Safeguarding recording

[zebulunn]

Hi,

Is there a product available to assist in documenting safeguarding concerns and referrals etc. ideally utilising SIMS?

 

I am aware of Cura as we already use PARS, however I am not really impressed by the demo as many of the pages seem to be broken (not sure if intentional).

If you currently use it, could you give me a mini-review?

 

Its a shame no-one in my organisation is going to BETT as this would have been a good scout

[mdrabble]

Have a look at CPOMS - we have just bought this as several schools in the area already use it and raved about it.

 

I have set up the SIMS.net part for exporting details into CPOMS - other than that I can't tell you anything else about it.

[ITGURU]

We're using a website called MyConcern. It imports students from SIMS but the content is stored online rather than within SIMS.

[Oaktech]

We use MyConcern too.

[southhamster]

We've just started using CPOMS and staff are pleased with it here.

[zebulunn]

Thank you for the suggestions so far. I'll look into them when I can.

[itguy22]

+1 for CPOMS

[Love_Sausage]

We're looking at CPOMS, we briefly flirted with CURA last year - absolute nightmare to get installed and working. Any contact with TASC's support team just resulted in an email to look at the CURA wiki, which had huge gaps in the instructions. We had to trial and error the solution to the many obstacles we came across and cancelled the contract after just six months. They didn't object.

[kevin_lane]

Look into safeguarding software that's really plus does all your training as well for staff

[David_Grashoff]

Would be interested to hear people's views on whether Safeguarding data must be kept on paper and not electronically. Lots of conflicting advice and seems a similar situation to when electronic registration was introduced to replace the old /\/\/\/\ marks in books.

[elsiegee40]

Would be interested to hear people's views on whether Safeguarding data must be kept on paper and not electronically. Lots of conflicting advice and seems a similar situation to when electronic registration was introduced to replace the old /\/\/\/\ marks in books.

 

It doesn't make a blind bit of difference as long as Safeguarding records are kept, everyone knows where they are and how to record things and the DSL/school is able to use those those records appropriately.

 

Naturally things are moving electrinic in all walks of school life and have these records easily acessible through the school's MIS makes sense.

[timbo343]

I've just setup a spiceworks instance internally for this so staff can log their concern and the leader incharge is notified and then can do something about it.

 

Imperos keyword monitoring works well here too with the image captures

[locoparentis]

I think personally that paper is now an ineffective and out dated way of managing concerns and retaining records for the quality of the safeguarding practice. A school can operate to the high standards expected in process and methods of retention, also in understanding of policy and requirements strictly in line with KCSIE., however the issue of the paper system in my view, is that it is cumbersome to operate for staff who are busy and under resourced. It is a poor evidential quality and also does not offer a good level of security (what would happen if the files were lost, burnt or burgled). More vitally however is the opportunity to see a picture of the whole child in one place including emerging trends. Finally as I see it, the last 15-20 year case reviews site "sharing" as an issue, not easily achieved with paper, the time saved using an electronic system also allows proactivity in safeguarding rather than a basic adherence to recording methods.

 

As some old bloke who I can’t even name once said The moment you stand still you get left behind

 

Each to their own, but my personal thoughts #mikedrop

Edited February 8, 2017 by locoparentis

[David_Grashoff]

I think personally that paper is now an ineffective and out dated way of managing concerns and retaining records for the quality of the safeguarding practice. A school can operate to the high standards expected in process and methods of retention, also in understanding of policy and requirements strictly in line with KCSIE., however the issue of the paper system in my view, is that it is cumbersome to operate for staff who are busy and under resourced. It is a poor evidential quality and also does not offer a good level of security (what would happen if the files were lost, burnt or burgled). More vitally however is the opportunity to see a picture of the whole child in one place including emerging trends. Finally as I see it, the last 15-20 year case reviews site "sharing" as an issue, not easily achieved with paper, the time saved using an electronic system also allows proactivity in safeguarding rather than a basic adherence to recording methods.

 

As some old bloke who I can’t even name once said The moment you stand still you get left behind

 

Each to their own, but my personal thoughts #mikedrop

Dont disagree with your sentiments and views. Just looking for a DfE policy document, guidance etc. Now where is BECTA when you need them.

[matt40k]

I think we both know the Teflon coated DfE deal with terms and methodology. They don't get bogged down with the detail like paper vs electronic. Especially when it means schools will have to throw money at certain software companies

[locoparentis]

A worrying trivialisation of safeguarding and child protection I hope that someone in Westminster considers the maintenance of records more than minor detail, even if it will be 2020 before they issue a white paper following another 20 SCR's

 

I hope no one describes me as having "thrown money"

[matt40k]

Safeguarding is critical. No one can argue that. My comment was its it "odd" that Capita are "concerned" now they have a new product to sell. Electronic solutions have existed for many, many years. It's not like computers are a new invention that's just appeared this year! Over 8 years ago on SupportNet folks were talking about how other LAs recommend schools handle safeguarding and could you just use SIMS.

[kevin_lane]

I think sims is an OK product I don't think it's great but I think there is a lot that capita could with sims around safe guarding as (proactively real time almost)

 

We have started using safeguard as I mentioned earlier in the thread, it's integration into the school has been really good we have admins that can see everything (pastoral dept) and then you have teachers that can only raise a concern. When all start are registered they can see there own training in line with ofsted and so you have your FGM, mental health, self harm etc all self pace or obviously the school can say they want it done by xyz

 

But what I'm trying to get at is t this product is amazing they have also got the green light for the early year ( I think it's called) where by if a child goes to the doctors and they are being mistreated or concerns it automatically filters through to the school , and other leas and authoritys and this is being implemented now they have got the go ahead from Gov / NHS to put this in place which they are rolling out so this is going to be one of the next big upgrades for them now I don't know about other systems but what's more it's almost live it pulls ready only data from sims so it will pull over attendance, cp plans , alsorts but it's also most life I really do recommend people check this out because I think it's going to be a game changer soon

[GREED]

I would very much like to see this actually happen... Kudos if it is pulled off but have serious reservations that it will. NHS data is a mire of red tape and privacy. We must all have followed their disaster of a nationwide data sharing system which failed because record permissions were 'too difficult to convert to software' in basic terms. And now a third party solution from another sector is going to plug in?

 

Don't get me wrong, love the concept. But having experiences NHS 'tin foiled hats' in several previous jobs I question the ability to achieve. More than happy to be proved wrong!

 

How though is school an authority over doctors? Surely the flow of data in these circumstances is to LA social care teams from both doctors and school?

[kevin_lane]

It's not that the school have an authority of doctors is more of a sharing the data

[locoparentis]

I think sims is an OK product I don't think it's great but I think there is a lot that capita could with sims around safe guarding as (proactively real time almost)

 

We have started using safeguard as I mentioned earlier in the thread, it's integration into the school has been really good we have admins that can see everything (pastoral dept) and then you have teachers that can only raise a concern. When all start are registered they can see there own training in line with ofsted and so you have your FGM, mental health, self harm etc all self pace or obviously the school can say they want it done by xyz

 

But what I'm trying to get at is t this product is amazing they have also got the green light for the early year ( I think it's called) where by if a child goes to the doctors and they are being mistreated or concerns it automatically filters through to the school , and other leas and authoritys and this is being implemented now they have got the go ahead from Gov / NHS to put this in place which they are rolling out so this is going to be one of the next big upgrades for them now I don't know about other systems but what's more it's almost live it pulls ready only data from sims so it will pull over attendance, cp plans , alsorts but it's also most life I really do recommend people check this out because I think it's going to be a game changer soon

Couple of questions Kevin.

 

So the doctor sends personal consultation information to my school with an automatic filter on the basis of mistreatment, does it go to Derbyshire police as well because surely they should know before the school and how are police and surgery systems linked to safeguard?? Also why is it currently the case that under a medical confidentiality clause I, and as far as I am aware, the police, are unable to know anything but a software company has overcome this?

 

The Government (is that the DfE or Theresa May) and NHS are supporting roll out, when is this being launched its a pretty substantial development for a new software company and I think its important for the link up of all schools nationally?

 

How does it pull a CP plan off of SIMs?

 

Which LEA's and Authorities are launching this, i'd like to get in touch?

[kevin_lane]

I have no idea of the ins and outs just what I've been told from the director that this is what they going to be doing or at least going to be in there development design from my understanding they have had to jump through a lot of hoops to get this far.

[locoparentis]

Oh good, I thought I was missing something.

 

"They made us many promises, more than I can remember, but they never kept but one; they promised to take our land, and they took it" Red Cloud

[kevin_lane]

@locoparentis - i feels a sense of sarcasm here - look all I know is what I have been told and from what I have been told it sounds like they are on the ball, and I think systems like this, in fact I don’t get why the GOV don’t have something like this instead of separt systems - it should be a multi-link with ALL authorities and vice versa especially for when it comes to looking after a pupils / welfare / mental health and all goes along with protecting that child until they are classed as an adult then its treated a bit different ( at a guess)

 

In regards to Sims it reads the data from SIMS - it’s a one way communication - and then it is imported into safeguard

 

The safeguard software also allows multiple authorities to share data already (that is alrdy implemented in the system) you give them a link and they have a 1 time access to the data they need over a secure connection of course.

 

 

you can also upload your own policies into the system so you have a central point of reference for staff so they know what safeguarding procedures are in place at your school. along with NSPPC access and other data you might want to upload

 

what else do you want to know if you want to bullet point me some questions please email me at [email protected] and send them to me i will be more than happy to send them to Steve - Director / Software designer

[GREED]

Also why is it currently the case that under a medical confidentiality clause I, and as far as I am aware, the police, are unable to know anything but a software company has overcome this?

 

Police need a warrant to even get started here as far as I know, and then it is a minefield of what can and cannot be shared based on circumstances and emergency...

 

I can only assume that it would be a separate system (basically doctors have an interface/UI) that they enter pertinent information into that they might be allowed to. Double work. Linking to NHS databases as said before has got to be a no no for anyone!

Edited February 10, 2017 by GREED