PeteHopton

Jamie, Emmanuel, thanks for your comments, which were not requested but are appreciated, I feel vindicated from the lies of this bitter old soul. As we say in Yorkshire. Nuff Said...... (Jamie, you mean endorsed by the Energy Saving Trust as in "Energy Saving Recommended", the Carbon Trust and Salix Merely issue funding, they don't like being quoted as endorsing things!)

@FN-GM, Universities pay VAT and can't reclaim it, so I guess same goes for Colleges and Schools?

Agree on the SAN to one server point, although my thoughts were around 2 servers and a Starwind SAN for full failover functionality, maybe a step up from what's looking to be achieved.

I'd personally thin provision, so I don't have to worry. LUN size won't really afflict performance, Providing you've got you RAID set up right, block size good and everything aligned with the disk sectors, then job is a good 'un.

I'm an intel only SSD person myself. I had some OCZ disks with dodgy firmware and they all broke - cost me a lot. X25-E all the way. SLC baby!

Hi Guys, If you're looking it intel, the buy the 5600 series Xeons, AMD have a very cost effective offering with the 6100 series 8 and 12 core opteron processors. Either connect to a Storage device (eg. such as an EcoVault or another iscsi system) and load the base OS onto an SSD in the host server or use a decent LSI hardware RAID card in the server node. All virtualisation produces a lot of I/O operations per second, which means a large number of disks, or a suitable cached storage device are key to good performance. Having a common storage device allows you to migrate VM's from server to server. Look into HyperV on Server 2008 R2 as its cheap for education and comes with loads of features. Using something like Starwind HA Enterprise on some dedicated hardware (it's better value if you use their hardware providers) and a pair of servers with some cheap education server 2008 R2 Enterprise licenses lets you do a whole High Availability clustered offering, meaning any one server can fail and the VM's all keep going - very handy!

Roger, I don't apply blame for sustained activity to any employee of mine, as I would be the person responsible ultimately for managing their behaviour. This is truely bad form. "it's not my organisation's fault for not delivering service, it's my sales guy for overpromising" Please! I don't rumor, but prefer fact and reference in my communications (as I always have on this forum), which is one of the reasons I'm a respected member of the industry who regularly represents the BCS (the chartered institute for IT) in presenting around Green IT and DataCenter Efficiency at various events (I've presented at NAACE, BETT, ICT for Education, Green IT Expo, HEEPI, JISC, SUSTAIN IT, FCO mission to Tokyo, MAS, Salix Fund Events, etc.) I would suggest at this point the only way you can redeem yourself is to make the last comment you make on this forum to offer a full onsite service and support amnesty for all people who have purchased SoftXpand through your channel. A good place to start is in the Manchester LEA area who appear perticularly badly hit. Said unreferenced press release (VeryPC and SoftXpand green IT solution delivers strong sales / green IT news) did include customers who had purchased a GreenHive solution (LG, Ncomputing, SoftXpand or MS) with a VeryPC host unit, you are partly correct in that the article misquoted Colin as these all being SoftXpand solutions. Confusing people by passing your 'other company' off as a subsiduary of a company you no longer have the rights to buy from is not also just bad form, but will likely land yourself at the wrong end of a lawsuit before long, and your customer's warranty worthless as it's underwritten by a bankrupt firm. Actions speak much louder than hearsay, so I would encourage anyone still in doubt to come and see VeryPC, Our Friends from Musu, LondonWeb and the guys from Miniframe Isreal, who write SoftXpand at the BETT show stand C90, which is split in 3. LondonWeb & Miniframe will be demonstrating various SoftXpand solutions correctly licensed running Windows Server 2003/2008, Multipoint Server 2010 (with Windows 7 Look and Feel), etc. - which is a good start for a new leaf for SoftXpand in the UK I think! VeryPC's bit will be demonstrating its latest desktops, Servers, Storage and Virtualisation products. The Storage and Virualisation is perticularly interesting and was Launched with Microsoft on their Stand at the 'Green IT Expo 2010', some of the members of the forum might have even met us all at the MS/VPC afterparty.

Rumors? Hmmm. Well as you know I'm always happy to debunk the copius ammounts of cr*p that appears in this thread. Now I thought the following was true: SoftXpand in the UK has a bad reputation in some areas for poor support and cowboyish actvity (Ref: Manchester LEA), mostly because of it's UK distribution and support arm that was based in the 'Derbyshire' very,very,very close to 'Kira Supplies' (Ref: Companies House) The Isreali's pulled the UK distribution rights from this 'Derbyshire based entity' likely due to issues arrising and the aformentioned bad reputlation and now LondonWeb are the exclusive UK Distributor of the software. (REF: press release Technology News Today | London Web Expands Green IT with SoftXpand Desktop Virtualisation Solution) Interestingly LondonWeb have contracted VeryPC to supply the SoftXpand host units, citing 'build quality' and 'inconsistant configurations' as big problems in SoftXpand's UK history. (Ref: Press Release MiniFrame and VeryPC Join Forces to Offer the Greenest IT Solution - desktop virtualization, green it, multi-user software) VeryPC have also been appointed to produce host units for Ncomputing, LG Network monitor and have the largest Microsoft Multipoint Server host unit deployments in the UK. It is my hope that this new, stronger and more reputable distributor, combined with the technical host unit nounce of my team at VeryPC will overcome the bad reputation caused by the previous 'Derbyshire based Entity'

I'm going to file the zero watt PC/Monitor in the store room with all the green paint and the perpetual motion devices. "Conservation of Energy" At the end of the day, the components on the motherboard are the same (chipset etc) they need power to maintain their S5 (soft off) ACPI mode status. The network card for instance needs power to work with WOL mode. So there is power coming from somewhere, just not from the plug at this point in time. It is possible (extreamly likely) there is a battery inside the unit, probably inside the PSU that is being discharged and recharged at a time when the machine is on. Taken from Fujitsu FAQ "What happens when the battery is empty? How can I switch on the PC again? An emergency ON button at the rear of the PC power supply unit can be manually operated at anytime to wake the PC from 0-Watt mode, for example having replaced the battery or the mainboard." I haven't managed to find their 'pending patent' published, this should reveal all when I find it - unless its in japanese.

If you follow the Becta guidelines and buy Energy Star certified kit, it's all WOL enabled by default as a requirement of the standard. Dell Energy Star PC's Unit Category Idle Off Sleep TEC KWh/Yr CPU Cores GHZ RAM HDD OS Dell D02U D02U001 A 20.1 0.9 1.7 75.5 Intel Atom (Intel Atom 230) 1 1.6 1 1 250 Windows 7 Dell D02U Inspiron 300; A 20.1 0.9 1.7 75.5 Intel Atom (Intel Atom 230) 1 1.6 1 1 250 Windows 7 Dell OptiPlex 780 Ultra Slim Form Factor D01U001 B 34.2 1.4 1.9 126.2 Intel Core2 Duo 1 3.2 6 1 320 180 Windows Vista Business 32 Dell D02U D02U002 B 34.2 0.8 2.1 124.7 AMD Other (enter below) (6850E) 1 1.8 8 • 1 1024 Windows 7 2009 Microsoft Dell OptiPlex 760 Ultra Small Form Factor DCTR B 40.7 1.0 2.3 148.2 Intel Core2 Duo 1 2.0 4 1 320 Windows Vista Business 64 Bit Dell OptiPlex XE D01S001 B 41.0 1.1 2.4 150.1 Intel Core2 Duo 1 2.6 8 • 1 280 Windows Vista SP1 Dell DCSLF Inspiron 580s B 41.4 0.7 2.5 148.5 Intel Core2 Duo 1 2.8 8 • 1 250 Windows Vista Dell DCMF Inspiron 580 B 42.9 0.7 2.6 154.4 Intel Core2 Quad 1 2.8 8 • 1 500 300 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex Ultra Small Form Factor 760 B 45.5 1.6 3.4 168.5 Intel Core2 Duo 1 3.3 4 1 80 Windows XP SP 2 Dell OptiPlex XE D01D001 B 45.5 1.1 2.4 166.0 Intel Core2 Quad 1 2.6 8 • 1 300 Windows Vista SP1 Dell DCSLF Inspiron 546s B 47.0 0.9 2.3 168.9 AMD Athlon 64 Dual-Core 1 2.8 3 • 1 250 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 760,780 Desktop D 49.5 0.8 2.9 178.3 Intel Core2 Duo (dual core) 1 3.0 8 • 1 255 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 760,780 Small Form Factor D 51.5 0.8 2.9 185.5 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 3.0 8 • 1 235 Windows Vista Dell Optiplex 380 Small Form Factor D 52.3 0.9 1.7 188.2 Intel Celeron D 1 800.0 4 • 2 235 Windows Vista sp1 Dell Desktop OptiPlex 360n B 53.1 0.7 1.6 190.4 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 2.7 4 • 1 160 255 Windows Vista Dell Desktop OptiPlex 360 B 53.1 0.7 1.6 190.4 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 2.7 4 • 1 160 255 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 360 Desktop B 53.1 0.7 1.6 190.4 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 2.7 4 • 1 160 255 Windows Vista Dell Inspiron 560s DCSLE (Inspiron 560s) D 54.8 0.6 2.2 194.7 Intel Core2 Quad (Q9400) 1 2.7 8 • 1 250 Windows Vista / XP Dell Optiplex 380 Desktop D 55.0 0.7 1.5 195.3 Intel Core2 Quad (Core2 Duo) 4 750.0 4 • 1 255 Windows Vista Dell DCSLF Inspiron 545s B 57.5 1.1 1.7 206.7 Intel Core2 Duo 1 2.8 4 • 2 250 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 980 Small Form Factor D 57.7 1.9 3.1 212.6 Intel Core2 Quad 1 2.9 16 • 1 500 235 Windows Vista SP 1 Dell OptiPlex 980 Desktop D 58.0 1.9 3.0 212.8 Intel Core2 Quad 1 2.9 16 • 1 500 255 Windows Vista SP 1 Dell Mini Tower Optiplex 360n B 58.4 0.7 1.5 207.2 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 2.7 4 • 2 160 255 Windows Vista Dell Mini Tower Optiplex 360 B 58.4 0.7 1.5 207.2 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 2.7 4 • 2 160 255 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 360 Mini Tower B 58.4 0.7 1.5 207.2 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 2.7 4 • 2 160 255 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 760,780 Mini-Tower D 60.3 0.9 2.9 215.3 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 3.0 8 • 2 255 Windows Vista Dell Inspiron 560 DCME (Inspiron 560) D 61.8 0.7 2.2 221.0 Intel Core2 Quad (Q9400) 1 2.7 8 • 1 1024 300 Windows Vista / XP / 7 Dell Optiplex 580 MT D08M, D08M001 D 61.9 0.8 2.9 221.4 AMD Phenom X4 1 2.8 16 • 1 250 Windows Vista / XP / 7 Dell OptiPlex 960/ OptiPlex 960FLX/ OptiPlex 960FLX-HD DCNE D 62.5 0.8 4.1 224.6 Intel Core2 Duo (dual core) 1 3.2 8 • 1 255 Windows Vista Dell Optiplex 580 SFF D02S, D02S001 D 63.2 0.7 2.7 225.4 AMD Phenom X4 1 2.8 16 • 1 Windows Vista / XP / 7 Dell Optiplex 580 Desktop D04D/D04D001 D 63.6 0.7 2.5 226.1 AMD Phenom X4 1 2.8 4 • 1 250 Windows Vista / XP / 7 Dell OptiPlex 960/ OptiPlex 960FLX/ OptiPlex 960FLX-HD/ OptiPlex 960n DCCY D 64.2 0.8 3.0 230.0 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 3.2 8 • 1 235 Windows Vista Dell OptiPlex 980 Mini-Tower D 66.1 1.9 3.0 240.8 Intel Core2 Quad 1 2.9 16 • 2 1000 255 Windows Vista SP 1 Dell OptiPlex 960/ OptiPlex 960FLX/ OptiPlex 960FLX-HD/ OptiPlex 960n DCSM D 66.7 0.8 3.9 237.8 Intel Core2 Duo (Dual core) 1 3.2 8 • 2 255 Windows Vista Dell Optiplex 380 Mini Tower D 66.9 0.8 1.6 237.8 Intel Core2 Quad (Core2 Duo) 1 750.0 4 • 2 255 Windows Vista Dell Inspiron 570 D06M (D06M001) D 68.6 0.7 1.9 244.3 AMD Phenom X4 (945) 1 3.0 8 • 2 300 Windows Vista / XP / 7 Dell Insprion 545 DCMF (Inspiron 545) D 71.4 1.2 2.1 255.8 Intel Core2 Quad (Q9400) 1 2.7 8 • 2 300 Windows XP Dell Inspiron 546 DCMF D 71.9 0.8 2.5 256.4 AMD Other (enter below) (E5200) 1 2.8 8 • 2 1500 300 Windows Vista This data was last updated on 07-04-2010.

I wish the keyboard on my q series samsung was decent. I also wish I got more than 2:30 out the battery. Netbooks are too slow for me I get impatient, anyone know a fast laptop with decent graphics and battery? (any don't say apple)

A low cost option, replace the phillips screws with special security screws?

Agree's the HP DL320's are good pieces of kit, but the 1156 based Xeon's offer better bang per buck over the 1366 based models. Xeon X3430 is 2.4GHz Quad Core Xeon E5502 is 1.86GHz Dual core, similar price, more expensive motherboard Unlike the previous generation both Xeons support fully ECC Reg RAM, the 5500 series are only really cost effective for dual quad core setups BTW, AMD are doing well with a 6 core opteron in the Dual Processor arena that costs similar to the intel quad core offering, it's becoming really popular in cloud computing and virtualisation HP probably do a machine based on the X3430 or the AMD.

I'd go for a server with a socket 1156 based quad core Xeon, they're low cost, very pokey and very energy efficient. I'd only bother with RAID if you buy a server with a hardware RAID controller, as the software RAID controllers (intel ICH9R ICH10R or NVRAID) tend to fail more than disks and get very messy. It's usually a £80 option to have an LSI controller onboard. I'd also consider an IPMI 2.0 interface so you can remote into the server from out of the office and get full power on/off, hardware fault monitoring and KVM control. RAM, I'd say 4GB of DDR3 ECC REG dimms. I wouldn't bother with redundant power as these days PSU's are much more relaible then they used to be, redundant PSU's use 20%+ more power BTW. We just won a tender to supply servers of this sort of spec to Gateshead LA schools, we won the proposal on the value/performance, so I'm pretty sure it's up to the job.

We use Xerox Solid Ink printers on a 'pay per page' agreement. I'm really impressed, they print in wax, so they are greener than plastic toner printers. We pay less than 1p per mono page and 6p per colour page, regardless of coverage and this includes an indefinate service agreement, all consumables and warranty. The printers only cost us £350+VAT and do duplex colour at about 20ppm on a sprint (well half that in duplex). The only problem is the warm up time, they dump wax out the waste tray when you turn them on/off - but this doesn't matter if you've got an ultimited consumable page click agreement. (note I don't sell them)

Now I'm confused?

The samsungs are definately the coolest, but I've been quite disappointed by the keyboard on my samsung Q series notebook which started to fall apart within a week of getting it. I've now got 2 keys half dangling off.

Thanks guys I was the guy who spoke at the NAACE conference. Happy to answer any questions.

You'll find multipoint mouse explicitly excepted from term 2c in the W7 and latest Vista EULA. It is covered under the "Additional license terms" term 2, which is reverenced in 2c.

Microsoft have the rights to sell a license for Multipoint mouse, it's their product, so is windows.

Yes, they do, they've responded to the use of XP for multiseat computing by udpating the EULA in SP3, Vista and W7 to include term 2c. The multipoint mouse is an "approved device" and is covered during the license agreement, microsoft are in a position legally to grant an additional license to anyone to use this device. There is a 'grey' way of licensing XP for multiseat computing, use XP SP2, with an XP SP2 EULA, but not with a downgrade rights redemtion from W7 or Vista. Of course, the legit way is to install server 2003, buy some tsl's and run ncomputing vspace or LG Network Monitor. Which for education works out cheaper anyway right?

Display link is just USB VGA. It's much slower than a standard graphics adaptor. I'm concerned over all these 'unofficial' responses, these are usually personal opinions and people move on and change, attitudes and direction also change - as has been illustrated by multipoint server. In relation to X series and multipoint server, yes you could, but to date it doesn't properly address the sound mouse and keyboard. Ncomputing made a press announcement that they were working towards compatibility with Multipoint Server with all devices.

@Roger Ncomputing X series is no different architecturaly from a softXpand solution. It merely has an ncomputing box which is just a passive KVM/CAT5 converter, made to tidy up the cables. In fact if you get an x-series and uninstall the ncomputing stuff it turns into a multi-monitor graphics card solution - with 11 monitors. You can't legitimately run multiple users on a desktop EULA - there are terms prohibiting multiple users on one device. The only way to legitimately license this is to buy a server OS and run on a server OS with appropriate CALs and TSLs. Or agree something else in writing with MS. This is why MS have brought in Multipoint server, which supports a system with multiple graphics cards, exactly like yours, one 'device' multi-points of 'users'.

Worth noting that multiseat computing like this is much greener than thin clients: No Compression, decompression at client end, this uses energy No resource in the server room (with AC and UPS), this uses lots of energy Full performance video as a result of no compression Kit can easily be turned off at night The ncomputing cards are quite impressive, packing 5 graphics cards, sound cards, keyboard controllers and mouse controllers into a single 5W adaptor. Using lots of geforce cards might give better 3D performance, but it is a bit clunky? and surely the 20-30W+ per card damages the savings? You could get a full green desktop PC for that.

There are ways in certain cases to obtain downgrade rights to XP from a server OS, but this needs written permission from MS on a per end user basis.