DavidAngwin

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My mistake, apologies to Axel, I read there were existing clients. David

@AlexPilot, good post from @chad above and there is also a video that explains how .ini files work with the Wyse ThinOS at YouTube - Wyse Thin OS Network Configuration If you need more help feel free to get in touch. I work for Wyse and am pretty disappointed that Axel's response is throw your existing hardware away and buy new units. Your predecessor has left you very capable thin clients (C10LE is a current model and runs the latest Citrix HDX and RDP 7 clients) and I'm sure your budget could be better used on something else. David

@nut-ed But if you look what I said: " If you were a bigger organisation I'd strongly recommend going for an ultra-thin OS such as Wyse ThinOS so you didn't have to manage the clients..." ThinOS is also virus immune, does not need windows updates, no local user data, and is cheaper! It's by far our most popular solutions for deployment in schools. A PC is a good solution for home use, but if mwok wants to reduce power consumption, then a thin client is an option. But, given the high performance being looked for, and a technically competant admin, my recommendation is to get the most powerful and flexible thin client.

I'll first declare my interest - I'm from Wyse so thin/zero clients & related software is what we do. First a definition that may help: For us, a zero client is a dedicated device that connects to one back-end infrastructure, whereas a thin client is a more flexible device that will connect to a wide variety of infrastructures. So my guess is you need a thin client, because it will give you more flexibility from one device, and not lock you in to one back-end vendor. If you are already managing 6 PCs/servers, then you don't really need to zero-config simplicity of a zero client :-) In terms of the hardware, you should go for a high-performance thin client. This will give you dual DVI output (HDMI is very rare in thin clients) and have enough processing power to handle the more demanding protocols like PCoIP (VMware View), RemoteFX (beta just released) or HDX 3D Pro (Citrix). Any of these will handle the 3D graphics you are looking for. If you are only looking for streamed video, then other options such as Citrix HDX, Microsoft RDP 7, or the Wyse TCX suite all do multimedia redirection and rendering of the video on the client which will give you up to HD video playback (depending on the client specification). Re knowing which VM to boot from, zero clients use the broker software (VMware View, XenDesktop or MS broker) to present available VMs based on user credentials. But with a thin client, you can configure multiple sessions on the client using the embedded OS. Which OS to have on the client is another question. If you were a bigger organisation I'd strongly recommend going for an ultra-thin OS such as Wyse ThinOS so you didn't have to manage the clients, but is only you, so embedded Windows will give you a more flexibility, the ability to install the latest Flash/Silverlight clients, and client side browsing if you want it. I'm not trying to plug our stuff, but so you can see what is available, and checkout the specs on our website: Wyse R90L7 is a high performance WES7 thin client with dual DVI output & 15 watts power consumption Wyse X90L7 is a thin client laptop so you can access you multiple servers from your sofa Wyse C90L7 is a small 6 watt thin client. Lower processor power but has an on-board media processor and will run up to 1080p video (MPEG/WMV etc.) Hope this helps, David

Wyse Thin OS will always try to get its configuration from the network first. If this configuration is set to lock down the device, then the user has no ability to reconfigure it. Even if they took it off the network, reconfigured it, then re-attached it, the network config would overwrite and changes that had been made. Our SUSE Linux devices work the same way. With a Windows XPe device there is a password protected administrator account which if cracked would allow access to the device. But, you can still secure the virtualised desktop environment. David

The answer to this depends on a) the technology at the back end and b) whose thin clients and related software you use. The back-end options are: 'classic thin client/server-based computing (SBC)' with MS Terminal Server or Citrix XenApp; Virtual desktops with Citrox XenDesktop, VMware View and others (VDI); and streaming to zero clients with Wyse WSM or Citrix Provisioning Server (Streamed). Google Earth - the problem is the fast moving graphics. For SBC and VDI, the remote display protocol that connects the client to the server (Citrix ICA/HDX, Microsoft RDP, Sun ALP, and more recently VMware PCoIP) has to be able to handle this. RDP and ALP don't do a good job of this today (but watch for RDP 7 in the future), a well configured ICA/HDX setup with lots of bandwidth will give OK performance. PCoIP with VMware View will run this fine. The most cost-effective route however is 'Streamed'. This runs Google Earth on the client itself , so there is no remote display protocol involved. Performance on a suitable client will be as good or better than a PC. Audio - For SBC and VDI there are products (such as our Wyse TCX Rich Sound) that enhance the capabilities of the standard protocols to do this. 'Streamed' runs the app locally and uses the local audio hardware so works just like a PC USB - most protocols will have basic USB connectivity for memory sticks. If you want more sophisticated support, including real-time devices like webcams, again this can be achieved with products that enhance the basic protocol (in our case Wyse TCX USB Virtualizer does this in VDI environments). With 'Streamed', devices work like they do on a PC. YouTube - With SBC and VDI support for Flash video is now available. Citrix have this available in their HDX; for RDP Wyse have it in our TCX suite. Again 'Streamed' runs the player locally so the issue goes away. So for teacher stations, it is now practical to use thin or zero clients, but the decisions you take on the back-end and which vendor solutions will dictate the functionality you get. Hope this helps, David

Thanks to Axel for staring the thread. As they point out the term is being used different ways by different vendors. This gets confusing so in my opinion its better to look at the solutions rather than get hung up on the exact definition. For the record, at Wyse we talk about a zero client if it does not have a local operating system that needs updating. Every client will have some software on it, but the the distinctions between BIOS, firmware and operating system are very imprecise - so one person's zero client could be another's thin client. What does this mean in reality? At Wyse we have two type of 'zero client' solution. 1) Wyse WSM - this is a streaming solution where the zero client or diskless PC does a network boot and the operating system and applications are streamed to the client. The key difference with this solution is that OS and apps run on the client, not on the server. This gives full PC functionality and much reduced server loads. Multimedia performance is native, peripherals plug & play, but you still get the benefits of centralised OS and application management. Wyse zero clients for use with WSM have no local storage so they have RAM only, no Flash memory. 2) Wyse P20 - this is a zero client specifically for VMware View and contains the Teradici PCoIP chipset and firmware. In concept its really a pure terminal - which is where Wyse started nearly 30 years ago with our green-screen terminals - for those of you who can remember these regards, David

I'm from Wyse so this is a question we get asked a lot. I'd recommend getting thin clients WITH USB ports so you have them in future if your requirements change. Then use the operating system, or additional software to disable/enable them. Most vendors should have this support, but make sure you check up front. The following is how we do it: Wyse Thin OS is a very thin <10Mb operating system where the functionality can be completely controlled by a configuration file on an ftp server. Unless you enable USB support, devices just won't be recognised. If you want selective USB support with virtual desktops (not XenApp/WTS today) Wyse TCX enables very granular USB support - by vendor and by device type - so you could enable a specific scanner or visualizer but not a USB data stick. regards, David

Whether to go for a 'shared app' (terminal server/Citrix XenApp) approach or a virtual desktop (Citrix XenDesktop, VMware View & others) approach is really down to the application set and degree of user control you want. I'll address the USB question on the client. As I'm from Wyse its what we specialise in. With either approach above you can stop the USB ports being used for data sticks etc. This is either a function of the thin client operating system, or additional software can be added to enable exactly the functionality you want. Different vendors do this in different ways. The following is how we do it: Wyse Thin OS is a very thin <10Mb operating system where the functionality can be completely controlled by a configuration file on an ftp server. Unless you enable USB support, devices just won't be recognised. If you want selective USB support with virtual desktops (not XenApp/WTS today) Wyse TCX enables very granular USB support - by vendor and by device type - so you could enable a specific scanner or visualizer but not a USB data stick. Hope this helps, David

@mrbios The HP T5510 thin clients have a fairly slow processor and I think a maximum of 128Mb of RAM so they won't have enough power or memory to run Windows locally - it was worth asking though If you'd like me to connect you to someone who can help with an eval, just send me a private message with your contact details.

As @Ric says, Citrix have their Citrix Provisioning Server technology too. Wyse zero clients work fine with this too. Feature sets are different but both Citrix PS or Wyse WSM stream to the desktop client and run apps locally.

@mrbios Re the pricing, more volume always adds more flexibility. As you say our current Educational pricing is dated to the end of December, but talk to us if you have a requirement. Price is very rarely the limiting factor. The architecture is designed to be very flexible. There is a main 'core' server which is where the master OS images and application packages are managed. In a distributed site, or across several schools you then have local 'edge' servers which are sync'd in the background to the core server, and provide the streaming service for the local clients. On a single LAN-based site everything can be run from one central server room. You have a zero client, or diskless PC for each student. You can re-use existing PCs as long as they can network boot. It's much easier to do this if they have similar hardware, otherwise you have to manage multiple drivers in the OS image - doable but more work. The technology works well for a teacher's class-front computer connected to an IWB too. The server software can sit on your server-class hardware (virtualised if needed); on our WSM Appliance; or on a converted PC. Server-class hardware will run hundreds or thousands of clients. Converted PCs or the WSM Appliance will run tens of clients. Wyse has partners in the UK with skills in WSM, as well as our own technical team. It's all Windows-based technology, so there's nothing particularly different to learn. We find some schools like to build their own skills for ongoing management, and others want a reseller/service provider to do it for them. Hope this explains it, regards, David

@mrbios VMware View (and other virtual desktop solutions) are great solutions, but there is also a product that does exactly what you wanted in your original post. I'll state my interest here as I'm from Wyse and its our product. The product is called Wyse WSM. It streams the OS and applications on demand to either a zero client (thin client without any local storage) or a diskless PC. Unlike View, or server-based thin client solutions, the OS and applications run locally on the client. I've attached the product factsheet fyi, regards, David Wyse WSM factsheet.pdf

@chrisJ You've got it! The way to think of a streamed thin/zero client is that it IS a PC, just with the disk virtualised back to the server. With the OS and apps running local, it means that PC peripherals work in exactly the same way as they do on a standard PC.