AngryTechnician Posted January 16, 2013 Author Posted January 16, 2013 (edited) Microsoft System Center Config Manager 2012 SP1 is what you need - the user still has to install it, but you can manage all the apps from there. Which is nice, but unfortunately leaves almost all of the problem unsolved. A 5 year old should not be expected to log onto the SCCM client portal. There appears to be no way to deploy paid apps, or buy them in bulk. Updates will presumably still have to be installed manually. On top of all that, we have to use SCCM, which requires significant server resources and should not be necessary for something this basic. Edited January 16, 2013 by AngryTechnician
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 But I still dont know where to get the .appx files from. Very well being able to install .appx apps that we create in house, but what if I want to have our windows 8 slates all with apps from the store pre-installed for every user?
localzuk Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 But I still dont know where to get the .appx files from. Very well being able to install .appx apps that we create in house, but what if I want to have our windows 8 slates all with apps from the store pre-installed for every user? Only place you'd be able to get them from is the software makers.
sted Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 i think they expect you to only use appx to deploy your own programs
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 so even with SCCM 2012 SP1, Windows 8 is still not designed for a multi user environment?
sted Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 imo its designed for byod and management stuff in there is leftover from win7 or they would have tools to manage the start screen 1
gshaw Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 imo its designed for byod and management stuff in there is leftover from win7 or they would have tools to manage the start screen And therein lies the problem. Microsoft for some reason seem to have designed Windows 8 as if all networked managed machines are going to disappear overnight and be replaced by pure BYOD the next morning. Maybe that may be the onward trend but the product has been released for today where most places still have at most a mixed environment and need managed devices as part of their provision. For those users MS is basically forcing them to stay with Windows 7 even if they wanted to move to 8... businesses won't care as it saves them licensing an OS upgrade but it's not doing MS any favours as 8 has hardly been a resounding success in the retail market either. Almost seems like they're abandoning the one thing they had as their USP (enterprise management) in favour of following Apple (badly). If you want a poorly managed device for BYOD get an iPad, the users will appreciate the shiny logo at least... 1
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 And therein lies the problem. Microsoft for some reason seem to have designed Windows 8 as if all networked managed machines are going to disappear overnight and be replaced by pure BYOD the next morning. Maybe that may be the onward trend but the product has been released for today where most places still have at most a mixed environment and need managed devices as part of their provision. For those users MS is basically forcing them to stay with Windows 7 even if they wanted to move to 8... businesses won't care as it saves them licensing an OS upgrade but it's not doing MS any favours as 8 has hardly been a resounding success in the retail market either. Almost seems like they're abandoning the one thing they had as their USP (enterprise management) in favour of following Apple (badly). If you want a poorly managed device for BYOD get an iPad, the users will appreciate the shiny logo at least... which leaves people like me, whos SLT decide they want full powered touchy feely devices, that can be properly managed and fully functional with all our applications, in a scenario where such a device/OS combination doesnt exist. But wont stop them buying 100 more slate with detachable keyboard combos (even after a failed trial with 50 under powered atom dell latitude st slates) and also a similar number of laptops with touchscreens, (which is not so bad as we can just suggest desktop mode for those, or I can just use win7 and disable the touchscreen)
CyberNerd Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 imo its designed for byod and management stuff in there is leftover from win7 or they would have tools to manage the start screen The whole 'locked down' IT systems of the past have had their day in schools. It's about time. Even the new Ofsted framework recognises this - they want school machines to become more like user owned equipment and have the management done on the network, rather than the device. I'm happy - we've been doing this for years. Recommendations for schools manage the transition from locked down systems to more managed systems to help pupils understand how to manage risk; to provide them with richer learning experiences; and to bridge the gap between systems at school and the more open systems outside school
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 The whole 'locked down' IT systems of the past have had their day in schools. It's about time. Even the new Ofsted framework recognises this - they want school machines to become more like user owned equipment and have the management done on the network, rather than the device. I'm happy - we've been doing this for years. fair enough. I dont think anyone is saying otherwise. but how do you propose having 'the management done on the network rather than the device' applies to the multi user problem of windows 8 metro apps ?
CyberNerd Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 fair enough. I dont think anyone is saying otherwise. but how do you propose having 'the management done on the network rather than the device' applies to the multi user problem of windows 8 metro apps ? I say let the kids manage the apps - just concentrate on proxies etc.
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 have you tried and tested this? when they log in with their domain credentials, from what i can tell each user needs their own windows live ID to be able to install the apps from the appstore. They need to install apps on every device they log in to. I cant see how that is manageable
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 and I don't even need to bother with proxies everything here is filtered at the default gateway so they are free to use whatever browser they like I don't have to worry about proxy settings etc and restricting them to a particular browser etc, so if I can let the kids concentrate on the apps, I dont have anything to worry about. I just cant get round the apps issue currently.
CyberNerd Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 have you tried and tested this? when they log in with their domain credentials, from what i can tell each user needs their own windows live ID to be able to install the apps from the appstore. They need to install apps on every device they log in to. I cant see how that is manageable It works fine on android, I had assumed that MS had some sort of AD link like google do?
RabbieBurns Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 It works fine on android, I had assumed that MS had some sort of AD link like google do? Im really not sure what you mean. Im talking about provisioning Windows 8 Metro apps on Windows 8 Enterpise for multiple users. (see my previous posts in this thread, or this post: Deploy windows 8 apps for multi-user on Enterprise: windows 8, apps, deploy ) no idea where android comes in to this ?
CyberNerd Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 Im really not sure what you mean. Im talking about provisioning Windows 8 Metro apps on Windows 8 Enterpise for multiple users. (see my previous posts in this thread, or this post: Deploy windows 8 apps for multi-user on Enterprise: windows 8, apps, deploy ) no idea where android comes in to this ? lol. Sorry. lets start again. My understanding was: Metro is a PITA to deploy apps. Ofsted recognise this and say don't bother - instead let the users do it. I was just saying you can link active directory accounts to the android store- hence I was making the assumption that you could link your AD credentials to the windows store. perhaps not.
gshaw Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 Seems a right waste of time and effort having to get everyone to install an app manually each time they need one to do an activity but I guess that's the Apple way that's got into people's heads these days eh
AngryTechnician Posted January 23, 2013 Author Posted January 23, 2013 (edited) My understanding was: Metro is a PITA to deploy apps. Ofsted recognise this and say don't bother - instead let the users do it. I return top my point about 5 year olds. Does anyone really think we should be wasting time trying to get 5 year olds to sign in with a Live ID (complete with strong password) to find and install an app? As for comments about 'the Apple way', not so long ago I would have agreed, but now we have VPP and MDM. It's not the Apple way any more. Their way is better. Edited January 23, 2013 by AngryTechnician
CyberNerd Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 I return top my point about 5 year olds. Does anyone really think we should be wasting time trying to get 5 year olds to sign in with a Live ID (complete with strong password) to find and install an app? The passwords should be age appropriate. I don't know what age is appropriate to teach students to install apps - current thinking seems to be 'never'.
AngryTechnician Posted January 23, 2013 Author Posted January 23, 2013 The passwords should be age appropriate. Our normal ones are. But I'm not convinced that Live ID will accept three letter words in lowercase.
CyberNerd Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 Our normal ones are. But I'm not convinced that Live ID will accept three letter words in lowercase. You should be able to use a single sign on method and link it to your AD so that you control the passwords - I can do this with Google so I'm sure it's possible.
RabbieBurns Posted January 24, 2013 Posted January 24, 2013 (edited) having a liveID isnt an issue for us as we use live@edu so all students have one anyway.. its the issue of having to login to the app store with it every time you log into a device, and then install apps. You can I belive link your domain credtials with your liveID, but this is a manual thing the users have to do there is no way to manage this for all your users. Also I believe that when accounts are linked like this, the apps you have installed will remember and auto install on subsequent devices, but only 5 devices. http://www.edugeek.net/forums/windows-8/103670-windows-8-windows-rt-product-guide.html I questioned it here but no-one had an answer. Edited January 24, 2013 by RabbieBurns
plexer Posted January 24, 2013 Posted January 24, 2013 They have a live id now but will they have one when you move to 365? Ben
gshaw Posted January 24, 2013 Posted January 24, 2013 is there no live id with 365? Nope, it's a "Microsoft online services" account or ADFS federation. The only accounts that will have LiveIDs are legacy ones that already have SkyDrive.
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