[sims] Text Messaging Systems

[GREED]

 

Greed (a user on here!) has explained this system in detail on his site:-

Schoolcomms – User-Friendly Home:School Communications « ReedSoft

 

Wow, ta for the plug Sivadam!

[Nuttyprof]

We have used Schoolcomms for a good number of years now. It's integration with SIMS is excellent! The links actually exist within your SIMS Database. Now how good is that? I cannot recommend it highly enough!!!!

Schoolcomms

 

 

see numerous similar independent/objective posts!

 

Personally I recommend you read the endless similar threads. Trouble is it's the same few people stating the same opinions over and over again! Why don't you invite a few of these potential suppliers into your school. It will be interesting to see which ones can be bothered and THAT should tell you something.

 

As I keep repeating to my colleagues ... we're buying a service not a commodity! And BTW - watch out for cheap text messages ... it often means they are using 'grey' routes (international mobile carriers) rather than UK only. The 'texting only' specialists tend to use these to get their prices as cheap as possible. There are security as well as reliability issues to be concerned about here. Ask for a written guarantee they are using UK services only.

 

Amanda.

Edited March 26, 2011 by Nuttyprof

[marshharrier]

Saw ParentMail earlier this week to discuss 'ParentMail 2' which is out soon. Includes two-way texting, two-way email, and payments from parents. They're also adding an APP which lets parents do all the above from their mobile phones. (Yup you read it correctly ... parents will be able to build their own private groups and send their own messages too - independently from the school).

 

Mobile Phone App To Help Parents Supervise With Their Children Announced « Gadgets and Technology News

 

Looks very cool indeed, and as for pricing ... they're about the same as everyone else!

[Sivadam]

.....Why don't you invite a few of these potential suppliers into your school.....

Also do what we did - visit schools that are using the various systems and see them in action. Obviously InTouch was not available when we went thro' this process.

[GREED]

Schoolcomms are building a mobile app to use their system as well, just thought i'd throw that into the mix!

[vikpaw]

Schoolcomms are building a mobile app to use their system as well, just thought i'd throw that into the mix!

 

Coolio, i asked for an iPhone app a while ago. The current mobile version works pretty well on iPhone assuming you have the groups already prepared in SIMS, and ideally favourited. Scrolling manually is slow going.

 

Yes, you've guessed it, another happy Schoolcomms customer here. It might be a little more expensive than some, but you get what you pay for, and the service is really good.

 

Two way texting - if parent replies it goes into the inbox and if it's related to an absence, then you can update the info in SIMS directly as it's linked.

Email replies go back to the sender but also sit in a global inbox. (We have multi-license.)

Texting at the cheapest is 20,000 for £1000.

Users can be limited to email only, and texting can be reserved for certain users only (We only use if for emergencies.)

It has a mobile interface for use on smartphones which is new and is working well.

It has a web interface so can be used from anywhere in the world.

The client app allows overall management from the desktop.

The synch to SIMS is really efficient and can be done in a few minutes depending on how many changes have occurred.

 

Basically, all the features you're after are there.

 

To take a longer view, it could be that InTouch would be the way to go, so be careful about how you evaluate, and the importance you place on cost, as the built in nature of InTouch has advantages, but you need to weigh this against how well it works, being such a new product.

 

Just to throw another company name out there, at BETT i came across someone called Atomwide, who seemed to have a very low cost offering, but know nothing more about it. You pay for what you get, so you'd have to make your mind up there.

 

The other thing i would say is, analyse exactly what you need, not necessarily what you want. There are many other ways of making contact that don't need a dedicated system. If you are using Sharepoint/SLG or another VLE that taps into the SIMS data, you may already have all the information you need to be able to email staff/students/parents etc without needing a dedicated package. The only part that they don't do out the box would be texting but there are schools out there that have set up their own texting facility, or there are systems we use that allow you to paste a list of phone numbers in to a web interface and text away, they can be very cheap. We still have an account open with 24X for this purpose. It doesn't link to sims but does the job we need which is emergency messaging, the data required is easily extracted via a sims report.

[marshharrier]

The other thing i would say is, analyse exactly what you need, not necessarily what you want...

 

Totally agree Vikpaw ... lots of schools are persuaded into buying something because of fancy functionality which they then never end up using. 'Absence' is a key one i.e. if you're a Primary school with no real absence problem then don't buy something which majors on absence.

 

One other area of caution ... DATA PROTECTION!

 

Make sure that you have the right permission from parents before extracting their data from SIMS/MIS. Some of these systems run a daily/nightly sync with MIS and extract data (contact details). If parents have said 'no' then you need to ensure their data doesn't get pulled out. Similarly if you have new parents joining mid-term and you haven't yet got their permission they too need to be excluded from any auto extract.

 

Some of the apparently less sophisticated systems are that way 'for a reason' so don't be hoodwinked by technology for it's own sake :-)

[Edu-IT]

Totally agree Vikpaw ... lots of schools are persuaded into buying something because of fancy functionality which they then never end up using. 'Absence' is a key one i.e. if you're a Primary school with no real absence problem then don't buy something which majors on absence.

 

One other area of caution ... DATA PROTECTION!

 

Make sure that you have the right permission from parents before extracting their data from SIMS/MIS. Some of these systems run a daily/nightly sync with MIS and extract data (contact details). If parents have said 'no' then you need to ensure their data doesn't get pulled out. Similarly if you have new parents joining mid-term and you haven't yet got their permission they too need to be excluded from any auto extract.

 

Some of the apparently less sophisticated systems are that way 'for a reason' so don't be hoodwinked by technology for it's own sake :-)

Worth noting that with some of these systems, most data never leaves school. Only the telephone number which is used for sending the message. Some systems on the other hand bulk upload data to their website, ParentMail being one of them.

 

As I keep repeating to my colleagues ... we're buying a service not a commodity! And BTW - watch out for cheap text messages ... it often means they are using 'grey' routes (international mobile carriers) rather than UK only. The 'texting only' specialists tend to use these to get their prices as cheap as possible. There are security as well as reliability issues to be concerned about here. Ask for a written guarantee they are using UK services only.

I discussed this with GroupCall at length and can say I was impressed with their handling of SMS.

[GREED]

A neat trick to ensuring you don't pull out parents who don't want this service: Set them as a particular priority (say 9) in SIMS.

 

We never used priority as it was meant for, but rather as a grouping method so as to identify who was required for Schoolcomms

[vikpaw]

Schoolcomms is uploaded to their site, however using Grahams tip, you can avoid that. Latest edition now has much more control over which priority contacts are imported too, can go up to 4 or more i think.

 

Be interested to see what sort of app groupcall produce bearing in mind the nifty looking Emerge app for SIMS. [ Got one step closer to that today ]

[Edu-IT]

Schoolcomms is uploaded to their site, however using Grahams tip, you can avoid that. Latest edition now has much more control over which priority contacts are imported too, can go up to 4 or more i think.

 

Be interested to see what sort of app groupcall produce bearing in mind the nifty looking Emerge app for SIMS. [ Got one step closer to that today ]

You can see the desktop app here:

 

Groupcall - Parental Communications

 

It's SchoolComms and ParentMail that are making the mobile app supposedly, GroupCall are a seperate company. GroupCall are the ones who make Emerge.

Edited March 27, 2011 by Edu-IT

[vikpaw]

I just tht in light of Emerge they would have a dedicated messaging app as a lot of work is done in Emerge already. In fact they could just increase the functions available as you can already call parents and it's fairly easy to text too I think.

[Ecclesbury]

We've recently trialled and started using Keep Kids Safe. I haven't been heavily involved in the set up so couldn't comment on it's good features, but a couple of practical problems have arisen:

 

Texts cannot be sent in the middle of the night (there is window when texts are sent, something like 6am until 9pm.) This might not seem like a problem, but we had a school trip recently which was due to arrive back into school at 3am and the organiser wanted to text parents to update on arrival times. This was impossible.

 

Texts cannot be sent abroad. Again, a foreign trip wanted to be "contactable" from back home so that the school could pass messages to the lead teacher via text but again this was impossible.

 

I believe both probelems were reported and I don't know wheter they are being rectified or not but thought I would mention them. Can anyone comment on whether these problems exist with other texting services?

[Nuttyprof]

Worth noting that with some of these systems, most data never leaves school. Only the telephone number which is used for sending the message. Some systems on the other hand bulk upload data to their website, ParentMail being one of them.

 

I should check your facts here Edu-IT. Most of the systems to my knowledge take name and class/year plus email and mobile data out of SIMS. Also ParentMail are the ONLY company that by default provide parents with a registration letter so that they 'opt-in' in all cases. In fact we chose them for that reason. They also NEVER take contact data straight from SIMS/MIS so there is no way they can contact parents who haven't opted in.

 

With regard to APPS I can't comment on that being offered by Schoolcomms, but I am told it is for schools to use rather than Parents (I could be wrong). ParentMail came into school about 3 weeks ago and their APP is aimed at parents rather than the school hence it being called ParentPlanner. It is designed to help them pay school bills and get calendar items (from school and clubs) onto their mobiles ... just to make organising kids activities easier.

 

Can anyone comment on whether these problems exist with other texting services?

We use PM to send text messages internationally and to international numbers with no problem. The charge is the same as those sent in the UK.

 

Amanda.

Edited March 28, 2011 by Nuttyprof

[thinkdifferent]

Sure you are aware that getting on the wrong side of data protection is a very bad thing. I took legal advise before deciding which type of system to go for as it was unclear after talking to a couple of the providers.

 

Whatever you are told its the schools responsibility to ensure compliance NOT the communication provider. I was advised to be very carefull of those systems that simply suck out data to populate their database. Unless you are certain that your parents have given their permission for you to share/copy their details to another system wether its in school or not then dont do it.

 

Some parents are very data aware and will let you know if you are using their contact details on another system without their permission.

 

On a related note I am really suprised at Keep kids Safe - What's the point of a text messaging service that shuts down for 9 hours and doesnt let you send messages. Isnt that the point of a Text messaging service!

[LawrenceRoyston]

I just tht in light of Emerge they would have a dedicated messaging app as a lot of work is done in Emerge already. In fact they could just increase the functions available as you can already call parents and it's fairly easy to text too I think.

 

Hi vik

 

The next version of emerge has full SMS facilities built into the app and will be released immediately after the easter break (and it's works internationally).

 

Kind regards

Lawrence

[Banjo]

Do you have to pay Capita again for the intouch install if you need to rebuild your MIS server ?

[Edu-IT]

I should check your facts here Edu-IT. Most of the systems to my knowledge take name and class/year plus email and mobile data out of SIMS. Also ParentMail are the ONLY company that by default provide parents with a registration letter so that they 'opt-in' in all cases. In fact we chose them for that reason. They also NEVER take contact data straight from SIMS/MIS so there is no way they can contact parents who haven't opted in.

 

They also NEVER take contact data straight from SIMS/MIS so there is no way they can contact parents who haven't opted in.

Data is being taken out of SIMS and put online is what I meant, ParentMail is ENTIRELY web based? Therefore they need the data to be online. If it doesn't extract data from SIMS then are you saying you get the registration form and manually type in that data to ParentMail? What a pain in the backside that must be if it's the case!

Edited March 31, 2011 by Edu-IT

[Nuttyprof]

Data is being taken out of SIMS and put online is what I meant, ParentMail is ENTIRELY web based? Therefore they need the data to be online. If it doesn't extract data from SIMS then are you saying you get the registration form and manually type in that data to ParentMail? What a pain in the backside that must be if it's the case!

 

Why speculate and pour cold water on a product through ignorance !?!?!

 

ParentMail imports SIMS data directly, however it doesn't include the parent contact data from SIMS. This comes in from parents completing 'opt-in' data slips which ParentMail inputs so the school doesn't have to. (This is done within the PM subscription charges which are comparable with other products on the market).

 

It is a process that ensures parents only ever get information if they opt-in, and also ensures that the contact data is bang up to date.

 

Where contact data is extracted from SIMS it is often missing or out of date and so the comms service is limited by the quality and comprehensiveness of this data. It then becomes the schools burden to maintain the quality of this data in order that messages get home successfully (the comms provider doesn't care!). ParentMail is different and allows parents to login to their own accounts and update their own contact data and their system notifies the school whenever a parents updates their details. They also automatically remind parents to do this every term.

 

In summary, we chose ParentMail very carefully ... because their processes are better thought out in terms of maintaining data accuracy over the long term, and also because they try hard not to place the school in any danger from a DP standpoint. They also take a longer view of the amount of work a school has to do to keep communications accurate.

 

Apologies if this reads like an advert (and No I don't before someone asks) ... but I hate to see products maligned by people who are simply speculating.

 

Amanda.

[PaulHughes]

Ooooh ... this is a hot one to enter for my first proper post!

 

Each of the comms providers does something unique and useful and each will appeal to some schools and not to others - sorry that was a very obvious thing to say! The market is big enough for a number of providers to happily exist side by side :-)

 

Nuttyprof - you have it about right in terms of process. To clarify a little, we look at school to home communications primarily from one viewpoint which is effectiveness. Without correct email and mobile data, messages don't get home (again another obvious comment - but often overlooked)!

 

Therefore from day one (8 years ago) we took a strategic decision to involve parents in that process rather than just extracting contact data from SIMS. This also reduces the burden on busy administrators of keeping changing contact data up to date.

 

We all do things in slightly different ways :-)

 

Paul.

Edited April 10, 2011 by PaulHughes

[Edu-IT]

It is a process that ensures parents only ever get information if they opt-in, and also ensures that the contact data is bang up to date.

 

Where contact data is extracted from SIMS it is often missing or out of date and so the comms service is limited by the quality and comprehensiveness of this data. It then becomes the schools burden to maintain the quality of this data in order that messages get home successfully (the comms provider doesn't care!). ParentMail is different and allows parents to login to their own accounts and update their own contact data and their system notifies the school whenever a parents updates their details. They also automatically remind parents to do this every term.

 

In summary, we chose ParentMail very carefully ... because their processes are better thought out in terms of maintaining data accuracy over the long term, and also because they try hard not to place the school in any danger from a DP standpoint. They also take a longer view of the amount of work a school has to do to keep communications accurate.

 

Apologies if this reads like an advert (and No I don't before someone asks) ... but I hate to see products maligned by people who are simply speculating.

It's the schools responsibility to make sure that the data stored within their MIS is accurate. Most staff I imagine will go to SIMS to look up contact information for parents and therefore they expect this to be correct. What is the point in a company having the correct data stored on their website but the school not having this information within SIMS or another MIS? Are you saying that staff should go to ParentMail to look for contact details instead of the MIS? To me it seems a more sensible idea to use the data capture forms to ensure that the data stored within SIMS is up to date and then synchronise this with a SMS service rather than them having the correct data and you having to manually compare their data with what you have. That is in effect meaning data has to be input twice.

 

I think it's complete nonsense to say that ParentMail will handle the data management side of things and that the school don't need to wory about the accuracy of the data in their MIS.

Edited April 11, 2011 by Edu-IT

[Nuttyprof]

It's the schools responsibility to make sure that the data stored within their MIS is accurate. Most staff I imagine will go to SIMS to look up contact information for parents and therefore they expect this to be correct. What is the point in a company having the correct data stored on their website but the school not having this information within SIMS or another MIS? Are you saying that staff should go to ParentMail to look for contact details instead of the MIS? To me it seems a more sensible idea to use the data capture forms to ensure that the data stored within SIMS is up to date and then synchronise this with a SMS service rather than them having the correct data and you having to manually compare their data with what you have. That is in effect meaning data has to be input twice.

 

I think it's complete nonsense to say that ParentMail will handle the data management side of things and that the school don't need to worry about the accuracy of the data in their MIS.

 

I don't recall saying that ParentMail handle the data management side of things did I?

 

Show me a school secretary who hasn't tried to call a parent using a mobile number stored in SIMS to find that the number is wrong or has been changed. It might be inconvenient for you, but it's a fact of life and something most school secretaries will have experienced many times.

 

Every change made by parents in ParentMail is pushed straight back to school the instant it happens. All updates are also stored on a downloadable CSV inside each schools account. This way schools can make changes back in SIMS at a time that suits them - we do it once each week.

 

It means we make constant but small updates to SIMS with just the relevant changes, rather than a once yearly massive data collection process which involves checking every piece of data to see if it has been changed.

 

It works well for us and saves us lots of time - but please don't let me persuade you Edu-IT ... keep doing what you're doing if it works for you

[vikpaw]

It's possible for data to be pushed directly into SIMS, there seems no point in extracting it, getting it corrected and then pushing it back as a csv. Why not take out that last manual process?

[LawrenceRoyston]

It's possible for data to be pushed directly into SIMS, there seems no point in extracting it, getting it corrected and then pushing it back as a csv. Why not take out that last manual process?

 

Whilst this is technically possible, there are other issues. Most UK schools would not, and should not allow parental input on a website to automatically update their MIS. As a Data Controller, they have a responsibility to maintain the integrity of the MIS data and this leaves it open to abuse.

 

I agree with others that data should be maintained in one place (the schools MIS) and used many times, it is a core principle of interoperability and anything else is a backward step. Whilst there is an appeal for parents to maintain their own data, in practice, it’s not a complete solution and hence is flawed.

 

It seems to me that there is no difference between manually copying data out of a returned CSV file or manually typing in changed parental contact information from a form. If that is true, why go through the whole process of creating parent accounts, securely sharing logon details with parents, maintaining all of that, when the information you get back has to be entered in the same way as if you asked the parents for updated contact details every so often. There is an illusion that this is saving time, on the basis of the above, it looks like it would take longer.

 

Schools have a responsibility to maintain their MIS with parental contact information for students in their care. We are one a of few companies that read MIS live and in real-time from SIMS and other systems, we don’t copy the data, and we don’t export it, which means that none of the synchronisation and security issues highlighted above apply.

 

Lawrence

[PaulHughes]

Whilst this is technically possible, there are other issues. Most UK schools would not, and should not allow parental input on a website to automatically update their MIS. As a Data Controller, they have a responsibility to maintain the integrity of the MIS data and this leaves it open to abuse.

 

I agree with you Lawrence.

 

I agree with others that data should be maintained in one place (the schools MIS) and used many times, it is a core principle of interoperability and anything else is a backward step.

 

I agree with you again Lawrence but I don't understand why you make the point?

 

Whilst there is an appeal for parents to maintain their own data, in practice, it’s not a complete solution and hence is flawed.

 

I don't agree with you Lawrence. Why is it a flawed process? I'm guessing you'll say because not every parent does it, and if that is the case, then it's no more flawed than not getting every parent to complete and return data slips each year! Our last survey of schools on this subject (late 2009) showed the average percentage of returned data collection slips was less than 60%.

 

It seems to me that there is no difference between manually copying data out of a returned CSV file or manually typing in changed parental contact information from a form. If that is true, why go through the whole process of creating parent accounts, securely sharing logon details with parents, maintaining all of that, when the information you get back has to be entered in the same way as if you asked the parents for updated contact details every so often. There is an illusion that this is saving time, on the basis of the above, it looks like it would take longer.

 

You missed the point here I'm afraid. You only have to update the specific details that have changed and just for the people that have changed it (there's a nice simple list ). The alternative is to check every form from as many people as care to return it, and check each piece of data to see whether it has changed or not i.e. you are forced to check EVERY single slip. As for parent logins, well that is fairly useful if you want to enable them to do other things such as paying for things for example.

 

As my first post said, all these systems do things slightly differently or in this case substantially differently. There are supporters and detractors for the various methods.

 

Paul