Building refurbishment - things to consider?

[DGardiner]

Big Mistake. Huge mistake. Wireless is not capable of replacing wired networks for classrooms of PCs/laptops with domain logons (apart from in the minds of suppliers and senior school manager). Yes its fine for BYOD where there is no downloading of group policies, virus updates and user profiles at the start of lessons. And increasing use of multimedia data files isn't great with classrooms of wireless kit either.

 

 

this, a few heavy users logging in at the same time and youve got an AP on its backside for half an hour, ipad apps deploy ap on its backside until its complete. yeah you can throttle and manage the bandwidth but why slow things down when a cable just eliminates the issue

[psydii]

If you have control of your environment, wireless as primary medium is entirely possible. I've been doing it successfully since the early noughties.

 

Design your device management and update strategy around the limitations of the medium, and provide training to staff training and guidance to steer them away from practices that don't play to the strengths and you will have no problems.

 

Is 100% reliable? No but done well the trade off is worth it.

[san_narula]

don't clog up your wireless system with fixed location non mobile PCs such as in my example, use your wireless for student devices and your own ipads/androids/chromebooks/laptops. Wireless is a finite resource and if you clog it up with PCs that could have been cable then you'll risk reducing performance for all the other users that can not use cables.

We will definitely be keeping the admin PCs on wired and all the existing desktop labs will stay on wired until they are phased out except one. As students will be bringing their own devices and teachers will be using laptops, their argument is spending money on cables is a waste.

[DGardiner]

We will definitely be keeping the admin PCs on wired and all the existing desktop labs will stay on wired until they are phased out except one. As students will be bringing their own devices and teachers will be using laptops, their argument is spending money on cables is a waste.

 

i hope theyre not just hoping to buy the cheapest access points then!

[forkies]

i hope theyre not just hoping to buy the cheapest access points then!

 

I would strongly recommend talking with a supplier about getting a wireless survey done, listing your requirements including future proofing (as it is unlikely you will get given 10s £k again). We used Softcat to do a wireless survey and recommendation on wireless systems that would suit our needs.

 

As @DGardiner has said, you will need some high end APs so likely cost £800 per unit and if running higher bandwidth then more then likely one per classroom or two classrooms.

[Blue_Cookeh]

We will definitely be keeping the admin PCs on wired and all the existing desktop labs will stay on wired until they are phased out except one. As students will be bringing their own devices and teachers will be using laptops, their argument is spending money on cables is a waste.

 

Printers

Phones

Digital Signage

Interactive TVs/whiteboards

Projectors

CCTV

Door access control

Automated overnight Windows deployments from SCCM

 

cable doesn't seem like such a waste anymore

[psydii]

If you are getting vendors to bid against each other, £800 APs get billed at a lot less that their headline price. But if you getting a D&B drop of kit they might not have taken care on ensuring best value for you. Engage with them and make sure they aren't installing a turkey.

 

(aside: anyone else noticed that it is but a slip of a finger to move from Turn-key to turkey?)

[Chr1sM]

Hi,

 

Don't underestimate mapping where the ethernet ports will go.

 

What may seem obvious to yourself can be ignored by the guys fitting the cables. I've seen installers try to fit a dozen ethernet points in a single corner or along one wall to save them trouble of drilling work.

 

Ta,

 

Chris

[san_narula]

i hope theyre not just hoping to buy the cheapest access points then!

Not this time. We did though in the past.I have been able to get the budget approved for enterprise wireless this time.

[san_narula]

PrintersPhonesDigital SignageInteractive TVs/whiteboardsProjectorsCCTVDoor access controlAutomated overnight Windows deployments from SCCMcable doesn't seem like such a waste anymore

I won't bring it again with them but I already know the answers (some of these have been discussed in the past in our meetings).Phones - We will never have phones in the classroomsDigital Signage - What do we need this for, we are only a schoolInteractive TVs/whiteboards - We have bought them before and no one uses themProjectors - This is already includedCCTV - This is included as wellDoor access control - Not hereAutomated overnight Windows deployments from SCCM - We are moving away from Windows and school owned computerscable doesn't seem like such a waste anymore - Not to me but still does to them

[san_narula]

I would strongly recommend talking with a supplier about getting a wireless survey done, listing your requirements including future proofing (as it is unlikely you will get given 10s £k again). We used Softcat to do a wireless survey and recommendation on wireless systems that would suit our needs.As @DGardiner has said, you will need some high end APs so likely cost £800 per unit and if running higher bandwidth then more then likely one per classroom or two classrooms.

This has already been done and we will be very close to one AP per classroom.

[san_narula]

Hi,Don't underestimate mapping where the ethernet ports will go.What may seem obvious to yourself can be ignored by the guys fitting the cables. I've seen installers try to fit a dozen ethernet points in a single corner or along one wall to save them trouble of drilling work.Ta,Chris

Thanks for pointing that out. I will be marking the exact location of the ports before they start drilling.

[AlanD]

This has already been done and we will be very close to one AP per classroom.

 

In the days of 2.4GHz only - wireless surveys were pretty much essential - and often you would struggle to fit 1xAP per classroom because of co-channel interference in buildings with lots of classrooms.

 

It is possible in some scenarios today to survive in a classroom without an AP but only provided the APs in surrounding classrooms can use maximum power - and in senarios where they won't be using wireless heavily at the same time.

 

If you want the high data rates often promised (but not delivered) by "AC" then you need a very strong signal - so the AP and client need to be 3 to 5m away at most, and no walls or even bodies in-between - because 5GHz is absorbed really easily and you soon loose all those multiple streams and MIMO capabilities which require a really high signal to noise ratio to work.

 

Some wireless access points have software configurable radios - so you can program them for 2 x 5GHz radios - which is great in a classroom because using 2 x 40MHz channels in a "busy" network environment is much better than 1 x 80MHz channel when the single channel collision domain takes a real hit on the traffic when you start going above 15 or 20 laptops.

 

And while there are cheap non enterprise access points - there are also expensive enterprise wireless systems that don't necessarily give you anything better than one of half the cost. Like all things - you don't actually get what you pay for.