Excellent tech support conversation I had today / getting Kies to work

[theriver]

I've a new Samsung phone. I run my life in Outlook so the first thing I did, apart from change the ringtone to

, obviously, was to install Kies to sync the two. Now, I suspect that they’ve attempted some marketing nonsense here and that that should rhyme with ‘keys’ (the icon looks a bit like a keyhole), but I’ve today repeatedly embarrassed myself by making it sound like ‘pies’, which frankly it deserves.

 

Problem? Doesn’t recognise the phone, claiming that it’s not compatible ("This device is not supported by Kies 2.0") – this despite having installed the latest version from their website.

 

Because I am a good boy I run as a standard user, so I tried logging in as Administrator and lo! it works, recognising the phone with no problems. Had a quick go as my standard user with procmon, loads of ‘access denied’ on various HKLM keys. Oh look, it’s 2001 again.

 

So, just for fun and to register my annoyance, I phoned the tech support line at my mobile provider - and had a conversation along these lines:

 

Me: Hello, I’m blah blah blah, and it’s behaving like blah blah.

 

Tim: Yep, all programs are like that.

 

Me: Sorry?

 

Tim: Any program, if you install it as Administrator you can’t use it with a guest account.

 

Me: [wondering if I’ve slipped into some alternate reality] Erm . . . can you say that again?

 

Tim: If you install a program as ‘Administrator’, you have to use it as Administrator, you can’t use it with another user.

 

Me: [Where now? Benefit of the doubt . . . .] Well, I am not sure that’s the case . . . for example I’ve just installed Microsoft Office on this computer, as Administrator, and I can use my normal user account to run Word

 

Tim: Yeah, that’s right, but that’s made by Microsoft. Microsoft let you do that, but you can’t do that with 3rd party applications.

 

And so on. I wondered where to go from here, and plumped for the ‘life is too short’ option – polite acceptance and hung up.

 

I then did the sensible thing of course, which was to promote my account to admin, run Kies once, then demote the account, and now it works fine.

 

But, honestly!

[wizzard]

Methinks Tim needs some re-training.

[elsiegee40]

Sometimes you lose the will to live!

[SYNACK]

Slight rewrite

 

Sometimes you lose the will to let developers live!

[sted]

kies is one of the worst bits of software ever

 

1st back up outlook it managed to wipe my outlook calendar syncing it

 

2nd how bigs your sd card kies wont find my phone with my 16gb in but works happily with the 2/4 (cant remember which) it came with

 

you would probably be beter off looking into geting your outlook synced with google mail/callendar then it will do it automatically to the phone (assuming its android)

[Domino]

kies is one of the worst bits of software ever

 

1st back up outlook it managed to wipe my outlook calendar syncing it

 

2nd how bigs your sd card kies wont find my phone with my 16gb in but works happily with the 2/4 (cant remember which) it came with

 

you would probably be beter off looking into geting your outlook synced with google mail/callendar then it will do it automatically to the phone (assuming its android)

 

Or if you're using an exchange server just sync that with the phone, removing the need for kies.

[HaleStorm]

i once had a Sky Support person try to tell that my internet was dropping because the Yellow Cat5 cable in the box with the router was a completley different kind of cable to the cat5 i had run from my attic to the living room...when i asked him how it was different he told me something about the "molex connectors" on the ends being wired up differently, so when i answered with "molex connectors are the 4pin connectors on a computers internal power supply" he passed me on to 2nd line support who sorted my problem but resetting my phone line attenuation

[plexer]

so when i answered with "molex connectors are the 4pin connectors on a computers internal power supply" he passed me on to 2nd line support who sorted my problem but resetting my phone line attenuation

 

Well to be truley accurate the 4 pin power supply connectors are a molex product.

 

Molex is a manfacturer of hundreds of different types of connector.

 

Ben

[joe90bass]

The best conversation I had was with AOL support. A colleague was having a problem with his home broadband so I took a look, when on the phone the AOL tech guy asked what network card the PC had, when I said a Realtek 8139 (pretty sure it was that model!) he said we don't support that. I politely pointed out that it was a rather common onboard NIC.... He then agreed to continue with the diagnostics!

[Hightower]

Our guttering came down in January and moved the Sky dish on the way down. We phoned up and an engineer came out, but his battery on his gadget had run out so said he would do it using the signal thingy on the TV. He got it going again, even though the signal was barely over half. We accepted this however as it seemed fine, until we had some bad weather when we would lose the signal. Anyhow, we weren't fussed enough until Sunday when we lost the signal for ages due to a thunder storm, so I decided to phone up to try and get another engineer to do the job properly this time.

 

The guy on the phone (not English) ran through a load of troubleshooting tasks taking about 10 minutes, and at the end asked if it was working. I said "yes, but it's been working the whole conversation with you (as previously said numerous times) - it only goes off in bad weather" to which he replied "so it's working, is there anything else I can help you with?" It was obvious he was reading line for line from a script, and I couldn't be bothered - including waiting in a queue I'd been on the phone for 20 minutes and was no further forward.

 

I decided to hang up, call back and try a new tact which went something like this:

 

Me: "Yesterday next door took some scaffolding down and I think they must have knocked the Sky dish as we have no signal now. It was working fine before that"

Scottish Lady: "No problem, we'll arrange for an engineer visit as your box is still under warranty"

 

Easy as that the second time, but it makes you wonder how a) these people (from the 1st call) have jobs as surely they are counter productive? and b) how people with no technical knowledge at all get any problems they encounter resolved.

[SteveBentley]

I was once told by tech support for a wireless card that turning off encryption made the packets "lighter" so they could travel further. And Virgin Media told me that being able to access a website via its IP address proved my theory that their DNS service wasn't behaving was wrong.

[wizzard]

I was once told by tech support for a wireless card that turning off encryption made the packets "lighter" so they could travel further. And Virgin Media told me that being able to access a website via its IP address proved my theory that their DNS service wasn't behaving was wrong.

 

Hmm never heard of "feather" packets before

 

Really some people they hire as tech support in some places beggars belief.

[Domino]

Hmm never heard of "feather" packets before

 

 

No?

 

RFC 2549 - IP over Avian Carriers with Quality of Service (RFC2549)

[wizzard]

I never knew that

 

RFCs are great

[Mako]

Not quite tech support, but retentions for ISPs are fantastic.

 

I used to be with Orange, which I signed up to be upgraded to 2mb broadband back in... 04, I think. Got a lovely little USB ADSL modem, all was sweet. Until a couple of years ago, where the speed would drop. Where it could cut out, sometimes up to 24 hours. One month I got slapped with a letter for allegedly going over their "fair use policy" and that they were slapping a cap on me until my downloading dropped, according to their letter I downloaded 8.01 gb in a month during peak hours, I believe their "policy" was for 8gb during peak hours. There was no warning, no phone call or advance notice, just a straight, rude letter.

 

At that point I'd had enough. I wasn't getting my 2mb, it was cutting out and my neighbours were getting 8mb. BT had offered me a sweet deal, so off I call to get my MAC code. I got put onto retentions, where the guy blamed everything including the dog (well, not really) as reasons for dropping speed and connection, and he assured me it would be the same under BT.

 

• He said that internal electrics are a major factor - Our phone socket is right by the front door, I sincerely doubt its affected by electrical cables in the walls. I admit its not immune, but still... come on.
  
• Its likely my house is very old and the wiring was not done properly - Nice random stab at blaming the build quality of my house. My house is also fairly-recently built. We're not talking something from the 50's here.
  
• That I'm probably miles from the exchange and my speed is low to due the length of the line - Again, a nice guess. The exchange is literally behind me. For added confirmation my new BT home hub shows my line attenuation as around 0.2 dB. Can you GET any closer?
  
• That the lines will be shared with others - A fair one, but honestly, I live in a small town, most of whom will not use the internet to download hundreds of gigs of movies. I never previously noticed a speed drop in all the previous years during peak hours. I doubt that the older generation suddenly began downloading Dr Who on the net, to the extent of dropping my speed to 256k.
  
• That all the lines are managed by BT, and that BT are probably not doing a good job due to the rural area I live - Again, the Exchange is behind me. And I frequently see BT vans there doing maintenance.
  
• The weather - self explanatory, cuts can happen during storms etc, but its not like I live in the tropics. A thunder storm happens now and then, and its an acceptable fact of life.
  
• He tried to blame the get-out clause of "speeds UP TO 8mb" (which was the package I was actually on), and that there is no guarantee. If I was receiving 2mb then that's what I'd get under any provider - I explained that the modem I had was ancient by now, and most people were on the Orange LiveHub (or whatever its called). I was assured that had nothing to do with it, and that I could only get 2mb. He stumbled when I said that BT quoted 6mb after a line test, and resorted to repeating himself.
  
• After exhausting all his ammunition, he resorted to blaming every provider for being liars, and that no matter what I'd get quoted by any company, that my service would be the same, and I'd hate it. He then offered a sweeter deal with Orange. It was not as good as my quote from BT. After explaining that to him, he gave up as he could not compete with BT's quote. At that self-realisation of defeat, he gave me my MAC code and I bid him a good day.
  

 

I signed up with BT. Got my new HomeHub 2.0 and guess what? I get 8mb (on good days), every other day I get 6mb as I was quoted, as confirmed by my own line tests.

edit: I was ranting on about how good BT was, I dont want to turn this post into a pro-company post.

 

But basically, guys on commercial support lines - monkeys.

Edited July 21, 2011 by Mako

[X-13]

Cool story, Bro.

 

It always makes me smile when a tech has to phone tech support. It usually shows just how little some of these people actually know.

[theriver]

@sted - this is on a new 16Gb phone, works well. That is to say, once I deselected the entire school diary and just sync'd my personal diary (oops). I did see references to a similar problem elsewhere so I don't think you're alone with this. Why not call your phone company? ;-)

 

@Domino - no Exchange here, sadly.

 

@X-13 - the feeling of dread and resignation as your hand lifts the receiver to call the number . . .

 

Will probably experiment with Google.

 

One thing that's come to light here over the last couple of months (there's been a crop of new phones here) is how painful syncing seems to have become. HTC and Samsung Android apps will sync with Outlook, but only contacts and diary, not tasks, and Windows Mobile now seems to want either OneNote or the cloud in order to do what the last version did using ActiveSync. Expected more by now . . . .

[sted]

@sted - this is on a new 16Gb phone, works well. That is to say, once I deselected the entire school diary and just sync'd my personal diary (oops). I did see references to a similar problem elsewhere so I don't think you're alone with this. Why not call your phone company? ;-)

 

 

because its a cheap payg android to replace a nokia thats still on contract till september i coudlnt live with any longer. ts not really an issue its quicker to take the card out and shove it in my pcs reader to write files to it adn i just use gmail/calendar now so no issues and never have to connect it to the pc (its also running a non stock rom these days to get android 2.2 nd havnt needed to try it since)

[GrumbleDook]

Educational ISP (not an RBC/LA) was bought up by successive companies and eventually was with a large business telco. We had a number of PI-IP addresses (3x /24 subnets ... long story) and one was not working ... and it was one we had a number of public servers on.

 

Me : Can I check that you are routing some IPs as we seem to have lost external access to some of servers?

ISP : I'm sorry but we don't do your DNS.

Me: I know ... we do, but our DNS is working and people outside say there is a black hole in your network where stuff is disappearing.

ISP : No, we have no problems at the moment.

Me : Can you see if you can trace to any of the following addresses? (give 4 example IPs)

ISP : Yes, I can see those fine.

Me : (looking at the firewall UI) Erm, how did you check?

ISP : I did an NSLookup and I get the following response (details of the lookup).

Me : But can you contact those IPs?

ISP : yes

Me : (looking at firewall UI) Really?

ISP : Oh yes.

Me : Can you try accessing this server then? (gives an example BBC IP)

ISP : Oh, but that is not yours though.

Me : But can you see it?

ISP : Yes, but it tells me it is the BBC.

Me : Can you read me the first few lines on the website then?

ISP : (reads the NSLookup response)

Me : Ah, perhaps we scan test something else. How about you type the following? (instructions on tracert)

ISP : Oh, that gives me some strange lines ... lots of stars.

Me : Oh, in that case your network must be broken somewhere. I might have broken it ... it would be best if you pass me onto someone in second line so I can apologise and get them to fix it.

ISP : And you are happy to say it was your fault?

Me : Oh yes ...

 

2nd line : What's this about you saying you have broken our network? Is this a wind up?

Me: (brief run down of previous conversation)

2nd Line : oh ***********

Me : Yes.

2nd Line : It looks like someone has screwed up and allocated your range to a MAN somewhere and there is a firewall that is blocking the tracert. One second.

Me : (listens to power ballads, singing along)

2nd Line : You know that we can here you singing and sometimes record the bad ones for a laugh?

Me : oh ... erm ... was it that bad?

2nd line : You are now track number 3 on our all time favourites.

Me : Bugger

2nd Line : yep, turns round one of bright spark engineers did a typo and has been trying to force your traffic to route to $LargeChemicalCompany over their private network. We'll clear it tonight and call in the morning.

Me: Thanks ...

 

(Next Day)

2nd Line : Seems to be sorted.

Me: yep, all happy now ... now, about that recording of me.

2nd Line : Email is on it's way ... we have added a backing track.

Me : So if I tried to blackmail you by complaining because you have numpty 1st line as well as one of your engineers made the cock-up in the first place?

2nd Line : What do you think?

 

So ... for all I know my dulcet tones are still part of the highlight of some engineer's day when listening back to how silly / stupid / dreadful some people sound when on the phone.

And yes, I still have a copy ... and no, I have never played it to anyone else or told them it exists ... and people will *never* hear it!

[SYNACK]

One thing that's come to light here over the last couple of months (there's been a crop of new phones here) is how painful syncing seems to have become. HTC and Samsung Android apps will sync with Outlook, but only contacts and diary, not tasks, and Windows Mobile now seems to want either OneNote or the cloud in order to do what the last version did using ActiveSync. Expected more by now . . . .

 

With all of the marketing departments, accountants and tech sheep screaming cloud at every possible opertunity what do you expect. We are just getting what the flock has been convinced it wants, how does it profit the big companies if you can do stuff yourself without having to go through them for everything.