Students Personal Laptops

[cookie_monster]

Sorry but whats stopping students bringing in porno mags, cds and memory sticks full of videos, pictures etc?

 

Mags are not my department so if a parent complains I'm not accountable, we don't have CD drives

 

 

This is where some of my points about each school is different, some schools need locks everywhere. Our kids are generally good and alot of our college beliefs rely on equal value and trust. So why should the 98% of students be punished and their chances of being successful in life being reduced for those 2% of students who are bad?

 

I totally appreciate your point your school sounds very nice. I'm more interested in how your doing things and your oppinion than trying to trip you up honest.

 

 

 

As for Office formats, all our machines currently have all compat packs and Openoffice. its no different from today and it will be no different tomorrow. You'll always be in a situation where people have different software.

 

I'm interested. I've posted on here before about schools running Open Office but I've not found a site running OO. I'd love to run it accross the school, we have issues with SIMS requiring MS Office but I could run it on just staff PC's.

Do you run MS Office on all clients alongside Open Office so you don't have issues with OO docs not opening on clients with only MS Office on?

 

Care to post any comments here so as not to hijack the thread http://www.edugeek.net/forums/office-software/46004-running-ms-office-along-side-open-office.html#post421664

 

 

I'll invite you along when we open next year.

 

If I can get the go ahead i'll be there thanks.

Edited December 2, 2009 by cookie_monster

[DMcCoy]

The world is changing, We're a One School Pathfinder due to open next October and the network will be designed in a way to facilitate the use of personal devices. We believe that students should be allowed to use their own equipment(ie provide their own paper), if they can afford it, those that cant will be able to book a netbook on loan from our library. Luckily the majority of our students are in a position to have their own equipment.

 

Are you using any Microsoft servers or services? I'm currently reviewing our remote access before implementing terminal services for staff, but there are similar licensing issues.

 

Assuming MS software:

 

Do you license students per user, per machine or via external connector licenses for AD/Print/Internet/File/SQL etc services?

 

What about staff users if they bring things in? As staff are not covered by external connectors afaik as they are employees. We currently license most software via schools agreement, but this is only on a per device basis.

 

I assume staff/students do not have access to office (via TS or otherwise) from their personal machines due to the per machine licensing nature of office (it's always the biggest issue when we look at licensing). Add this to the fact that licenses must be the same (all vol enterprise or WAH/HUP extensions of the same license).

 

Are students expected to use their machines or other small portable devices such as netbooks for more than a few short sessions during the day? I have some concerns on the small screen and KB sizes from nebtbooks causing issues during long term use (we already have some users who now have fixed machines due to this).

 

I'm just curious, and it is perhaps a little harsh to suggest that people not doing all these things are somehow resistant to change, you'd be surprised at what some have to cope with. We for example spend an additional £130 when we buy every machine to put it in a metal case (the secure-in-one) to stop them being destroyed within the first term, although most rooms are much improved now.

[torledo]

I'm just curious, and it is perhaps a little harsh to suggest that people not doing all these things are somehow resistant to change, you'd be surprised at what some have to cope with. We for example spend an additional £130 when we buy every machine to put it in a metal case (the secure-in-one) to stop them being destroyed within the first term, although most rooms are much improved now.

 

see, that's where you went wrong. You should have bought 400 £130 netbooks, and if/when a kid

breaks one you allow them to bring in their own paper.

[cookie_monster]

Are you using any Microsoft servers or services? I'm currently reviewing our remote access before implementing terminal services for staff, but there are similar licensing issues.

 

Assuming MS software:

 

Do you license students per user, per machine or via external connector licenses for AD/Print/Internet/File/SQL etc services?

 

What about staff users if they bring things in? As staff are not covered by external connectors afaik as they are employees. We currently license most software via schools agreement, but this is only on a per device basis.

 

I assume staff/students do not have access to office (via TS or otherwise) from their personal machines due to the per machine licensing nature of office (it's always the biggest issue when we look at licensing). Add this to the fact that licenses must be the same (all vol enterprise or WAH/HUP extensions of the same license).

 

Are students expected to use their machines or other small portable devices such as netbooks for more than a few short sessions during the day? I have some concerns on the small screen and KB sizes from nebtbooks causing issues during long term use (we already have some users who now have fixed machines due to this).

 

I'm just curious, and it is perhaps a little harsh to suggest that people not doing all these things are somehow resistant to change, you'd be surprised at what some have to cope with. We for example spend an additional £130 when we buy every machine to put it in a metal case (the secure-in-one) to stop them being destroyed within the first term, although most rooms are much improved now.

 

 

 

I’ll just add my 2 cents here if you don’t mind we’re currently using Citrix to deliver home desktops (Via Citrix Secure Gateway) and it’s been a revelation, it’s not a budget solution by and means but it’s very flexible and does allow us to make savings in other places e.g we can run lower spec desktops that also run linux or buy thin client devices with linux on board or Axel devices, Axels are very low power 7Watts in general use so that’s more savings again. Using Citrix of course means that we can support Linux, Windows and OSX at home which you cannot with TS.

 

Office licensing is a pain we currently make staff that use it sign in the AUP that they have a bought copy at home (I suspect some of them might have home which I don’t think they should) this is one reason that I’d like to go Open Office.

 

We are also using wireless netbooks at the moment (Stone NEO) the biggest issue with these (IMO) is the key size which students complain are too small to type properly on, I do find that the key size on my NC10 is much better as it supports nearly full size keys. This is a big factor to remember when buying netbooks.

I do feel that they’re a bit too small for use in the 6th form as they tend to need multiple windows and may use it for a few hours but in general research lessons students won’t use it for more than a hour at a time so they’re acceptable. The battery also lasts a long time so typically we can get almost a full day out of them most of the time.

[gill]

We allow students to bring in their own laptops however they are not permitted to connect to the network. They can have internet access through a separate wireless network which is password protected. Password is never given out to staff or students.

 

All students sign an AUP and anyone caught misbehaving would have internet access removed and told not to bring laptop into school. I thought of lots of reasons not to do this but so far it's worked quite well and the kids haven't abused it.

[featured_spectre]

Oh i forgot to say also. Staff love coming in with home scanners and home printers. They demand we install them for school use. Then we end up repairing them and having them electrical tested and so on and the user then takes it home afterwards and enjoys a new repaired PAT tested bit of kit at the schools expense.... noooo way.

 

Happens here, but I get them to sign that its donated to the school and removal of the equipment at any point constitutes theft, they soon change their mind.

 

As for the laptop issue, no no no no no. No home laptops allowed on at all, have it so you have to manually assign an IP when plugged in to the network. And Ruckus guest access would be perfect for you, so go buy ruckus!

[Cools]

heres one i would do..

 

Unplug all non used wall sockes at the cab. and Fix up address for all pc's needing a socket in a (e.g 10.1 range), vlan the wifi to have DHCP (e.g 10.3 range) on it.. allow that over the secure Wifi..

[ryxin]

What if some students has no personal laptop? Would the teacher will put them a pressure to have their laptop?..You know not all students can afford to have own laptop..Its quite expensive..

[GrumbleDook]

I'm presently looking into this as an advice piece to our schools and would like to talk to anyone already doing it.

 

At the moment I can see two areas that I have to cover, technical and policies.

 

Technically there are a variety of solutions out there and whilst we do not promote any given solution or supplier to our schools (unless done as tender / contract) I can give advice on good practice from others. So, the wider range of options the better. Technologies such as 802.1x; checking for patches, A/V, etc before allowing connection; segregation / VLANs; etc seem to be the most common things to be covered.

 

With policies I need to cover areas such as DPA, safeguarding, classroom management, security of the network, provision of laptops or mobile devices, etc.

 

Please PM me if possible.

[cookie_monster]

What if some students has no personal laptop? Would the teacher will put them a pressure to have their laptop?..You know not all students can afford to have own laptop..Its quite expensive..

 

 

Yes when we've suggested this arrangement in the past we were told it's an inclusive school not exclusive. I think things are changing though....

[cookie_monster]

I'm presently looking into this as an advice piece to our schools and would like to talk to anyone already doing it.

 

At the moment I can see two areas that I have to cover, technical and policies.

 

Technically there are a variety of solutions out there and whilst we do not promote any given solution or supplier to our schools (unless done as tender / contract) I can give advice on good practice from others. So, the wider range of options the better. Technologies such as 802.1x; checking for patches, A/V, etc before allowing connection; segregation / VLANs; etc seem to be the most common things to be covered.

 

With policies I need to cover areas such as DPA, safeguarding, classroom management, security of the network, provision of laptops or mobile devices, etc.

 

Please PM me if possible.

 

 

 

Next month we are going to be installing a new switch so we can VLAN the network, at the same time we're rolling out a managed wireless system that will allow different ssid's to operate in different VLAN's. The hope is that we can have a key for students that will give them access to the internet through our Smoothwall but they will not be able to see the rest of the network. We may then start to look at NAP solutions but we might also think about allowing access through TS/Citrix so the students laptops are never actually on the domain.

 

Now to get to work on policy a new thread on this part might be handy do you think?

[broc]

I'm presently looking into this as an advice piece to our schools and would like to talk to anyone already doing it.

 

At the moment I can see two areas that I have to cover, technical and policies.

 

Technically there are a variety of solutions out there and whilst we do not promote any given solution or supplier to our schools (unless done as tender / contract) I can give advice on good practice from others. So, the wider range of options the better. Technologies such as 802.1x; checking for patches, A/V, etc before allowing connection; segregation / VLANs; etc seem to be the most common things to be covered.

 

With policies I need to cover areas such as DPA, safeguarding, classroom management, security of the network, provision of laptops or mobile devices, etc.

 

Please PM me if possible.

 

You might want to also consider the physical implications of having large numbers of laptops in schools too, such as charging, secure storage during PE, break etc.

 

Even some brand new schools designed for very large numbers of mobile devices overlook these...... & then you end up with suggestions that laptop trolleys can be 'stored' in corridors.....

[cookie_monster]

You might want to also consider the physical implications of having large numbers of laptops in schools too, such as charging, secure storage during PE, break etc.

 

Even some brand new schools designed for very large numbers of mobile devices overlook these...... & then you end up with suggestions that laptop trolleys can be 'stored' in corridors.....

 

 

We've had faces pulled by the site manger about PAT testing units that come into school, of course if they bring in a fully charges netbook this might not be an issue but it's worth thinking about as a potential problem.

[maniac]

You might want to also consider the physical implications of having large numbers of laptops in schools too, such as charging, secure storage during PE, break etc.

 

Even some brand new schools designed for very large numbers of mobile devices overlook these...... & then you end up with suggestions that laptop trolleys can be 'stored' in corridors.....

 

Charging and storage are easy - every student has a secure locker with an 18v charging socket in - laptop can be stored and charged in these. There are many companies which make them.

 

Because the chargers are low voltage, it avoids problems with PAT testing, and leads are available to fit pretty much all the main stream brands of laptop, PDA etc. (In fact I think the outputs are normally the cigarette lighter type plug allowing all manner of chargers to be used, although I've not got to this stage of my research yet)

 

When we evetually go live with our new system to allow use ot student devices, which is in the pipeline, the access will be provided via a seperate network using a product such as http://www.itsltduk.co.uk/our_offerings/index.aspx?id=474 which can authenticate users against active directory and provide them with filtered controlled webaccess straight away - we would then offer a terminal server environment for students to connect to in order to use academy software.

 

for students that don't have their own device, each departemnt will still have a pool of machines available to loan out if necessary.

Edited February 24, 2010 by maniac

[Ric_]

... but we might also think about allowing access through TS/Citrix so the students laptops are never actually on the domain.

 

Should have that all set up by the end of the week... our sixth form pupils will be redirected to the Secure Gateway by the BlueSocket wireless and that's all they will have access to - no direct net connection via Smoothie and no access to resources direct from their machines.

 

The idea behind the above is that they can access resources with the 'consistent user experience' that they are used to in lessons and it means that we don't need to check for patch levels and AV.

[broc]

Charging and storage are easy - every student has a secure locker with an 18v charging socket in - laptop can be stored and charged in these. There are many companies which make them.

 

Because the chargers are low voltage, it avoids problems with PAT testing, and leads are available to fit pretty much all the main stream brands of laptop, PDA etc. (In fact I think the outputs are normally the cigarette lighter type plug allowing all manner of chargers to be used, although I've not got to this stage of my research yet)

 

When we evetually go live with our new system to allow use ot student devices, which is in the pipeline, the access will be provided via a seperate network using a product such as BWireless, Wi-Fi hotspot solution, managing a system of hotspots, ideal for schools, colleges and universities, wireless internet access which can authenticate users against active directory and provide them with filtered controlled webaccess straight away - we would then offer a terminal server environment for students to connect to in order to use academy software.

 

for students that don't have their own device, each departemnt will still have a pool of machines available to loan out if necessary.

 

Don't forget you have to have the physical space to install lockers... not all schools will. Do you insist every student uses the same brand of laptop so you can use the same charging lead, or does every student have to provide his own?

 

Also, what happens when the laptop battery goes flat in the middle of a lesson.... do you provide a power socket in the classroom for the student to use?

[plexer]

How does the "because the chargers are low voltage it avoids problems with pat testing" work if they plug into the mains they need testing.

 

Ben