Qualifications needed for newbie

[originofsymmetry]

I'm currently doing my A levels right now and was wondering what qualifications I would need to become a network manager, haven't decided on whether it would be in the education sector, but can anyone give me any advice on courses and qualifications that would look good on a c.v.

 

I'm currently looking into the following:

 

http://www.staffs.ac.uk/courses/undergrad/computingwithtechnology/tcm11018464.php

 

http://www.port.ac.uk/courses/coursetypes/undergraduate/BScHonsComputerNetworkManagementAndDesign/

 

http://prospectus.ulster.ac.uk/course/?id=4590

 

I have been self teaching myself about group olicy, AD, profile setups etc. myself, but was wondering what else I would need that would be recognised by the industry

Thnx in advance

[djm968]

If you are serious about a career in IT, you will also need professional qualifications like CCNA MCSE.

 

Most employers in the private sector (where the money is!) will not consider inexperienced candidates unless they have professional qualifications also.

[Geoff]

Actually, round here, employers are becoming wary of prospective employees turning up with qualifications but little to no experience. Generally they rate experience at least as highly as qualifications.

[plock]

Indeed - it's hard to win!

 

You can't get the experience if you're getting the qualifications, and you can't get the qualifications as easily if you're getting the experience.

 

Along with this, it's hard to get the experience even with the qualifications because they then want to employ someone with experience!

 

It's a catch 22!

[mrforgetful]

Yeh I'd say instead of aiming straight for a NM job to join somewhere in a more junior role that offers training that way you get everything you need.

[djm968]

Actually, round here, employers are becoming wary of prospective employees turning up with qualifications but little to no experience. Generally they rate experience at least as highly as qualifications.

 

If you are 30+ that may be true and I agree experience is everything, however the OP has just finished A levels and is starting his/her IT career. Many prospective employers (private sector) will not even consider a graduate unless they have also completed or are “working towards” professional qualifications.

[dhicks]

> I'm currently doing my A levels right now and was wondering what

> qualifications I would need to become a network manager, haven't

> decided on whether it would be in the education sector, but can anyone

> give me any advice on courses and qualifications that would look good

> on a c.v.

 

The courses you mentioned you are looking at seem to require BBB at A-level. If that's what you're realistically going to be capable of, you should forget the whole being-a-network-manager thing for the moment and concentrate on learning interesting stuff instead. Network management is the dull, tedious stuff that gets in the way of doing the interesting things that you learn about on a degree course. The job "network manager" might (hopefully) not be around in 10 years as people will have figured out how to get computers to just sort themselves out.

 

Personally, I'd go for that Staffs course - you can do an international placement (great fun, highly recommended), you can elect for a masters, and they actually encourage you to clear off for a year half-way through the course and start your own business. How cool is that?

 

> I have been self teaching myself about group policy, AD, profile

> setups etc. myself, but was wondering what else I would need that

> would be recognised by the industry

 

Why bother? You can pick that stuff up at the end of your degree if you like, or you might find yourself doing something more interesting.

 

Go read the current "Talk at Yale" postings up on http://www.joelonsoftware.com for the above sentiments written by someone more eloquent than me.

 

--

David Hicks

[localzuk]

The way I got into this was to do a BSc Computing degree, and work part time for the IT support department at the uni and running my own web design/hosting business on the side. These, combined with my having ran a Windows network (ie. designed, built and maintained entirely by me) when I was at school (unlikely for anyone to do this now due to the formal nature of ICT in schools) landed me my NM job as my first role.

 

The best way of gaining experience is to do a degree and work part time/do a degree with a sandwich year.

[DMcCoy]

The way I got into this was to do a BSc Computing degree, and work part time for the IT support department at the uni and running my own web design/hosting business on the side. These, combined with my having ran a Windows network (ie. designed, built and maintained entirely by me) when I was at school (unlikely for anyone to do this now due to the formal nature of ICT in schools) landed me my NM job as my first role.

 

The best way of gaining experience is to do a degree and work part time/do a degree with a sandwich year.

 

I did the same, with more maths (BSc computer science )

 

I took year out working at my old school, started as a science tech for a week then moved onto IT for the rest of the year. Then I did my first two years at uni, spent the 3rd year placement at another school and did one day a week there duing my final year. When I finished the NM position came up at the placement school and I started the day after my last exam. That was nearly 5 years ago now - how time wizzes by!

[djm968]

Indeed - it's hard to win!

 

You can't get the experience if you're getting the qualifications, and you can't get the qualifications as easily if you're getting the experience.

 

Along with this, it's hard to get the experience even with the qualifications because they then want to employ someone with experience!

 

It's a catch 22!

 

True Mr Plock, however you are the exception to that rule. I know your ability and I would rather leave you holding my server shaped baby than someone who has an MCSE and no experience.

 

The injustice is that Mr MCSE can charge £500per day to baby sit without experience and you my friend wouldn’t even be asked to change its nappy.

 

And this is often the result!

 

http://edugeek.net/index.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=13636

 

How’s it going down there in Reading by the way!

[strawberry]

TBH do whatever you like at uni mate, just pick the right one. Once into uni you'll be able to change courses fairly easily and most courses are modular.

 

once you graduate (or come close to it) if you want to become a tech then your best bet is to look at the a+, n+ then mcp's to become a mcsa. Then get a decent job , dont worry to much about pay, but make sure the training and development is there.

[djm968]

> Why bother? You can pick that stuff up at the end of your degree if you like, or you might find yourself doing something more interesting.

David Hicks

 

Because.... after 4 years of his life bumming around and he will probably end up teaching!

 

Within four years he could have done an MCSE a CCNA and if necessary complete an OU degree after and be earing more than the SLT.

[dhicks]

> Within four years he could have done an MCSE a CCNA and if

> necessary complete an OU degree after and be earing more

> than the SLT.

 

Yes, but it's worth trying to encourage a 17/18 year old to aim for a career more interesting than fixing someone else's problems all day. Judging by the courses s/he is thinking of doing they're fairly bright, and after doing a decent degree they should have many more interesting options open to them.

 

I heartily agree with the OU idea, by the way - a good way to avoid the whole student debt thing would be to sign up for an OU course and work part time (okay, something like a network manager position would probably be ideal) whilst completing the degree.

 

--

David Hicks

[djm968]

>

 

Yes, but it's worth trying to encourage a 17/18 year old to aim for a career more interesting than fixing someone else's problems all day.

 

I think you may have missed the point. I would encourage anyone into an IT career, and I agree; educated to degree level you have more chance of an IT career where you employ people to “fix someone else's problems all day”

 

However, you will need professional qualifications also if you are aiming for an IT career in the Private Sector.

[Joedetic]

Sorry, I've not read what other people are saying because originofsymmetry has listed my degree at my university as the first in his list so i skipped to the bottom

 

If you come to Staffordshire uni and you do decide to do the network eng course you'll do your CCNA, Cisco fundamentals of network security, Cisco IP Telephony and I /think/ you do your CCNP too. I know I start mine at the end of this year (my second year).

 

There is a fair bit of maths content, not too much programming, there's some C in the first year and some shell scripting but that's about it, you'll get to use some industry standard engineering software like Matlab, Maple, Multisim, Pro Engineer for CAD work.

 

The Cisco labs are awesome. A good number of IP phones have just been bought along with some PoE gigabit switches, we've got lots of pretty routers and the network security rack has recently been expanded too.

 

 

Also, if you want to crack your way into industry the industrial placement year, whilst optional, is a great way to do this. I'm applying for placements in the industrial sector at the moment and the uni placements team can help you with this when the time comes.

[localzuk]

I did the same, with more maths (BSc computer science )

 

I use Computing and Computer Science interchangeably - as most universities do too... Eg. Lancaster University uses both Computing and Computer Science to describe their course (or they did when I took it). And I hate maths!

[plock]

True Mr Plock, however you are the exception to that rule. I know your ability and I would rather leave you holding my server shaped baby than someone who has an MCSE and no experience.

 

The injustice is that Mr MCSE can charge £500per day to baby sit without experience and you my friend wouldn’t even be asked to change its nappy.

 

And this is often the result!

 

http://edugeek.net/index.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=13636

 

How’s it going down there in Reading by the way!

 

Evening djm968!

 

I appreciate your compliments!

 

Reading is very well, along with myself! Indeed you're correct the MCSE is what you need... it's where I'm currently heading!

 

I plan to start it in the first holiday of 2008.

 

I did notice the other topic you pointed out, exactly what I thought!

 

How are you doing yourself? I'll try and call to catch up with you at some point shortly.

 

Cheers.

[originofsymmetry]

Thanks for all the info guys, really appreciated , I'm a guy btw . I must say I am rather attracted to the Staffordshire course, not just because it dabbles in a bit of everything, including an entrepenerual element which wouldb ecomplimented with my GCSE in Business Studies (B) - that would help at least a little.

Right now I'm re-writing my UCAS Personal Statement which I've been told that I should write in all I can do on Server so I'm putting in User management in AD, Group Policy, User Profiles and such.

 

As for the maths in the courses, the only part I couldn't grasp was algebra - that a concern?

 

As for the Software Engineering course that requires BB, I'm only doing 2 A Levels so it will require alot of work for me, and if I don't get the required grades, and I want to continue with that course, the foundatioin version is available at Belfast Metropolitan College, which would let me get to it aswell.

[Andi]

Fair play I wish I did that Staffordshire course instead of my HND Computing. Now I have to resort to home learning for my MCSE and CCNA whenever I can afford them (despite the promise of training from my employer).

[budgester]

Get a Linux machine setup on your home network, find an open source project your interested in and contribute to it.

 

Get the Linux machine interoperating with you windows PC's setup network monitoring, run you own website from home, preferably with a database backend. Configure an email system, sniff your network with ethereal.

 

Learn a language, php, python, perl, java.

 

Read http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html

 

But the main thing is learn *nix, it's been around for 30 years and will be around for another 30.

 

My current bugbear is that I learn't DOS, then Windows 3.1, then Windows 95, then 98, NT, 2000, 2003, XP, and now I have to upgrade my knowledge to Vista, to be honest I'm pretty bored of my knowledge of MS stuff going obsolete. So *nix for me all all the way.

 

That

[plock]

Fair play I wish I did that Staffordshire course instead of my HND Computing. Now I have to resort to home learning for my MCSE and CCNA whenever I can afford them (despite the promise of training from my employer).

 

I have the same promise from my current employer; I'm pushing to get going in the first holiday of next year!

 

Let’s hope they keep their word!

[Joedetic]

Don't worry about the maths at staffs. I'm crap at maths...and when i say crap i mean...REALLY crap.

 

There are two options for first year maths. Fundamentals of Maths (or something like that) or "Quantitative Methods" in semester one and "Balancing maths" in semester two.

 

I did QM and BM which basically is targeted at anyone that's not done maths since GCSE as a way to get the first year maths requirement to go onto the second year. They're taught by Pat Lewis and the way she teaches them is really good and basically trickles the knowledge into your brain. (It helps that you've only got to maintain a 40% average in your first year to pass and that your first year doesn't count to your classification so you've just got to pass it).