Best VLE

[Ian_CUP]

agree with what you say Karl, except the bit about Arsenal, but as a Spurs supporter you might not be surprised about that!

 

"What VLE" is very individual, and interesting that for 2 years now this debate has sparked such territorial debate within many circles! - Having worked with a number of them I would say that they all do something different from the next one so you as a school have to decide what suits your requirements best, and think about the level of support offered. For a school to buy a VLE it will require a fair investment of time and effort so perhaps understandably after taking a leap of faith people will defend that decision with a passion.

 

Ian

[olcinm]

Well I voted for Moodle.

 

But I agree with those that said it depends. Moodle is not great for infants IMHO. Studywiz has a pretty good primary interface based around the idea of a lesson or topic rather than a course. However once you get into the activities (tests, assignments, forums etc. it is just like Moodle but worse. Not very good implementation of the TinyMCE Editor (Much better in Joomla for example) and poorly laid out forms especially in the tests. There is a QTI assessment activity that is more flexible but it's implementation is too esoteric especially the editing of questions. Moodle is way ahead on anything else regarding testing and it's implementation of Ajax for drag and drop is getting better by the day. What it is missing is the big graphic/type interface.

 

Key to any VLE is the content libraries and examples of it being used for full courses or topics sets. The best Moodle examples I have seen are at Alton College but like the Open University Moodle courses they do tend to be wordy text and graphic "books" online rather than interesting use of tests, forums or wikis. If you are a primary school and want to see good use of Studywiz I'd suggest asking at Hampshire.

 

One of the great things about Moodle is it's shareable scales and gradebook. But that doesn't do image scales yet and some VLE vendors for primary are. You know being able to set up a traffic light system or smiley system for rating or grading things. moodle also lets you apply its editable scales toi any rateable/gradeable activity. i've soome really clever uses oif this.

 

Studywiz has an activity called gallery that was originally just an image gallery tool. Buit it does now let you have a gallery of any type of file. Once they get these files producing useful thumbnails or other visualisations of say mp3 files or documents it will be even better. Where Studywiz falls down is its handling of comments, forum threading etc. The ePortfolio tool and ILP/Personal Learning Plans tools are good though and ePortfolio will be even better in 9.4 as its structure becomes editable. Some Local Authorities have bought it for their schools (Unlike Oldham). Yet to see it used in anger though.

 

Haven't used Frog but seen lots of demos and talked with the developers. It's seems a very flexible system but I haven't seen any demo that shows a school using it's full potential. I'd also be concerned about how supportable it would be if you let your techies loose creating forms and data sets that are just too idiosyncratic. The advantage of a fixed structure is clearly the way in which everyone can see the same thing from school to school etc.

 

If you put yourself in the shoes of a year 6 pupil moving from junior to secondary or a teacher working in more than one school, having an LA "standard" solution makes sense. Collaboration and sharing of activities can work better too. Secondary schools do tend to be a bit like islands sometimes.

 

I also have some sympathy with the lets just use lots of web 2.0 free stuff etc. But how sustainable is that and again what about the kiddies. They are not all brilliant at adapting despite the fact they are digital natives. My 3 teenage sons are OK and comfortable with ICT but they really do take ages to do somethings that should take minutes. And I think that's because they don't spend enough time learning a few apps (online or otherwise). Yes we have to be able to transfer skills but someone who really knows an app will knowck spots off the person with broad knowledge when it comes to getting a specific job done swiftly. So again I think standardisation does help.

 

Sharepoint? Well it is really Microsoft's best bit of software IMHO and I reckon it will become a stadard portal into which VLE vendors and MIS vendors will plug in. Problem with that is which forum tool do you use? The VLE one or the sharepoint one? Which survey tool? Which gallery tool? Which wiki tool? Which messaging system? There's a lot of doubling up in the Sharepoint with VLEs plugged in via web parts. And you will also have at least 3 databases (MIS/Sharepoint/VLE) maybe 4 if you count the messaging one if its a separate email system like Exchange. But boy is it resource hungry, slow to render and costly to licence and maintain and develop/skin. Just look at SIMS Learning Gateway to see how badly Capita have skinned Sharepoint. Why not? Maybe it costs a lot. (And WSS is not free - you are paying for Windows Server are you not?) Maybe not too hard to maintain if you don't bother about backup, disaster recovery and don't do anything complex with groups and integration but wait until you've got an SQL database that has been going for a few years without proper clearing out of old stuff. Maybe one server per school is reasonable to support but try setting up an LA sized Sharepoint implementation with full school level restore points and data that's built up over a few years. Then tell me its not costly to maintain. ANd wait till you start to really get parents online with it having to maintain accurate login details handing out passwords etc. etc.

 

TBH I have yet to see a really good scaleable Web 2.0 like drag and drop, aninmated, mashable easy for non-techies to do nice graphical stuff type VLE.

[kbolland]

TBH I have yet to see a really good scaleable Web 2.0 like drag and drop, aninmated, mashable easy for non-techies to do nice graphical stuff type VLE.

 

Hi,

 

I work at Frog and I think you would be pleasently suprised at what we are showing at Bett this year.

 

Please see the screenshot as a taster and come along and see us on the stand.

 

 

 

Karl

[alan-d]

Hi,

Please see the screenshot as a taster and come along and see us on the stand. Karl

 

What does the secondary school version look like?

[steele_uk]

What does the secondary school version look like?

 

Why couldn't that be the secondary school one?

[alan-d]

It looks like a primary school layout. If it was shown to staff here it would be laughed out the door.

 

I'm sure it does what it says on the tin but it looks horrible!

[kbolland]

The screenshot is what to be shown at Bett but like anything in Frog the colours and design can be customized by you to your requirements.

 

For more information ask any of the team at Bett.

 

For a example on how Frog can be customized please take a look at our website which is built in Frog.

 

http://www.frogtrade.com

Edited January 8, 2009 by kbolland

[steele_uk]

I have looked at Moodle and umpteen sharepoint installations, and i honestly think the design is a breath of fresh air.

 

I don't think it would offend any of our staff here, it wouldn't be a million miles away from some of the social networking sites that a lot them of them embrace.

[kdukes]

I have used a moodle VLE, Uniservity and the VLE from SERCO. FROG is in a different league. Moodle required staff to ask the guy who built it to do things for them, they got bored of waiting and gave up, when he left the system crashed and no one knew how to fix it. Uniservity was not intuative took ages to upload and manage resources and was very prescriptive. The SERCO VLE had many of the same problems as Unservity but the server kept going down and as it was not hosted in our building meant that we had to wait for it to come back up before we could access lessons etc. Staff got fed up with this and gave up. FROG is a breath of fresh air, we host the server, even if the Internet goes down we can access lessons resources etc. Staff can develop their own resources, we recently had a whole school inset to show staff how to develop resources, web pages etc...Staff have now voted as a group that our regular twilight insets should now be on how to develop the FROG system. A complete turn around in attitude.

[alan-d]

For a example on how Frog can be customized please take a look at our website which is built in Frog.

Frog - Learning Platform, VLE, Digital Environment

 

I'm afraid that does nothing to inspire me The staff here prefer the more corporate look and feel that big pictures and icons to links looks unsuitable. I have no doubt that some will like it.

 

I have used a moodle VLE, Uniservity and the VLE from SERCO. FROG is in a different league. Moodle required staff to ask the guy who built it to do things for them, they got bored of waiting and gave up, when he left the system crashed and no one knew how to fix it.

 

From what you say, moodle was badly instigated and managed at the time. We are getting to the stage where teaching staff (some, not all!) are experimenting with moodle with great success. Some of this may be down to the fact that we have sessions where staff show off their lessons and how they receive results and feedback from students.

[skunk]

A Y10 student was showing me his iPhone yesterday and it looked just like the frog screenshot there. I think ths students would like it and I dare say the staff may actually be able to use it as well.

 

Big colourful buttons - Check

Silly Name - Check

 

What more could you ask for.

[kausor]

Hello all,

 

I suppose it depends on your own school/staff culture. We looked very carefully for over 6 months and even had many of the above "showcase" theirs; Frog came out on top for many of the reasons stated by others.

 

It isn't cheap, but you do own and house the box on site (no dependence on Local Authority Internet!!) and in the 2 terms that we have had it, their technical support has been fabulous and this confirms my choice of Frog as No.1.

 

It really is as flexible as you want it to be and the full school system integration it offers and in our case in Sheffield, the cluster of Schools we work with; the scope for collaboration etc. is really encouraging.

[Jobos]

I don’t know which VLE is the best but there should be a vote for the worst VLE.

[Emlyn]

Forget Moodle and Sharepoint - they have a long way to go to match Frog - bit like the 360 and PS2 don't have the fun and personality of a Wii

[jpwright]

Very happy with the fronter version we are using. Massive upgrade on kaledios, very easy to use and makes it easy to hi the targets we have set for it.

 

It does help that we have a 1gb line into the school that rarely goes down so being hosted off site is not a problem.

 

I think a move to frog will be in the future somewhere, but for now, the ease of use for staff is a massive help and once they are happy using it then something more advanced would be suitable.

 

Admin wise fronter is very easy to manage. Can't complain with any of it, plus it free for us till 2011!

[techyphil]

Does Frog allow for real time reporting and does it allow staff to put data back into the SIMS/CMIS system?

 

How does prices compare to sharepoint? Looking at our licensing options, sharepoint starts to cost a lot when you start multiplying a few pounds by a thousand plus students and external connectors etc.

 

I'm really interested in seeing some of these VLE's working in schools before we decide which direction to go.

 

Is anyone running the Sims Learning Gateway 2 successfully?

Edited January 13, 2009 by techyphil

[bossman]

@Emlyn:

What experience of Moodle and Sharepoint do you have as we all may benefit from your knowledge.

Your first post seems to give the impression that you have a wealth of experience so would really appreciate your input.

[RyburnMark]

@techyphil

 

"Does Frog allow for real time reporting" - Yes, launching at BETT

 

"and does it allow staff to put data back into the SIMS/CMIS system?" - Not directly yet, but can't be long

 

"How does prices compare to sharepoint?" - as you correctly point out, licencing is key issue, Frog is a one off perpetual licence with support costs the only annuals - see latest thread on VLE costs to be aware of how to measure true costs (Return on Investment not just ££s shelled out)

 

"I'm really interested in seeing some of these VLE's working in schools before we decide which direction to go" - check out the Becta Videos ' Learning Platforms in Action' as a starter. As you mention Frog you may also like to see whitepapers for examples of VLE use in several schools

 

Hope this helps

[techyphil]

@techyphil

 

"Does Frog allow for real time reporting" - Yes, launching at BETT

 

"and does it allow staff to put data back into the SIMS/CMIS system?" - Not directly yet, but can't be long

 

"How does prices compare to sharepoint?" - as you correctly point out, licencing is key issue, Frog is a one off perpetual licence with support costs the only annuals - see latest thread on VLE costs to be aware of how to measure true costs (Return on Investment not just ££s shelled out)

 

"I'm really interested in seeing some of these VLE's working in schools before we decide which direction to go" - check out the Becta Videos ' Learning Platforms in Action' as a starter. As you mention Frog you may also like to see whitepapers for examples of VLE use in several schools

 

Hope this helps

 

Thank You RyburnMark - top man!

[hartshay]

We have been working with the frog system on our site for nearly 3 years now. I agree with the other people who have highlighted its positive points but a couple of additional things need to be stated.

 

I understand why it is so enthusiastically supported by especially by so many teachers and other users, even though those on the technical side can get a bit sniffy about it, it is a great bit of kit for the user. I have looked at other systems before and after we bought into frog but none have tempted us ....as yet.

 

Over the years we have always felt that the support that frog provide has been good but the thing we like best is the way this company actually listens and responds to teacher needs and builds them into the system.

 

I was amused by the frog screenshot and the comments about it. The fact is that the 'front end' of frog is whatever you want it to be. In fact it is so easy to set up 'areas' that teachers and pupils can easily design and run different sections in pretty much any style and with whatever content they choose.

 

From the technicians point of view it is pretty easy to manage as well ... a couple of days and you have it all sorted out. Obviously designing pages etc takes time but it is not difficult and with only a little planning training much of the designing and implementation side can be done by teachers (or pupils if you wish).

 

The frog teacher side is heavily used by our staff to such a extent that it has become 'mission critical' in so far as they tell me that they could not function effectively without it now!

 

In my own LEA a number of schools have bought into frog (even though the LEA wide solution is provided at no local cost ) and it is in frog schools that the teachers and pupils are becoming engaged with the 'VLE process' to support teaching and learning.

 

I am sure that there are other good solutions out there which suit different schools and frog does have its quirks dont get me wrong, but in terms of bang for your buck it is one of the best purchases we have made.

[walker]

The Frog platform does sound very appealing. Before I start the ball rolling at this end and find its out of the question, can you give an indication of how much it will cost us to get Frog ? Excluding hardware, of course. I have seen comments of £££ and I am wondering what that might mean for budget planning.

 

Thanks! Rog

[soapyfish]

They used to provide generic and bespoke installs, the hardware is included in the cost and its between £20,000 and £25,000 I think that the bespoke solution is well woth the extra £5,000.

 

These are rough prices as per.

[walker]

Thanks - seems a bit pricey, but may be do-able. I'll keep on digging!

 

Cheers

 

Rog

[soapyfish]

It does provide extra features as part of the price such as intergrated mail system and web proxy etc.

[stratisphere]

Whats the kinda pricing on just the VLE... as thats what most schools would want i'd imagine.