EES or not?

[fiza]

For a school with 58 full time teachers and around 460 computers (plus 7 servers physical+VM) is it worth looking at Microsoft EES? I dont know much about it so any advice would be appreciated.

[plexer]

As it's licensed on the peope not hte machines I think that yes you should consider it allowing you to upate all 460 pc's

 

Ben

[fiza]

@plexer - thanks

Is there a ball park figure on how much it costs per full time teacher? Or is per full time member of staff?

[plexer]

It's full time member of staff who has daily use of a computer, in microsofts terminology I think full time is 200hours per year.

 

Approx £30 per person I think.

 

Ben

[CAWJames]

With EES, you only pay for full time staff (FTC) so that includes any staff who have use of a computer for their day to day work, so you can probably discount Catering and Janitorial.

 

Current pricing for the Enterprise Desktop Platform is around £40 per FTC, so say 58 x 40 = £2320. There is a standard desktop platform too, still with W7 and Office, but less CALS, not sure on the price of this though.

 

This would give you Windows 7, Office 2010 Pro Plus and all the enterprise CALS(exchange, sql, windows server, windows rights management, System center client, etc) you need for all your OEM licenced PC's(you have to have some kind of licence already on the computer, cant just build or buy computers with no licence).

 

You then add licences for any server products you need, circa £25 for windows server standard, circa £80 for Enterprise and Datacenter(both per processor, Datacenter better if using for Virtual Hosts) This doesnt have to be FTC, just per Server/Processor

 

This is a per year fee, so you would have to do the maths if it outweighs the price of 460 copies of Windows7, Office etc. They will also let you pay a 3 year as well.

 

I've just done this for our college, so any questions just ask

 

James

Edited April 2, 2012 by CAWJames

[CyberNerd]

For us it it wasn't worth it - it really depends upon your upgrade cycle.

58 staff and 460 machines would probably be worth doing - on Windows alone you would save if you were using a 6yr O/S renewal.

[fiza]

For us it it wasn't worth it - it really depends upon your upgrade cycle.

58 staff and 460 machines would probably be worth doing - on Windows alone you would save if you were using a 6yr O/S renewal.

 

Ok seems as its Full time staff my number would go up to 110 (58 teachers plus 52 support staff). Some are part time so I would have to work out who are full time.

[CyberNerd]

Ok seems as its Full time staff my number would go up to 110 (58 teachers plus 52 support staff). Some are part time so I would have to work out who are full time.

in that case 40*110 = £4400 per year.

Win 7 perpetual is around £30 on a 6yr renewal (480*30)/6= £2400

Office perpetual is around £30 on a 6yr renewal (480*30)/6= £2400

[elsiegee40]

Ok seems as its Full time staff my number would go up to 110 (58 teachers plus 52 support staff). Some are part time so I would have to work out who are full time.

Unfortunately your part timers who work more than 200 hours per year (roughly 6 hours per week term time only) also count as Full Time. Microsoft's definition of part time is considerably more limited than general understanding

 

It would still be worth considering.

[fiza]

Unfortunately your part timers who work more than 200 hours per year (roughly 6 hours per week term time only) also count as Full Time. Microsoft's definition of part time is considerably more limited than general understanding

 

It would still be worth considering.

 

So basically we have no one who works part time in the eyes of Microsoft? No one here works less than 6 hours per week.

 

Brilliant!!

[elsiegee40]

So basically we have no one who works part time in the eyes of Microsoft? No one here works less than 6 hours per week.

 

Brilliant!!

Yep, that's it.

 

We argued the case with Microsoft at the Edugeek Microsoft conference in Reading in February last year... got nowhere, but at least we expressed our feelings.

[sparkeh]

Worth pointing out that you don't have to take the whole kaboodle in the desktop platform, you can licence just the bits you need, eg we have windows, office and sccm cals and nothing else.

[synaesthesia]

Having asked this very question to a Microsoft chap at one of the Network Northants meetings, we confirmed this is for "full time" members of staff who use computers, therefore we could discount cleaning and catering staff. This was again confirmed when purchasing the EES licence from our supplier. Maybe worth chasing that up, we'll do the same.

[ZeroHour]

The pack COWJAmes mentions is the full CAL pack with SCCM cals too but there is a Core CAL pack which (or there was at least) should be cheaper.

The biggest benefit with EES is the simple ability to upgrade without large cash piles for LIC's

[fiza]

If I understand correctly you are basically getting a 3 year licence to use the Microsoft products included in the agreement? At the end of the 3 years you can renew or stop using the products? So basically you are tied into the agreement for the life cycle of the product?

[FragglePete]

Yep, that's it.

 

We argued the case with Microsoft at the Edugeek Microsoft conference in Reading in February last year... got nowhere, but at least we expressed our feelings.

 

Yeah, I remember that 'conversation'. Microsoft had a woman from their licensing division waiting in the wings and shot down any concerns we raised. Basically saying, this is how it is and thats that. The sales guy doing the the demo regarding it obviously stayed tight lipped when she spoke.

 

Pete

[SYNACK]

in that case 40*110 = £4400 per year.

Win 7 perpetual is around £30 on a 6yr renewal (480*30)/6= £2400

Office perpetual is around £30 on a 6yr renewal (480*30)/6= £2400

 

Six year refresh cycle, what kind of IT singulaty are you stuck near the event horizon of, they release new ones every 2-3 years and so spread over a reasonable timeframe - keeping up with current versions - it is cheaper to go VL in most cases.

[CyberNerd]

Six year refresh cycle, what kind of IT singulaty are you stuck near the event horizon of, they release new ones every 2-3 years and so spread over a reasonable timeframe - keeping up with current versions - it is cheaper to go VL in most cases.

 

Actually it's closer to 9 yrs here. We put XP in 2003 and still use it as it is still supported and runs our applications. We upgrade to Windows 7/8 this year as the support dries up.

This strategy saves us tens of thousands of pounds in hardware, licensing and training.

[localzuk]

in that case 40*110 = £4400 per year.

Win 7 perpetual is around £30 on a 6yr renewal (480*30)/6= £2400

Office perpetual is around £30 on a 6yr renewal (480*30)/6= £2400

 

So, with perpetual you'd be paying £4800 per year equivalent? Plus CALs, plus servers?

 

Buying outright is fine if you only have a few machines. We have 550 here. That works out at around £57k for Windows, Office, CALS, Server and SQL server.

 

Or, £8k-ish a year with EES. Making it a 7 year cycle for us to match the same cost, but bearing in mind that not many schools have that sorta money lying around for projects.

[CyberNerd]

So, with perpetual you'd be paying £4800 per year equivalent? Plus CALs, plus servers?

 

Buying outright is fine if you only have a few machines. We have 550 here. That works out at around £57k for Windows, Office, CALS, Server and SQL server.

 

Or, £8k-ish a year with EES. Making it a 7 year cycle for us to match the same cost, but bearing in mind that not many schools have that sorta money lying around for projects.

 

It varies from place to place. It makes sense for us - 700 machines the majority are terminal servers. No MSOffice.

[marksams]

Hi Fiza,

 

There is a special Microsoft formula(!) for calculating the FTE count as follows:

Full-time Faculty + (Part-time Faculty / 3) + Full-time Staff + (Part-time Staff /2) = FTE Count.

Employees such as maintenance, grounds keeping, and cafeteria staff may be excluded from the faculty/staff FTE employee count if they do not use institutional devices.

 

The Education desktop with Core CAL Suite is around £35 - The Education desktop with Enterprise CAL Suite is around £40

 

If you have 3 years or more coverage with EES, and you don't wish to renew again or stop using the software, you do have the option of discounted 'buy out' perpetual licenses.

[synaesthesia]

There's a stark difference between how it's worked out in US to the EU though, is the above formula correct for UK?

[marksams]

Please see comments below. Edited April 5, 2012 by marksams
Incorrect information was posted here - please see below.

[localzuk]

That formula has never featured with any licensing companies I've dealt with - it is purely 'anyone who uses a PC and is employed for over 200 hours a year' from what I've been told, even by the MS licensing people last Feb at the conference mentioned earlier.

[marksams]

I stand corrected - thank localzuk - Another (UK) document I have that says "The simplicity of counting Full Time Equivalent (FTE) employees just once per year. In the UK an FTE is someone who works 200+ hours per year." - apologies for the confusion.