Yes you can buy a cheap camera for £100 for 640x480 if your lucky with a lens made in Taiwan for 35p that will make J-Lo shopping look like Hannibal Lecter eating lunch and will never be admissible as evidence in court.

 

If you want this to be a "Professional Installation" you will need to allow at least £500 per camera.

You will probably be able to reduce the number of cameras if you choose some that can auto track a moving target or have a wide angle or fish eye.

[Grommit]

This is nothing to do with schools or anything. My dad wants to install 4 - 8 CCTV Cameras in his shop for security. I Suggested IP cameras he is keen on the idea so that is what we probably going to happen. All the cameras will be connected via Ethernet.

 

I am not 100% sure with them and i have a couple of questions, if anybody can answer them please do so.

 

1. Do the cameras need there own power supply or will they draw power from the Ethernet connection?

 

2. What specification of computer would i need to run 4 - 8 cameras and record them 24-7, what size of hard drives will i need?

 

3. Is there any software that you can run the cameras split screen and when you replay the videos you can click one particular camera it will make it full screen?

 

4. Do the cameras have sound?

 

Thanks for your help.

 

The best bet for your dads shop if he is on a budget is a PTZ wireless Camera system..

 

These camera's will go back to a DVR and you can contol them from the TV...

 

Easy and simple...

 

Or as someone said.. you can pay a ortune..

 

Or school has just spent £250 000.00 on CCTV .. and it's not an IP system.. nor is it a stand alone system :-)

[FN-GM]

Have you considered getting a professional company to come and install it because then you've got support if it all goes wrong.

 

http://www.richardscctv.com/ is who did the CCTV at my school and it was BNC to the CCTV server which was a 2U rackmount controlled via a web interface. That box handled all the archiving etc. They do all sorts of cameras some with remote telemetary and stuff like nightvision IIRC.

 

Also if you're doing your own solution there are guidelines in the DPA that suggest that you cant record other people's property (or something like that) so richards will setup blanking on your camera maps so that you only record your site etc.

 

Yes but the quote was masive

[FN-GM]

well with IP cameras you can add more easy you wont need to change the DVI

[plexer]

For the software have a look at zoneminder.com

 

Ben

[FN-GM]

right thanks guys what resolution would you all recommend please?

[contink]

Slightly off-topic but I discovered that the reason you get CCTV footage shown on Crimewatch, etc.. is because it's not within the legal parameters and they need someone to corroborate or add to their own suspect pool.

 

My neighbour has done a lot of research into this topic and found that ultimately you're looking at a very large cost if you want it to be legally admissable. As said neighbour pointed out, he just wants to know who it is if someone trashes his cars so he can resolve the issue himself.

[FN-GM]

ok thanks, any resolution recommendation please?

[Marvintpa]

If you want good(ish) quality images dont go all colour. Have a couple of colour cameras to get the whole shop area to identify the colours of clothes etc ... but get better quality B/W cameras to cover specific areas in great detail.

 

One brand of cameras I do like is WATEC they are analogue cameras but the images are crystal clear. (The police use them for covert survielance as well so they do come "highly recomended" )

[FN-GM]

ok thanks, there main use is to stop local trouble makers and catch staff with fingers in till, we havnt got a problem with any now but you never know. Only a few weeks ago there were two women figihting

[maniac]

Check out http://www.cctv-information.co.uk This site is excellent, gives you all the technical information regarding what you can and can't do with CCTV systems, and tonnes of information on choosing the correct kit. Helped me loads when I designed and installed a CCTV system for a friends premises, and the video evidence has been used in court once, so it must be up to the job.

 

Mike.

[contink]

ok thanks, there main use is to stop local trouble makers and catch staff with fingers in till,

 

Just be aware of the legal requirements regarding notification, notices, etc.. so you don't find yourselves being sued for invasion of privacy, etc..

[FN-GM]

we have had a camera up for a few years but its starting to play up and it does get all parts of the shop so its time for upgrade