[ms office - o365] Office 365 HELP

[DSAGEY]

Hi,

 

We currently have MS Office 2007 on our server that is forced out to all computers/users.

 

I'm looking to move away from Office 2007 to Office 365 - apon checking we have got Office 365 A1 Plus for students (Desktop version) that we can download for free with our MS account. I was wondering if anyone knew whether you have to sign into MS to use 365. The children do no have a MS account neither do staff as we use Google. Ideally I don't want anyone have to login to Office 365 to use the desktop apps, is there a way of setting this up so they don't need to login to it.

 

Our server (Miscrosoft Windows Server 2008) our users login as firstname.lastname then a password - we are on Windows 10. Like I have already mentioned they do not have MS accounts.

 

I saw this on the Administrative templates for Office 365 (a Excel file that tells you all the policies etc that is included in the template download) It states:

 

This policy setting controls whether users can provide credentials to Office using either their Microsoft Account or the user ID assigned by your organization for accessing Office 365.If you enable this policy setting, you can specify one of the following options:- If you select "Both IDs allowed", users can sign in and access Office content by using either ID- If you select "Microsoft Account only", users can sign in only by using their Microsoft Account.- If you select "Organization only", users can sign in only by using the user ID assigned by your organization for accessing Office 365.- If you select "None allowed", users cannot sign in by using either ID.If you disable or do not configure this policy setting, users can sign in by using either ID.Note: This policy does not apply to licensing. A user can license their product using any applicable ID if they have a valid license associated with that account. Providing credentials for licensing purposes when that ID type has been disabled, however, will not affect the signed in state of Office.

 

Does this mean that it can be setup on the server so they don't need to login to Office 365?

 

Thanks in advance.

[RobFuller]

Hi,

 

We currently have MS Office 2007 on our server that is forced out to all computers/users.

 

I'm looking to move away from Office 2007 to Office 365 - apon checking we have got Office 365 A1 Plus for students (Desktop version) that we can download for free with our MS account. I was wondering if anyone knew whether you have to sign into MS to use 365. The children do no have a MS account neither do staff as we use Google. Ideally I don't want anyone have to login to Office 365 to use the desktop apps, is there a way of setting this up so they don't need to login to it.

 

Our server (Miscrosoft Windows Server 2008) our users login as firstname.lastname then a password - we are on Windows 10. Like I have already mentioned they do not have MS accounts.

 

I saw this on the Administrative templates for Office 365 (a Excel file that tells you all the policies etc that is included in the template download) It states:

 

This policy setting controls whether users can provide credentials to Office using either their Microsoft Account or the user ID assigned by your organization for accessing Office 365.If you enable this policy setting, you can specify one of the following options:- If you select "Both IDs allowed", users can sign in and access Office content by using either ID- If you select "Microsoft Account only", users can sign in only by using their Microsoft Account.- If you select "Organization only", users can sign in only by using the user ID assigned by your organization for accessing Office 365.- If you select "None allowed", users cannot sign in by using either ID.If you disable or do not configure this policy setting, users can sign in by using either ID.Note: This policy does not apply to licensing. A user can license their product using any applicable ID if they have a valid license associated with that account. Providing credentials for licensing purposes when that ID type has been disabled, however, will not affect the signed in state of Office.

 

Does this mean that it can be setup on the server so they don't need to login to Office 365?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Having just started our 'journey' with rolling out O365 desktop applications unfortunately the short answer is NO they will ALL need accounts (users and computers) in Office 365 and the correct licences available/applied. Perhaps have a look at this this thread for some interesting reading regarding licencing the applications http://www.edugeek.net/forums/office-software/194192-office-365-click-run-device-based-activation.html

 

Do you have access to Office 2019 in some way, as this might be a better fit for you for the time being if you don't want to spend the time setting up Azure AD Sync just for licensing Office would be a bit overkill.

[DSAGEY]

Having just started our 'journey' with rolling out O365 desktop applications unfortunately the short answer is NO they will ALL need accounts (users and computers) in Office 365 and the correct licences available/applied. Perhaps have a look at this this thread for some interesting reading regarding licencing the applications http://www.edugeek.net/forums/office-software/194192-office-365-click-run-device-based-activation.html

 

Do you have access to Office 2019 in some way, as this might be a better fit for you for the time being if you don't want to spend the time setting up Azure AD Sync just for licensing Office would be a bit overkill.

 

Thanks for the quick reply.

 

Are Microsoft actually joking! This is going to be a painful and long. We have just moved to G-Suite for our emails as the Headteacher liked the collabriation it had with editing the same file at same time as someone else & paid out £3000 to a Google Guru. But all staff and pupils still use MS Office. Now I'm going to have to speak to the new Headteacher about moving back to MS.

 

No we don't have acess to Office 2019. Not likley to if it needs paying for.

[Ditto]

Thanks for the quick reply.

 

Are Microsoft actually joking! This is going to be a painful and long. We have just moved to G-Suite for our emails as the Headteacher liked the collabriation it had with editing the same file at same time as someone else & paid out £3000 to a Google Guru. But all staff and pupils still use MS Office. Now I'm going to have to speak to the new Headteacher about moving back to MS.

 

No we don't have acess to Office 2019. Not likley to if it needs paying for.

 

I've just read the thread @RobFuller mentioned. This is ludicrous! You're a school willing to pay for licensed use of software and to run it in a perfectly reasonable way. The staggering lengths you appear to have to go to are beyond belief. Personally I'd be advising your head to ditch the Office software and complement the move to Gmail and fully switch to G Suite for Apps.

[Steve21]

This is ludicrous! You're a school willing to pay for licensed use of software and to run it in a perfectly reasonable way.

 

Not really sure that's a fair comparison. Using the free school licenses to install o365 as a local desktop client isn't paid for software, and isn't the same as just using a cloud based suite (The same which can also apply from Microsoft).

 

If they're paying for software they'd be covered to use Office 2019 under their EES and there isn't any need to then use user based licenses.

 

Basically leads to a few options:

 

1) Use either o365 or GSuite online for free (no costs needed or software installed locally)

2) Pay for Office under your normal MS agreements and install it (2019) locally without any requirements to use user/device based licenses

3) Setup o365 desktop software free, using user/device based licenses

 

Not really sure what bit you're applying the "ludicrous" aspect to?

 

Steve

[free780]

The irony.

editing the same file at same time as someone else.

This is possible with Office 365. Basically with cloud platforms you need to be all in. So either pay for Office 2019 prepetual or setup AD Connect and seamless SSO. Adobe have also gone down the 'you need to provision all users'. I'm not sure if you use Gsuite for SSO to authenticate against Office 365, you can do it the other way. You'll still need to provision users via AD Connect.

[Ditto]

Not really sure what bit you're applying the "ludicrous" aspect to?

Steve

Simply the amount of effort to get the software working based on the OP simple scenario.

Edited August 31, 2019 by Ditto

[Steve21]

Simply the amount of effort to get the software working based on the OP simple scenario.

 

Again not sure how that's MS fault though... Whether they're paying for Office licensing, or using a free version is the schools choice. If they're picking the free version while spending money on Google Guru's that's not a MS vs Google issue that means you'd advise them to drop MS and move to Google when they still wouldn't actually be able to have the desktop software they wanted in their scenario?

 

They still won't have a desktop client installed if they move over to GSuite, so aren't in a different scenario from when they started. I understand it might be seen as ludicrous if GSuite offered a full desktop suite etc without the same issues, but it doesn't

 

OP can install AD Connect and get SSO working for shared/individual licenses as people mentioned above, yes it might take some effort but that's a one-time thing to continue working how they wanted rather than jumping ship etc

 

Steve

[robk]

Again not sure how that's MS fault though... Whether they're paying for Office licensing, or using a free version is the schools choice. If they're picking the free version while spending money on Google Guru's that's not a MS vs Google issue that means you'd advise them to drop MS and move to Google when they still wouldn't actually be able to have the desktop software they wanted in their scenario?

 

They still won't have a desktop client installed if they move over to GSuite, so aren't in a different scenario from when they started. I understand it might be seen as ludicrous if GSuite offered a full desktop suite etc without the same issues, but it doesn't [emoji14]

 

OP can install AD Connect and get SSO working for shared/individual licenses as people mentioned above, yes it might take some effort but that's a one-time thing to continue working how they wanted rather than jumping ship etc

 

Steve

I know you can make g-suite use office 365 password etc I believe you can do the reverse if the OP wants to manage things from g-suite.

 

That would then give Ms licences for office. Though don't know how sso etc would work.

[Steve21]

I know you can make g-suite use office 365 password etc I believe you can do the reverse if the OP wants to manage things from g-suite.

 

That would then give Ms licences for office. Though don't know how sso etc would work.

 

Aye you can do it in reverse (for the web apps 365) but not sure if that works with the desktop client as that'd still count as user based licensing, rather than device based licensing etc. Using SAML SSO and then configuring it in o365/AD etc (Maybe someone else could confirm?)

 

But really unless you're planning to actually use the MS accounts within the programs you'd be better off looking at the device-based licensing, then the requirement for using MS accounts is removed if they're sticking with GMail etc

 

Steve

[Ditto]

Again not sure how that's MS fault though... Whether they're paying for Office licensing, or using a free version is the schools choice. If they're picking the free version while spending money on Google Guru's that's not a MS vs Google issue that means you'd advise them to drop MS and move to Google when they still wouldn't actually be able to have the desktop software they wanted in their scenario?

They still won't have a desktop client installed if they move over to GSuite, so aren't in a different scenario from when they started. I understand it might be seen as ludicrous if GSuite offered a full desktop suite etc without the same issues, but it doesn't

OP can install AD Connect and get SSO working for shared/individual licenses as people mentioned above, yes it might take some effort but that's a one-time thing to continue working how they wanted rather than jumping ship etc

Steve

You'll see my 'ludicrous' statement follows reference to the other thread - it's 5 pages long. Let's put G Suite and licensing costs aside for one moment. To get back to the OP's original question, achieving what's wanted, to put it mildly, does not seem very straight-forward. In the OPs own words "Are Microsoft actually joking! This is going to be a painful and long". If MS are not responsible for the (perceived?) complexity of getting it up and running, I'm afraid I am at a loss as to who is.

[Steve21]

You'll see my 'ludicrous' statement follows reference to the other thread - it's 5 pages long. Let's put G Suite and licensing costs aside for one moment. To get back to the OP's original question, achieving what's wanted, to put it mildly, does not seem very straight-forward. In the OPs own words "Are Microsoft actually joking! This is going to be a painful and long". If MS are not responsible for the (perceived?) complexity of getting it up and running, I'm afraid I am at a loss as to who is.

 

In all fairness the answer was given on the thread to use user based licensing, the next 3 pages are related to using a non-supported device based method (It's only officially supported within US which is why it can take a long time getting licenses sorted from MS as you need to ensure they're activated through your reseller etc)

 

Which leads back to my previous:

 

1) Use either o365 or GSuite online for free (no costs needed or software installed locally)

2) Pay for Office under your normal MS agreements and install it (2019) locally without any requirements to use user/device based licenses

3) Setup o365 desktop software free, using user/device based licenses

 

Option 3 with DBA which is the end discussion within that thread is free/non-supported method which is why yes it can be harder to setup, but that refers back to my it's a choice of the school to pick that one?

 

But that's still getting off topic with the original question, that yes it is possible to set it up without requiring payment/manual signing in via AD/SSO and free licensing to give the full desktop option

 

Steve

[Ditto]

In all fairness the answer was given on the thread to use user based licensing, the next 3 pages are related to using a non-supported device based method (It's only officially supported within US which is why it can take a long time getting licenses sorted from MS as you need to ensure they're activated through your reseller etc)

Which leads back to my previous:

Option 3 with DBA which is the end discussion within that thread is free/non-supported method which is why yes it can be harder to setup, but that refers back to my it's a choice of the school to pick that one?

But that's still getting off topic with the original question, that yes it is possible to set it up without requiring payment/manual signing in via AD/SSO and free licensing to give the full desktop option

Steve

So to summarise, I think we see things slightly differently, but I'm all for a healthy debate on Edugeek . Ultimately, I will await feedback from @RPSHullbridge as to the outcome and conclusion.

[DSAGEY]

The school pays for MS Office 2007 (Curriculum network) and Office 2010 (Admin network). I want to ideally scrap paying for these and use Office 365 A1 Plus for students (Desktop version) that is linked with our Microsoft account that we get for free. We also have licenses within our MS account for the Online version too.

 

All we want to use it the desktop version, as staff still use MS Office and so do the pupils as Google Apps like Docs don't have the same features as MS Word. Children and staff (Curriculum network) login with their firstname.surname (this is not connected to any MS account), so atm with Office 2007 they don't need to sign in to any MS account to use it. But with Office 365 (desktop apps) you apparently have to login to MS to use it. I don't want to do this as this is just an extra step to get something to work. How can you expect a year 1 child to login to a computer to then have to sign into a MS account to use Word.

[Steve21]

What do you mean when you say the school is paying for 2007 etc? Did you buy it outright as a one off cost so you shouldn’t be paying anything now, Or are you paying for it annually via your MS licensing?

 

If you’re on annual licensing it’s free to upgrade to the latest version of it so you’d be able to use 2019 under your OVS

 

Feels like there’s something mixed up here

 

Steve

[sparkeh]

@RPSHullbridge Can I just clarify what licences you have and how you pay for them as I am bit confused by your description and how you have the A1 Plus licences?

 

1. The 365 A1 Plus licence is not free. You get this if you have the free A1 licence and licence The MSI version of Office via an OVS-ES agreement (this gives you the entitlement for the 365 ProPlus licence and MS nicely wrap this up into a new licence called A1 Plus).

 

2. If you use A1 Plus licence then you can just use Device Based Activation for the 365 ProPlus client (details available elsewhere on this site). No need for anyone to sign in to office. We use this and it works very nicely.

[DSAGEY]

What do you mean when you say the school is paying for 2007 etc? Did you buy it outright as a one off cost so you shouldn’t be paying anything now, Or are you paying for it annually via your MS licensing?

 

If you’re on annual licensing it’s free to upgrade to the latest version of it so you’d be able to use 2019 under your OVS

 

Feels like there’s something mixed up here

 

Steve

The school pays annually for 2007 and 2010 none of them were bought outright.

 

The problem I have is that nobody at the school seems to know anything about it. The school business manager only knows that we pay annually for both but has no clue what the login details are. I contacted Microsoft Volume Licesing but they can't help unless I know the license ID.

 

All this was setup way before I started at the school, the previous IT person knows none of the details either but she was lead to believe the Capita hold our volume licensing - but they say they don't. I don't seem to be able to get very far, I tried Ergo too who does our Curriculm server but they have nothing to do with our MS Office.

 

I don't understand how nobody knows these details. We are paying for it annually so they must know where the money is going surely.

[DSAGEY]

@RPSHullbridge Can I just clarify what licences you have and how you pay for them as I am bit confused by your description and how you have the A1 Plus licences?

 

1. The 365 A1 Plus licence is not free. You get this if you have the free A1 licence and licence The MSI version of Office via an OVS-ES agreement (this gives you the entitlement for the 365 ProPlus licence and MS nicely wrap this up into a new licence called A1 Plus).

 

2. If you use A1 Plus licence then you can just use Device Based Activation for the 365 ProPlus client (details available elsewhere on this site). No need for anyone to sign in to office. We use this and it works very nicely.

 

We have no payment cards or anything and we get invoices saying that we owe £0.00 each month or so.

 

This is what we have license wise.

[Roberto]

I’m not sure why you’re sinking so much effort into MS office if you’re a google apps school? This is practically begging to have a overly complex and fragile setup that guarantees you’ll See the worst of both products. For Lesson delivery at least you should be surely able to use gapps? This will mean you’re only juggling two platforms for just those who have no choice.

[Steve21]

If they’re paying annually you should have free upgrade rights to 2019 as you’re licensing office, not a specific version.

 

How did you upgrade to Windows 10? They’d need the same login details to get the ISOs and license keys etc that should allow you to check on office licenses.

 

You should also be able to find the license ID on any annual bill which finance should be able to dig out (alternatively check under the office install and see what it says it’s licensed to under the name as old installs will sometimes say RM etc)

 

Steve

[DSAGEY]

@Steve21 I'd have to check about the license ID, I'll definatly get the finance manager to look through - the previous IT technician never bothered and has stuck with MS 2007 since the school last had an server upgrade back in 2010. If the finance manager can't find it on an invoice I can check it from the server \\SERVERNAME\Software\SoftareDistrabution\ and then there should be a file that has the license ID? I'm going to check the files tomorrow and hopefully the file is there what I need.

 

I upgraded using the Windows 10 installation media (I spoke to MS before doing it only because I was lead to believe that W10 wasn't free anymore. But they said if you have W7 Pro or W8/8.1 Pro you could still upgrade for free.)

 

Thanks

[Ditto]

@Steve21 I'd have to check about the license ID, I'll definatly get the finance manager to look through - the previous IT technician never bothered and has stuck with MS 2007 since the school last had an server upgrade back in 2010. If the finance manager can't find it on an invoice I can check it from the server \\SERVERNAME\Software\SoftareDistrabution\ and then there should be a file that has the license ID? I'm going to check the files tomorrow and hopefully the file is there what I need.

I upgraded using the Windows 10 installation media (I spoke to MS before doing it only because I was lead to believe that W10 wasn't free anymore. But they said if you have W7 Pro or W8/8.1 Pro you could still upgrade for free.)

Thanks

Let's hope the finance manager can track who the school is paying - they certainly should be able too! I had a similar issue at a primary school that had a sudden change of staffing - in the end we found the details in an email to the previous headteacher (after seeking appropriate permission to access the account - GDPR!). Once we had that we could move forward. There are still some challenges I think once you get to this point, but we can take it a step at a time. Could you also confirm the exact version of Windows you have on the student PCs - Go to Settings -> System -> About and then check Windows specifications - Edition and Version are of interest. With regards upgrading to W10 from W7 Pro etc, I was aware that this likely still the case, but I'm surprised MS would publish it. When it came to providing a product key, if you did, did you enter the long code from a sticker on the PC - i.e. if you are using an OEM license?

 

Fingers crossed you can make good progress Monday.

[Ditto]

Did you manage to make any progress with this?