Office for Mac creating random folders on Windows Server Share...

[Koldov]

I've asked this before, but got the 'internet forum' equivalent of a blank look (no answers to my thread)...

 

Hopefully the right person will see this thread and know the issue (and have a solution), as I'm sure it can't just be me!

 

Currently about to drop the Headteacher's MacBook from a great height and go 'whoops, you'll just have to use a Windows laptop for now' and then just make sure the new MacBook order never reaches the Finance Department...

 

I am testing as we speak and can confirm the following:

 

Open Word on the Mac

Create new Doc

Save Doc on server

 

 

OK so far, can see file saved on server and whilst open can see temp file

 

If we close the file now everything is OK, temp file disappears.

 

I can open and close this file (no changes) as often as I like and the above repeats.

 

However, if I make a change to that document and then save it, this happens...

 

 

With multiple random folders appearing and random files inside.

 

 

This happens for every file they create, save, edit and re-save...

Edited March 28, 2023 by Koldov

[Koldov]

Checking the permissions on the original file, the security group the user is part of has security permissions as 'Full Control', however in 'Advanced > Auditing' select principal 'user name' (it show here they are the 'owner'), they only have Read & Execute and Read....(What?!)...

 

On the multiple random folders that appear, the permissions are as above, Security = Full Control for Security Group, 'Advanced > Auditing' select principal 'user name', they have Read & Execute, List folder Contents and Read....

 

Could this explain why they never get 'cleaned up'...?

Edited March 28, 2023 by Koldov

[Koldov]

Just to add, we decided he would copy the files to his MacBook and edit them there, once finalised he could then just copy them over to the server... Edited March 28, 2023 by Koldov

[Steve21]

That’s happened for years depending on the setup

 

I think the options were disable the auto save option in Word, or if doing it via smb etc you needed much higher permissions on the share to fix it

 

Don’t think there’s ever been an official fix, more workarounds on it

 

Steve

[psydii]

This sort of oddness is sometimes caused by anti-virus software tripping up the app.

[Koldov]

Thanks, we had the 'create back-up' and any 'Auto-Save' features off and this stopped the folders appearing automatically, but the manual edit/save still does it.

 

I remember researching a fair bit when it first happened, but that was a while ago and I've messed around with the shares recently so might be I've missed a permission somewhere.

 

When you say:

 

if doing it via smb etc you needed much higher permissions on the share to fix it

 

What are we talking here, 'Full Control' permissions for the individual user at the root of the share?

[Koldov]

Yes, you are right @Steve21 it's quite an old problem!

 

Just checked my old research and found this thread (started in 2016):

 

https://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/office/en-US/50d3d7fb-f9c1-49b3-86e3-f9ede62b33d0/mac-2016-word-when-saving-creates-a-folder-example-nameoffolderdocxsb98c2cb88xxxxxx?forum=Office2016forMac#:~

 

"We faced the same issue with an Office 2016 Mac saving Word files on a Windows Server connected on SMB.

 

The difference with the reported issue was that the user cas unable to delete the nameoffolder.docx.sb-xxx folders.

 

After doing some tests, we found out that those folders created by Word when saving a file did not inherite properly the ACL. So Word is not able to delete the folders after saving the file.

 

We found out that some user accounts were inheritated properly, but not the groups, and the user with the issue was member of an ACL group and was not added as single user.

 

So we added the user account to the R/W ACL on the parent folder, and now Word create the nameoffolder.docx.sb-xxxx folder when saving the document, but instantly deletes it.

 

Not a very "clean" solution, but it works."

 

That might explain the part about not having permissions to delete the temp files even though the user is part of a security group with 'Full Control' applied...

 

Also, this might explain why the first 'save' is OK, but only subsequent saves create the random 'temp' folders...?

 

"BTW - Another 'feature'. Excel can't "save as" a new file to the SMB. It has two complaints about permissions then three can't create/access temp files then reports the file not saved.... Save it local and copy to the share then open and save to it all day? Apologies for the vague description I'm not there to read the err's. I read that SMB file creation has different permissions than save? Seems a plausible explanation for seriously confronting behavior.

We faced the same issue with an Office 2016 Mac saving Word files on a Windows Server connected on SMB."

 

Then this...

 

The solution is as follows: check the flag Full control for the user or user group in the section ‘share permission’. This prevents from folder creation. Of course, folder privileges are granted via NTFS permissions.

 

Which is a bit of a confusing answer and the 'share permission' already has 'Everyone' as 'Full Control'...

 

So it must be in NTFS/Security permissions... Thing is, where do I add the user...?

 

To the root of each share I think they will need (and with what permissions - does it need 'Full Control' or will it be OK with 'Modify' etc.)?

Edited March 28, 2023 by Koldov

[Koldov]

 

Anyone?

[psydii]

It's the Head. If it doesn't work for them, change the rest of the school. Move everyone over to OneDrive/SharePoint.

 

(I say that in jest, but it is the correct answer - saving to network volumes/shares is increasingly niche)