Olliekai Posted April 18, 2021 Posted April 18, 2021 We were planning to migrate to Hosted SIMS but were told by our LEA that they are looking into SIMS 8 rather than hosted SIMS. I heard that SIMS 8 was coming soon 7 years ago ... I did see in the Capita sale press release they said they were looking forward to developing SIMS 8. I’m wondering if the LEA has information I don’t know about or if they are just buying into the sales line. Has anyone heard anything ?
Popular Post XiJ Posted April 18, 2021 Popular Post Posted April 18, 2021 Not only will I be retired, there’s every chance I’ll have shuffled off this earth by the time sims 8 arrives. My advice would be to look to a modern, web based MIS - I like arbor but there are others worth looking at. 8
free780 Posted April 18, 2021 Posted April 18, 2021 I wouldnt be suprised if cloud only MIS systems become the norm. 1
willtech Posted April 18, 2021 Posted April 18, 2021 Only really heard about the Sims Primary but don’t think many schools are using it yet others versions eg secondary are still not released last I heard. https://www.simsnextgeneration.co.uk/ 1
Ditto Posted April 18, 2021 Posted April 18, 2021 Some years ago there was something called vapourware. Look for a cloud based product that is available now. 1
Olliekai Posted April 19, 2021 Author Posted April 19, 2021 Not only will I be retired, there’s every chance I’ll have shuffled off this earth by the time sims 8 arrives. My advice would be to look to a modern, web based MIS - I like arbor but there are others worth looking at. Yes. I think that’s the best option. However I think our LEA requires we use SIMS. I’m going to check on that.
paulkerton Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 We were planning to migrate to Hosted SIMS but were told by our LEA that they are looking into SIMS 8 rather than hosted SIMS. I heard that SIMS 8 was coming soon 7 years ago ... I did see in the Capita sale press release they said they were looking forward to developing SIMS 8. I’m wondering if the LEA has information I don’t know about or if they are just buying into the sales line. Has anyone heard anything ? There are entire species that have evolved, reached their peak and gone extinct in the time between when SIMS 8 was first announced, and today. I think it's been 8 years since it was first announced, and 4 years since they announced it was launching "next year" In a previous job I had a demo of SIMS 8 to head off the growing number of schools in our LEA that were looking at cloud based solutions. That was April 2018, and SIMS 8 is no closer. SIMS 8 was announced the same year Lyft, Wish.com. VoxMedia, SnapChat, Slack, Spotify and Uber were formed. We're a Bromcom school. I don't think anyone is regretting moving away from SIMS. The integration (for us) with Google Workspace, and having that anywhere, anytime access has been a massive boost during lockdown. Let alone not having to deal with SQL, Servers and SOLUS. I'd presume the LEA are dangling a carrot for you. 2
TwistedHelixis Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 However I think our LEA requires we use SIMS. They might like you to use SIMS as it makes things simpler for them but I don't think they can force you to use it. 2
Popular Post psydii Posted April 19, 2021 Popular Post Posted April 19, 2021 I heard capita realised they were in a hole and have just poached the Half Life 3 team to get it out the door. 7
synaesthesia Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 Not a chance re Sims 8, and no your LEA cannot force you to use SIMS - plenty of laws saying that! 1
supportman Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 No reason to stay with Sims now... Its well out of date. We moved to Bromcom last year and migration was no issue. Nice modern web based MIS and easy to pick up for staff after years of Sims. Even if I had the choice of Sims 8 vs Bromcom (which of course we don't) I would choose Bromcom as its just does many things better than the Sims workflow. 1
Jawloms Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 We are currently SIMS .net. Is there a simple place to get an idea of costings for alternatives without having to deal with sales people? 1
paulkerton Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 Not really no, but certainly less than SIMS .net when you factor in SQL and Windows Server Licensing costs, and then the hardware costs too. 2
supportman Posted April 19, 2021 Posted April 19, 2021 We are currently SIMS .net. Is there a simple place to get an idea of costings for alternatives without having to deal with sales people? We costed Bromcom, Arbour and Sims(plus the 3rd party tools we needed to match the others) and all were about the same, in fact over time we have saved a fair bit I think when retiring old systems that are no longer needed. 2
bobsmith Posted April 27, 2021 Posted April 27, 2021 I can't imagine SIMS + all the third party software you need to match any modern MIS comes out at the same cost. We've got nearly a dozen third party apps that plugin that Bromcom does in-house. Seeing the costings we pay for all our bits and pieces I can't see how Bromcom/arbor anything else can cost anywhere near as much. However I'd love to see some *hypothetical* costings if anyone has any? 1
Olliekai Posted April 28, 2021 Author Posted April 28, 2021 Bromcom seems to be pretty popular. We used that when I was in school, so I have a bit of nostalgia for it. It seems Hosted SIMS is on hold as no ones sure what ESS are going to focus on now that Capita has done a runner. Also they seem to be doing the SIMS 8 is here sales pitch.
paulkerton Posted April 28, 2021 Posted April 28, 2021 Also they seem to be doing the SIMS 8 is here sales pitch. If the first thing the new owners are doing is pushing out SIMS 8 as being ready, it's not going to be pretty when schools realise it really isn't. 1
supportman Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 If the first thing the new owners are doing is pushing out SIMS 8 as being ready, it's not going to be pretty when schools realise it really isn't. The new owners actually said in their takeover pitch that they were "investing significant resources" in development which basically tells you Capita didn't. They probably have to start from scratch again. Problem with development taking so long is technology shifts and overtakes the project and the framework of 3 years ago wont be the framework of choice today, let alone the future. You get bogged down horribly and its probably worth starting from a clean slate. 1
paulkerton Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 Problem with development taking so long is technology shifts and overtakes the project and the framework of 3 years ago wont be the framework of choice today, let alone the future. You get bogged down horribly and its probably worth starting from a clean slate. It'll be 8 years since they first announced it, and I think the third reboot if they did? 1
psydii Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 Problem with development taking so long is technology shifts and overtakes the project and the framework of 3 years ago wont be the framework of choice today, let alone the future. You get bogged down horribly and its probably worth starting from a clean slate. They made a good call with dotnet back in the early 2000's, but never executed on the web version that should have been possible - probably because schools couldn't afford the server infrastructure required to run it. That said a couple of years later the product that is now just referred to as Bromcom started development and that (eSchool) was dotnet based with both client and server-side components. However, I'm not sure how ESS can deliver a decent ROI for their new owners from where they find themselves now, unless they have the most amazing product development and marketing team, and are unconstrained from monopoly concerns. SIMS.NET is a stable, mature product and over time its market share is gradually being consumed by the platform agnostic cloud based alternatives, all of whom have a multi-year head start. 1
paulkerton Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 They made a good call with dotnet back in the early 2000's, but never executed on the web version that should have been possible It was never possible, because they loaded so much of the processing of data onto the client, rather than to the server. This is why SIMS .net hangs whenever you ask it to create a report. It's doing all of that processing at the client end. Loading that onto a web based client would be near impossible as is. It would require a complete architecture rewrite. However, I'm not sure how ESS can deliver a decent ROI for their new owners from where they find themselves now, unless they have the most amazing product development and marketing team, and are unconstrained from monopoly concerns. It's the same team as was at Capita. So, unless their uncoupling from Capita itself has removed restraints in regards to what technologies and tools they use, I wouldn't be confident. Perhaps it will allow them to bring in people who aren't quite so shackled? Let's face it, SIMS Finance already needs a massive facelift and UI rebuild and it's only just been released! SIMS.NET is a stable, mature product and over time its market share is gradually being consumed by the platform agnostic cloud based alternatives, all of whom have a multi-year head start. Well, its definitely mature. Don't think I entirely agree with stable however - certainly not at the client end! 2
Jawloms Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 It was never possible, because they loaded so much of the processing of data onto the client, rather than to the server. This is why SIMS .net hangs whenever you ask it to do anything ever FTFY... 2
synaesthesia Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 I won't often defend Capita/SIMS having worked for them, but I will point out issues & delays would have nearly always been caused by a lack of funding/support from above. 2
paulkerton Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 I won't often defend Capita/SIMS having worked for them, but I will point out issues & delays would have nearly always been caused by a lack of funding/support from above. True, but 8 years worth? 1
synaesthesia Posted April 29, 2021 Posted April 29, 2021 True, but 8 years worth? This is Capita. Yes, absolutely. 2
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