Dfe funding - who does the install ?

[discoveranother]

Hi all,

 

Have a few schools who have recently moved over to academy status. However, the schools are retaining us for their IT Support. Apparently there are other schools with the MAT that have other IT Support providers and the schools are retaining them.

 

Anyway, these few schools we look after have been approached by the Dfe for funding for new wireless and cabling within the schools. I'm sure others on here have had the same.

 

To be honest, the current wireless is only 3 years old at each school, but as funding is there, they are taking advantage of it.

 

Apparently someone from the MAT visited the schools for details of the current wireless setup etc and has stated to the schools that the MAT have a company they use for installing new wireless. I don't know if this entails new cabling as well. I know who this company is, it's a well known national company.

 

My question is, does the Dfe have a list of IT providers that have to be used for these projects or can it be anyone i.e. ourselves ? We don't really want to miss out the opportunity of any installation work if we can help it.

 

The reason I ask is that, I was puzzled why the guy from the MAT said this, unless they have to use a company on the Dfe list, if there is one. Also, we are still in a contract with these schools, so if this other company does the installation, is there a breach of contract ?

 

Would welcome any feedback.

 

Thanks all

[snagrat]

Anyone can do it.

There will be companies on this forum who will say otherwise but that’s not the case.

 

As long as the install is done to the standards then the DfE are happy

[discoveranother]

Anyone can do it.

There will be companies on this forum who will say otherwise but that’s not the case.

 

As long as the install is done to the standards then the DfE are happy

 

 

Thanks.

 

1) Is there a link to what the Dfe standards are please, would you know ?

 

2) What is the payment criteria ? Does the Dfe pay the MAT or schools and they in turn pay us our daily rate or is there a fixed price for the work ? The reason I ask , I have seen many IT Companies who say they will be making a lot of money out of this.

 

3) I wasn't sure if the guy at the MAT is getting a backhander from the IT company he has apparently proposed to the schools to do the installation, especially as he is leaving the MAT soon.

 

Thanks

Edited December 7, 2022 by discoveranother

[snagrat]

1) the standard come with the pack. But they are the same ones as the new build guidelines.

 

2) schools gets quote as per their procurement process.

Winning company installs.

Company invoices, school pays

School claims from DfE.

 

Might vary as due to hardware availability there may be some part claiming going on.

 

You can make a lot of money from it. I have (but since moved on) as you can charge a good whack on top. Plus the DfE don’t really check the install.

 

3) back hander would be hard but certainly possible to fiddle the figures to get the claim to appear more than it is.

The process is genuine between school and DfE so to get anything personal out of it would mean the school breaking many rules.

Edited December 7, 2022 by snagrat

[discoveranother]

1) the standard come with the pack. But they are the same ones as the new build guidelines.

 

2) schools gets quote as per their procurement process.

Winning company installs.

Company invoices, school pays

School claims from DfE.

 

Might vary as due to hardware availability there may be some part claiming going on.

 

You can make a lot of money from it. I have (but since moved on) as you can charge a good whack on top. Plus the DfE don’t really check the install.

 

3) back hander would be hard but certainly possible to fiddle the figures to get the claim to appear more than it is.

The process is genuine between school and DfE so to get anything personal out of it would mean the school breaking many rules.

 

 

Thank you for the reply.

 

The MAT are pushing to get this installed by end of Feb 2023. I'm wondering if I'm in a position where I can put a quote forward. Considering I have been looking after the schools for 7 years and will continue to do so, then the MAT suddenly come on board and recommend a company they know to do the installation (I've never met with the MAT) is frustrating.

 

When I say backhander, I mean if the other IT provider are doing the work, they may 'slip' the guy at the MAT a payment for recommending them, I don't know, just a weird thought. I was never even asked by the MAT about doing the install.

[snagrat]

End of Feb will be the DfE deadlines for budgets but they will push that back if the hardware isn’t available.

 

It is frustrating but I wouldn’t do a quote if you haven’t been invited. Would be a waste of time and you’ll find the venders have been deal registered so you wouldn’t get the best pricing either.

 

The company they are going with might be on a framework as well. So they might only have got the one quote and can proceed without much hassle.

[pete]

The reason I ask is that, I was puzzled why the guy from the MAT said this, unless they have to use a company on the Dfe list, if there is one.

 

As a guy from a MAT....

 

They likely have a preferred supplier with a track record (with the MAT) of consistently doing work to a good standard and they will get economies of scale if they're scheduling work across multiple schools.

 

That's not to say you don't do good work, but that's the reason we have preferred* suppliers that we require to be used across the trust unless there's a good reason** not to. Plus the prospect of losing regular work at multiple schools does generally promote more attention to detail.

 

 

*We look at who all our schools are using and pick the best (quality of work, responsiveness, ease of working with, knowledge, capacity and price) one.

**Specialism the preferred supplier doesn't have. Noticably better pricing without drop in quality. etc

[discoveranother]

End of Feb will be the DfE deadlines for budgets but they will push that back if the hardware isn’t available.

 

It is frustrating but I wouldn’t do a quote if you haven’t been invited. Would be a waste of time and you’ll find the venders have been deal registered so you wouldn’t get the best pricing either.

 

The company they are going with might be on a framework as well. So they might only have got the one quote and can proceed without much hassle.

 

Thank you

[discoveranother]

As a guy from a MAT....

 

They likely have a preferred supplier with a track record (with the MAT) of consistently doing work to a good standard and they will get economies of scale if they're scheduling work across multiple schools.

 

That's not to say you don't do good work, but that's the reason we have preferred* suppliers that we require to be used across the trust unless there's a good reason** not to. Plus the prospect of losing regular work at multiple schools does generally promote more attention to detail.

 

 

*We look at who all our schools are using and pick the best (quality of work, responsiveness, ease of working with, knowledge, capacity and price) one.

**Specialism the preferred supplier doesn't have. Noticably better pricing without drop in quality. etc

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

It is frustrating considering I've been in I.T. for 25 years and done many major installations of all kinds. The schools involved are very small and I consider my quality of work and responsiveness second to none. Having had these schools for 7 continuous years proves that. The MAT in this case haven't even bothered to ask.

[Ditto]

Ultimately, once the school joined the MAT, things have changed and the impact can vary enormously. My 8+ years experience as a governor at a primary, which joined a MAT from being a single academy trust has seen total shift of power and control to the MAT. As a now 'local governor' we are not 'governors' in the true sense - merely members of a sub-committee. For my local primary, changes happened over several years, but it has moved all financial control and decision making to the parent trust - we had a in house IT technician who has recently been outsourced to a newly appointed trust wide out-sourced IT provider. Local governors were merely informed after it took place.

 

In my scenario, the school is a top 1% national performer on results, the kids are content and do get an outstanding education and access a 'broad and balanced' curriculum, so it's hard to complain about things. Based on personal visits to the school, and others in the MAT, it's not just exams/results factory - it's just extremely well run educationally by the MAT with local staff - who of course are now MAT employees.

 

So a few things, firstly I'd explore if you can be involved in the work, but do so carefully - avoid rocking the MAT boat too much and hope that you retain the schools you work with on an ongoing basis. Perhaps unfairly, the MAT may not take much notice of your excellent track record over several years. Secondly, it may be worthwhile seeking out the schools 'scheme of delegation' - it might give insight in to which services, including IT, remain at a local level or whether they have been centralised.

 

On the topic of a back hander, I'd avoid that thought unless there is clear evidence - sure there will have been cases in the past, some resulting in prosecution, some not, but there are a number of checks and balances in the finance system that they remain very rare events.

 

Finally, and I'm going to add this to another thread on the same topic. If you do get involved in the work, please don't unnecessarily over spec the work. There's going to be a finite pot of money for this work, and every school that abuses DfE weakness in holding to account, will in the longer run deprive other schools of the money.

[pete]

Thanks for the reply.

 

It is frustrating considering I've been in I.T. for 25 years and done many major installations of all kinds. The schools involved are very small and I consider my quality of work and responsiveness second to none. Having had these schools for 7 continuous years proves that. The MAT in this case haven't even bothered to ask.

 

Depending on how good those schools are at keeping documentation / handling things not directly related to teaching and safeguarding, MAT guy may not even know you exist. Getting hold of an accurate supplier list from new schools is more painful than it should be.

 

As @Ditto mentions - introduce yourself and mention the work you've done and where your strengths lie.

 

Assuming MAT guy is the IT lead, making his life easier by proactively sharing technical documentation on said schools rather than him having to start from scratch for every new school that joins, will earn you significant brownie points.

[discoveranother]

Thanks for the excellent replies guys.

 

It just confirms I feel, how much the Government and Dfe have money to throw away. Yes I agree that it's great that education sector gets this help, I'm all for that. Some money could be surely spread out for other pots of money that the country needs as well. When over paying suppliers of any kind, we saw this during covid, money gets thrown around like you wouldn't believe and wasted in my opinion.

 

I remember couple of years ago when some providers were doing the Dfe funded Google Classroom. I remember speaking with some and had a close conversation. Some admitted they were being paid around £3k-£4k for just a few hours work. Talk about throwing money down the drain.

 

Thanks