LaTrustTec Posted March 28, 2011 Posted March 28, 2011 Hi all, We are looking for an alternative to MyMaths that is either web or app based for iPad that does not require Flash to run. We have a large number of iPads rolling out to students across several sites and will be looking to replace a lot of PC/Flash based software for use on the iPad. Any links would be useful. Thanks
rad Posted March 28, 2011 Posted March 28, 2011 Have you seen MangaHigh? Sorry don't have a license for it but did trial it last year.
LaTrustTec Posted March 30, 2011 Author Posted March 30, 2011 I had a look at Manga High and alas it is Flash. Doesn't seem to be much out there that can provide the teaching staff with the level of feedback that MyMaths can.
Butuz Posted March 30, 2011 Posted March 30, 2011 I think you may be better off finding some way to get flash working on the iPads (can you do that with Jailbreak??)rather than trying to get the whole Internet to stop using flash - which frankly isn't gonna happen. Butuz
LaTrustTec Posted March 30, 2011 Author Posted March 30, 2011 (edited) Jailbreaking iPads isn't an option when you are an Apple Trust. Just a note. Don't want this thread to become the usual situation when you mention you are looking for an alternative for Flash for iOS. Both sides of the argument are correct, wrong and largely driven by market choices. The web is ever evolving and thats the way it is, but I don't want to get into that here, thats far to larger subject and completely detracting from the answers I seek. Put Simply, I have to find alternatives to Flash be it app or web based, there is no other option. Edited March 30, 2011 by LaTrustTec spelling
teejay Posted March 30, 2011 Posted March 30, 2011 I would set up a server to run Citrix/Terminal services and allow the IPads to run sessions through that to access the flash based websites as I'm sure you're going to find more than just MyMaths that need flash.
dhicks Posted March 30, 2011 Posted March 30, 2011 will be looking to replace a lot of PC/Flash based software for use on the iPad. If the Flash objects used are small, one-lesson-sized games, could you write them lesson-by-lesson as needed as HTML / Javascript widgets? At the end of the process you would have a set of content that you could sell to other schools - instead of waiting for MyMaths to sort out the content you want, write your own and take their business.
Butuz Posted March 30, 2011 Posted March 30, 2011 Ok so you cant do the jailbreak. I guess you have two options. 1. use some kind of remote desktop / virtual desktop / virtual internet explorer 8 app deployment method (vmware, citrix etc?) 2. Put pressure on apple to enable the iPad to be far more educationally useful by allowing it to run flash? I would imagine as an Apple Trust you'd be in a better position to get your pressure noticed than most of us. I purchased my iPad knowing full well that it would not run flash. Did you know it woulldn't run flash when you bought yours?? Cheers Butuz
LaTrustTec Posted April 5, 2011 Author Posted April 5, 2011 We knew about the Flash issue from day 1 of the iPad but it is the device chosen as a 1to1 device for the students. Put pressure on Apple? can't see it making any difference. They do what they do.
LaTrustTec Posted April 5, 2011 Author Posted April 5, 2011 Would love to produce but they content they provide is massive and it would take years or a pool of developers to catch up with where they are. Their product covers secondary through to higher education levels and is an excellent feedback tool for assessment of the students progression - check the trial on MyMaths.co.uk - Bringing Maths Alive to see what its all about
LaTrustTec Posted April 5, 2011 Author Posted April 5, 2011 (edited) I see how running through Citrix etc would be possible internally but the students access this service (mymaths.co.uk) from home, another issue (1000 issues) if we went this route I'm sure but not saying its not possible. The iPads will be 1to1 devices so will go every where with the student. Edited April 5, 2011 by LaTrustTec additional text
Butuz Posted April 5, 2011 Posted April 5, 2011 Well to be honest I am not sure what else we can suggest. I think your in a difficult situation with no easy way out? Have you actually bought the 1000 iPads or are you still in the planning stage? Butuz
plexer Posted April 5, 2011 Posted April 5, 2011 hmm so one of your requirements is to access the largest maths education site in use but it needs flash. Your choosen device doesn't support flash. Looks like you chose the wrong device. Ben
LaTrustTec Posted April 5, 2011 Author Posted April 5, 2011 I didn't choose the device, its what we have to use as we are an APPLE TRUST! Please read the whole thread or just offer something that is constructive. The origin of this post is about finding an alternative app or site. We are looking at development but will not be able to start that until later in the year at the earliest.
dhicks Posted April 5, 2011 Posted April 5, 2011 Would love to produce but they content they provide is massive and it would take years or a pool of developers to catch up with where they are. Any idea what MyMath's plans are regarding Flash/iPads/etc? If their content doesn't work on the iPad then they're potentially missing out on a chunk of the market - have you been in contact with them to ask what their development plans are? Can they recompile their old Flash content with Adobe's new Flash-to-HTML tool? Development of new resources might be able to keep pace with lessons being taught if you had some sort of rapid application development tool. Flash is good, if the above-mentioned tool works, but I also seem to remember Matlab showing off a tool that let you devlope interactive mathematical widgets - I think the output might have been Flash again, but it might be worth checking out. I don't suppose Matlab do a version for the iPad?
plexer Posted April 5, 2011 Posted April 5, 2011 I didn't choose the device, its what we have to use as we are an APPLE TRUST! Please read the whole thread or just offer something that is constructive. The origin of this post is about finding an alternative app or site. We are looking at development but will not be able to start that until later in the year at the earliest. I did read it and yes you mentioned you are an apple trust but no mention that it had to be ipads actually. Ben
plexer Posted April 5, 2011 Posted April 5, 2011 Flash has become the defacto tech for interactive learning content and until html5 catches up it seems you're screwed unless there's an app for what you want. Ben
EduTech Posted April 5, 2011 Posted April 5, 2011 I did read it and yes you mentioned you are an apple trust but no mention that it had to be ipads actually. Ben Also, To be honest If you can't meet your requirements using APPLE Hardware/Software then I don't see a problem with you using another device. You may be an apple trust but if it's not meeting your needs then Bye Bye Apple and find another solution! I guess by saying you had to use them because your an Apple Trust, actually means you Had to use iPad's because you don't want to loose the Apple Trust Accreditation. I am sure no one forced you to buy them, it's just that you probably had no choice because you are an apple trust and you don't want to loose that. But to be honest mate if you are not able to do what you want because of the iPad's then not much good to you.. and therefore the Apple Hardware has failed and you will either have to look for another solution and when asked you can turn around and say well Apple, If you can fix my problem then we will use iPad's if not the BYE! But as others of said, on a serious note if you have no other option but to use iPad's then your pretty stuffed until Apple allow flash on there devices or/ as Plexer said until HTML5 catches up. I would try what 'dhicks' has suggested though and speak with MyMaths they may have a way around it.. who knows! but at least you have tried all avenues. James. P.S. I have Apple Items myself so this is nothing against Apple because I have there products, I just don't think you can ultimately said you HAD to use iPads.
LaTrustTec Posted April 6, 2011 Author Posted April 6, 2011 Any idea what MyMath's plans are regarding Flash/iPads/etc? If their content doesn't work on the iPad then they're potentially missing out on a chunk of the market - have you been in contact with them to ask what their development plans are? Can they recompile their old Flash content with Adobe's new Flash-to-HTML tool? Development of new resources might be able to keep pace with lessons being taught if you had some sort of rapid application development tool. Flash is good, if the above-mentioned tool works, but I also seem to remember Matlab showing off a tool that let you devlope interactive mathematical widgets - I think the output might have been Flash again, but it might be worth checking out. I don't suppose Matlab do a version for the iPad? We have spoken to MyMaths before putting this post up and they have no plan to redevelop any of their content to work with iPad/HTML5 due to the size of their development team. Which to be honest I can understand having worked in small development teams before but it is a bit short sighted. Out of all the companies I have spoken to so far they are the only one not planning alternative versions for non Flash devices. I have tried the HTML5 output from Flash with some mixed results, heavy 3D stuff not outputting brilliantly but the majority of stuff was OK. To be honest I think the MyMaths Flash files would output fine but as I say they don't even seem to want to look down that avenue. I will check the Matlab tools out to see if they can produce the goods for if we end up developing this ourselves.
Butuz Posted April 6, 2011 Posted April 6, 2011 I can't say I blame MyMaths to be honest. It's Apple's fault that they refuse to allow Flash to be available on the iPad. Apple are the ones depriving you of access to 90% of animated educational websites, no one else is to blame. It's apple you need to be speaking to and asking them why they have purposefully castrated the iPad so that it does not work with the majority of large educational websites such as MyMaths...... It's either that or Jailbreak the whole lot as I've said. I woudn't worry too much about the whole "Apple Trust" thing. It doesn't sound like being an Apple Trust is patricularly useful in your case. When you put your case studies out about how you were forced to Jailbreak a thousand ipads in order to make them educaitonally fit for purpose it will be apple that look stupid, not you (i can see the REgister headlines now). You'll look like a hero that overcame Steve Jobs massive and counter productive ego in order to simply help your kids learn! Butuz
localzuk Posted April 6, 2011 Posted April 6, 2011 I can see Apple's point. Flash is unnecessary now, as 'standard' web technologies can do everything it did, and Flash uses far too much processing power and battery power. Companies should be looking at creating a product that works on as many systems as possible - and the only way of doing that is using standards, not Flash. Any company that currently has an entirely Flash based portfolio of products and isn't investing in replacing that with non-flash technologies is shooting themselves in the foot.
Butuz Posted April 6, 2011 Posted April 6, 2011 I can see Apple's point. Flash is unnecessary now, You are entirely right. BUT why not give the user the choice of what web technology they use? Why not give the person that paid £300-£500 for the device in the first place the ability to run older web technologies if they NEED to for whatever reason??? The point is - Apple are dictating to YOU what YOU use in YOUR school with YOUR device that YOU paid good money for. Thats not how it's supposed to work, that's not the best thing for Apples customers, and this thread is conctrete proof of that. Butuz
localzuk Posted April 6, 2011 Posted April 6, 2011 You are entirely right. BUT why not give the user the choice of what web technology they use? Why not give the person that paid £300-£500 for the device in the first place the ability to run older web technologies if they NEED to for whatever reason??? The point is - Apple are dictating to YOU what YOU use in YOUR school with YOUR device that YOU paid good money for. Thats not how it's supposed to work, that's not the best thing for Apples customers, and this thread is conctrete proof of that. Butuz Look at it from Apple's point of view - more technologies usable on their platforms means more support requests. Apple have always been an 'end to end' systems provider. They spec every component themselves for their systems, and then design their OS around that. This increases software reliability and decreases support requests. If Apple supported Flash, what about Silverlight? Java ME? Shockwave? etc... Not to mention, people will still buy their products regardless of that lack of support. Me? I wouldn't buy an Apple phone or tablet, due to them not supporting the technology I want. But if you buy their product, knowing that support issue, and then complain that it doesn't support it, there is only one person to blame...
dhicks Posted April 6, 2011 Posted April 6, 2011 We have spoken to MyMaths before putting this post up and they have no plan to redevelop any of their content to work with iPad/HTML5 due to the size of their development team. Hmm - how small is their development team? Could a rival product be made by a distributed team - this is the twenty-first century and all, development can be done by individuals scattered around the globe, and maths strikes me as the kind of thing that can be split up into lesson-sized chunks quite well. If you're looking at developing your own solution, what sort of resources do you have avilable? I will check the Matlab tools out Sorry, I think I might have been thinking of Mathematica - I know I saw a demo of an output-to-Flash-widget at BETT a few years ago, I just can't remember exactly who from.
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