[news] What planet is this guy on? cutting pensions

[LiamH]

BBC News - Lord Bichard: Retired people could work for pensions

 

Should be focusing on the people who actively try avoid getting jobs rather than those who have contributed there whole working life to the government only to be told they are now a "burden"

 

I'm worried now for my own future because if people like this get there own way there will probably be enforced euthanasia for people deemed too old to pay these idiots wages by the time im retiring

[witch]

Whilst I dont agree with this, there is a problem. There are two people in work for every one drawing a pension and currently 1 in 5 people under 30 will make it to 100. This means a huge amount of money paid out in pensions - the country is going to be hard pressed to afford it.

I think that the government pension scheme needs to attract the very best in investment managers because the more money they can make for the state pension pot the better

[X-13]

It's a shame this;

 

Retired people should be encouraged to do community work such as caring for the "very old" or face losing some of their pension, a peer has suggested.

 

wasn't followed by "He was promptly punched in the face."

[sonofsanta]

Retired people should be encouraged to do community work such as caring for the "very old"

 

Bit like the blind leading the blind, surely?

 

Yeah, he's an idiot, spouting ideas completely disconnected from reality. Bet he fits right in at the House of Lords.

 

He acknowledged it would be difficult for politicians to sell to the public, but added: "So was tuition fees."

And look how you've abused that system now.

[Easy_506]

"Retired people should be encouraged to do community work such as caring for the "very old" or face losing some of their pension, a peer has suggested."

 

Let's face it, this guy's the chairman of the national after-school film club and a life-long civil servant. He may be a peer, but his thoughts read like pie-in-the-sky brain-farts.

 

However, if for instance retirees were offered genuine rewards such as food and energy bill credits in exchange for community work, I think that would be a fair deal. It would certainly have to be voluntary, but not everyone who retires actually wants to stop, so surely it's better they have a choice in the matter rather than being consigned to the social/economic scrapheap.

[X-13]

However, if for instance retirees were offered genuine rewards such as food and energy bill credits in exchange for community work, I think that would be a fair deal.

 

IANAL, but I don't think you can refuse to feed someone unless they do "voluntary" work.

 

[Easy_506]

IANAL, but I don't think you can refuse to feed someone unless they do "voluntary" work.

 

 

Lol. We're not quite at the stage of lining up for bowls of rice from the back of a truck under the rule of a totalitarian government yet though. Retirees would still be able to use their own money wouldn't they. It wouldn't be refusing to feed them, or cutting off water/gas/electricity. It would be some sort of scheme on offer where retirees who CHOOSE to continue to contribute to society can do so, and in turn they'll be rewarded. If you retire and choose to just stop completely (or do your own thing) that's still your right, you just won't get any more perks than a standard pension - which as we all know is too low anyway and will continue to decrease due to increases in population and life-expectancy as Witch mentioned above.

[X-13]

Lol. We're not quite at the stage of lining up for bowls of rice from the back of a truck under the rule of a totalitarian government yet though.

 

Soon...

[Andrew_C]

It wouldn't be refusing to feed them, or cutting off water/gas/electricity.

Oh wouldn't it? Like it isn't the same as cutting off someone's benefits if they don't take unpaid work stacking shelves for the MegaRich supermarkets? This has the benefit of removing REAL jobs, with employment protection at the same time?

[X-13]

Like it isn't the same as cutting off someone's benefits if they don't take unpaid work stacking shelves for the MegaRich supermarkets?

 

Happened to me... It's not cool.

 

Plus, they wouldn't let me slack off. Even though I was waiting for September; when I was supposed to start work. [it was late August.]

 

 

IIRC, the also sent someone on one of those pathetic courses who was due to start work the next week.

[AMLinington]

ARGHHHHHHHHH this country is going to the dogs. We have a bunch of useless wasters whose sole aim in life is to 'get preggers and get a flat on the social', a state pension that cannot cover even the most basic of living expenses and human rights, a health service so mired in red tape and bureaucracy that people wait months for vital appointments, cannot get access to their GP, die in filthy, squalid conditions of neglect, abuse or incompetance, a police force so similarly mired, that they don't even have an officer to send when a person actually stands at their window WATCHING a group of lads breaking into cars, an education system that is out of date with the needs of todays society... need I go on?

 

A person works their whole life, paying tax and national insurance, then the government wants them to be forced to work? Are they having a laugh? If a person was still capable of working they would be! Perhaps this peer also has plans to address the discrimination against older applicants?

 

We have some in government that think that older people should 'step down' from jobs to allow young people to advance, and we have others that think the elderly should work until they die. No, what they WANT is for people to work their whole lives, paying extortionate taxes, then, when they are old, they should step down from the important jobs and give them up to the young, then go into a life of menial servitude doing menial tasks. No doubt they'd still have to pay tax on their meagre earnings!

 

Perhaps the government ought to get its own house in order before it starts holding people to ransom.

 

Or bring back the workhouse. All these spongers and wasters get to live in a large community where they are fed, housed and clothed to basic standards and where there is mandatory childcare, and where they must work or obtain marketable skills (practical, important jobs like plumbing, electric work, metalwork etc). If they then get a job 'outside' they can leave. Keep the men and women separate too - that should cut down on the number of girls whining about how they can't work because they have 10/15/20 kids to look after! FTR, before the flamers stoke up, this idea is no more ludicrous than forcing elderly people to look after other elderly people to earn enough credits to heat their homes now is it? It is, of course, an extreme example, but are we not, after all, discussing extreme and inappropriate suggestions?

[aerospacemango]

ARGHHHHHHHHH this country is going to the dogs. We have a bunch of useless wasters whose sole aim in life is to 'get preggers and get a flat on the social', a state pension that cannot cover even the most basic of living expenses and human rights, a health service so mired in red tape and bureaucracy that people wait months for vital appointments, cannot get access to their GP, die in filthy, squalid conditions of neglect, abuse or incompetance, a police force so similarly mired, that they don't even have an officer to send when a person actually stands at their window WATCHING a group of lads breaking into cars, an education system that is out of date with the needs of todays society... need I go on?

 

A person works their whole life, paying tax and national insurance, then the government wants them to be forced to work? Are they having a laugh? If a person was still capable of working they would be! Perhaps this peer also has plans to address the discrimination against older applicants?

 

We have some in government that think that older people should 'step down' from jobs to allow young people to advance, and we have others that think the elderly should work until they die. No, what they WANT is for people to work their whole lives, paying extortionate taxes, then, when they are old, they should step down from the important jobs and give them up to the young, then go into a life of menial servitude doing menial tasks. No doubt they'd still have to pay tax on their meagre earnings!

 

Perhaps the government ought to get its own house in order before it starts holding people to ransom.

 

Or bring back the workhouse. All these spongers and wasters get to live in a large community where they are fed, housed and clothed to basic standards and where there is mandatory childcare, and where they must work or obtain marketable skills (practical, important jobs like plumbing, electric work, metalwork etc). If they then get a job 'outside' they can leave. Keep the men and women separate too - that should cut down on the number of girls whining about how they can't work because they have 10/15/20 kids to look after! FTR, before the flamers stoke up, this idea is no more ludicrous than forcing elderly people to look after other elderly people to earn enough credits to heat their homes now is it? It is, of course, an extreme example, but are we not, after all, discussing extreme and inappropriate suggestions?

 

 

I'm not gonna flame that! That's a more sensible idea than anything the government has come up with!

 

And now, after this, I retire from this thread as the whole idea of what this Tory Peer is saying is enough to make my blood boil and my eyes pop out of my head. Doubless some toryboy/girl will come on to defend his idea....

[X-13]

FTR, before the flamers stoke up, this idea is no more ludicrous than forcing elderly people to look after other elderly people to earn enough credits to heat their homes now is it?

 

Ludicrous?! I was about to vote for you to become PM based on that alone.

[LiamH]

I'm not gonna flame that! That's a more sensible idea than anything the government has come up with!

 

And now, after this, I retire from this thread as the whole idea of what this Tory Peer is saying is enough to make my blood boil and my eyes pop out of my head. Doubless some toryboy/girl will come on to defend his idea....

 

 

He's a labor peer...

[X-13]

He's a labor peer...

 

Stupid is stupid.

 

It isn't aligned with one side or the other.

[LiamH]

Stupid is stupid.

 

It isn't aligned with one side or the other.

 

I know, just pointing it out before the party bashing begins and things get off topic.

 

A quick look says he is a crossbencher having worked for both parties, originally Tory then Labor for most of his time. he is clearly a fully pledged idiot though

[featured_spectre]

ARGHHHHHHHHH this country is going to the dogs. We have a bunch of useless wasters whose sole aim in life is to 'get preggers and get a flat on the social'

Especially in my area! I think the social workers said 1 in 3 girls under 16 has a child in my county.

 

a state pension that cannot cover even the most basic of living expenses and human rights

State pensions were never going to be great, but in this country it is warped, those that have never paid in get more, compared to those that have paid in. Countries like Germany, Holland, Sweden etc you cannot draw out more than you paid in. To me, this is a fair system.

 

a health service so mired in red tape and bureaucracy that people wait months for vital appointments, cannot get access to their GP, die in filthy, squalid conditions of neglect, abuse or incompetance

I must be relatively lucky, I see my GP the same day I make an appointment or if I make one online, within 3 days, my hospital visits are around 3 month turnaround except in an emergency (when the Dr thought I had a tumour I was seen within 5 hours)

 

a police force so similarly mired, that they don't even have an officer to send when a person actually stands at their window WATCHING a group of lads breaking into cars

Health and safety is a big issue, however they respond quite well when I need them, just need to say certain keywords and they're there like lightning. EG Street robbery (rather than mugging), gang violence (rather than thugs attacking someone), this was told to me by a police officer and call centre worker.

 

an education system that is out of date with the needs of todays society... need I go on?

No argument there

[Andrew_C]

Especially in my area! I think the social workers said 1 in 3 girls under 16 has a child in my county.

Did Jimmy live there then?

[Easy_506]

Oh wouldn't it? Like it isn't the same as cutting off someone's benefits if they don't take unpaid work stacking shelves for the MegaRich supermarkets? This has the benefit of removing REAL jobs, with employment protection at the same time?

 

Didn't they scrap that scheme though? I'm no expert but i'm sure it raised all sorts of questions about human rights and whether or not the companies involved in the scheme were benefitting in some dodgy way...

[featured_spectre]

Did Jimmy live there then?

 

No. Its just a sad fact, and it should read 19, not 16...stupid typo!

[Michael]

It's not just this country, France are at it too! I think the bottom line is these people have paid into a pension pot in their working lifetime. It's incredibly unfair to then ask more of them. Elderly people should be given the choice to work, like there's an old chap near me who delivers papers - the point is he does it to keep active. Not because he hasn't a choice.

 

In France they're talking about elderly people who own their property 100% paying a new tax, despite the fact those people have worked hard and paid their taxes already.

 

It's these sort of policies and ideas that will drive revenue underground and the Governments will get nothing.

[AMLinington]

Especially in my area! I think the social workers said 1 in 3 girls under 16 has a child in my county.

 

 

State pensions were never going to be great, but in this country it is warped, those that have never paid in get more, compared to those that have paid in. Countries like Germany, Holland, Sweden etc you cannot draw out more than you paid in. To me, this is a fair system.

 

 

I must be relatively lucky, I see my GP the same day I make an appointment or if I make one online, within 3 days, my hospital visits are around 3 month turnaround except in an emergency (when the Dr thought I had a tumour I was seen within 5 hours)

 

 

Health and safety is a big issue, however they respond quite well when I need them, just need to say certain keywords and they're there like lightning. EG Street robbery (rather than mugging), gang violence (rather than thugs attacking someone), this was told to me by a police officer and call centre worker.

 

 

No argument there

 

To book an appointment at a reasonable time so that I don't get into trouble at work, the earliest I can get is 2 weeks and they book up so quickly you have to have 3 or 4 phones on constant redial to get through...

 

I agree that the state pension is warped - if you earn more, you pay more tax, so therefore you should get back what you pay in. Ultimately that means the people that earned more get higher pensions, but at least it is fair and proportionate!

 

Re: Police - a gang of youths was attempting to break into cars in our road. I stood there on the phone to the police control room telling them so. This was 2am. At 4am they phoned me and woke me up to tell me they didn't have someone available and were the group still there? I was tempted to retort with 'No, they've successfully stolen a car and gone joy riding.'

 

Ludicrous?! I was about to vote for you to become PM based on that alone.

 

LOL be careful what you wish for - totalitarianism FTW ;-P If I got into power I'd have to rebuild everything from the ground up. Health service, education, policing, law courts, social welfare (workhouses FTW)...

[X-13]

LOL be careful what you wish for - totalitarianism FTW ;-P If I got into power I'd have to rebuild everything from the ground up. Health service, education, policing, law courts, social welfare (workhouses FTW)...

 

Kneel before AMLightfoot.

[sted]

part of the problem with the stae pension is though that it was designed at a time where fewer people lived say 10 years past retirement and there was a higher percentage of workers to pensioners now the population is getting older and living longer what worked before needs to be changed wither people have to cough up more as a percentage of their wage/get less pention/work longer there is only a finite pot of money

[pcstru]

Re: Police - a gang of youths was attempting to break into cars in our road. I stood there on the phone to the police control room telling them so. This was 2am. At 4am they phoned me and woke me up to tell me they didn't have someone available and were the group still there? I was tempted to retort with 'No, they've successfully stolen a car and gone joy riding.'

 

There was a report of an elderly woman having much the same experience when a bunch of youths breaking into her shed. After being told no one was available and watching the burglary continue, she phoned them back and said "Those burglars I told you about in my shed. No need to hurry, I've shot them all". Funnily enough, an Armed Response Unit and two plod cars were on the scene almost before she put the phone down. If you want action ...

 

(no, please don't try it, really).