Apple Training Session

[GrumbleDook]

Solutions-inc, a leading Apple Solutions Expert, are holding a Wireless Technologies seminar that is free to education establishments on 1st February at their training centre in Brighton.

 

For more details and to register please visit the registration webpage on the Solutions-inc website.

[kingswood]

It looks more like a sales workshop where they get you in a room and push you into letting their sales reps visit your school...

 

Maybe I need more sleep...

[kingswood]

Yeah ... I heard that your boss wants to be an "Apple School" as part of the Arts thing ... I had to explain to my boss that we already have a good relationship with Apple and you don't actually get anything extra out of it ... and that you don't get anything for free.

 

The session should also be a good chance to network with others who want to make use of Macs in schools and to share some ideas ... unfortunately I am already double-booked that day or I would be along.

 

Really? Where did you hear that then? You shouldn't trust everything you hear you know.

 

The option to go fully Apple for the new build was one I put on the table. But it all goes out to tender. As a Specialist Arts school I happen to think it would offer us huge advantages for the education we offer students in the specialism we have been awarded and worked for. Our media department are working hard to integrate Apples into the network and with orders for more Macs coming it's something we need to address.

 

Is the *option* to go fully Apple blind? Not at all. I am in touch with a senior engineer/consultant at Apple UK and I'm not entirely happy with some of the answers I have been given. I am glad that the issue will be resolved to tender. So in that way if Apple want to bid to provide for the school's future they can and they *may* win. They may not. Other options include thin client (which I am happy about) and vanilla network with mixed Apple and Windows clients (again, very happy about).

 

As for the Training Solutions wireless workshop/seminar/sales pitch: yes it would be a good networking opportunity and it's something I rarely get the chance to have a bit at. Particularly now that I am on my own and running a very large split-site network.

 

Thanks Tony.

[kingswood]

One extra point: if you aren't getting something out of your relationship with Apple in addition to just using Apples in school, something is wrong.

[GrumbleDook]

Yeah ... I heard that your boss wants to be an "Apple School" as part of the Arts thing ... I had to explain to my boss that we already have a good relationship with Apple and you don't actually get anything extra out of it ... and that you don't get anything for free.

 

The session should also be a good chance to network with others who want to make use of Macs in schools and to share some ideas ... unfortunately I am already double-booked that day or I would be along.

[GrumbleDook]

One extra point: if you aren't getting something out of your relationship with Apple in addition to just using Apples in school, something is wrong.

 

Unfortunately the way that Apple deal with most schools is "here ... speak to an ASE" and then they give the ASE limited resources depending on what the latest drive is (which is to open commercial stores at the moment). Anything technical and the attitude from the people higher up the Apple chain is "Technical? go to an ASE ... we are not interested"

 

Finding a good ASE that will always be able to get the best out of Apple is hard as they have to able to deal with a chunk of the internal politics. Having spoken with a good number of ASEs and a few other people a common problem is that Apple will undercut the ASEs on price when you deal directly but then tell you to go to an ASE for help ... but if you buy from the ASE they will help you anyway.

 

Having a direct technical contact is fantastic ... and worth clinging on to ... have you managed to get down to Stockley Park yet?

[Sean-OC04]

Unfortunately the way that Apple deal with most schools is "here ... speak to an ASE" and then they give the ASE limited resources depending on what the latest drive is (which is to open commercial stores at the moment). Anything technical and the attitude from the people higher up the Apple chain is "Technical? go to an ASE ... we are not interested"

 

Finding a good ASE that will always be able to get the best out of Apple is hard as they have to able to deal with a chunk of the internal politics. Having spoken with a good number of ASEs and a few other people a common problem is that Apple will undercut the ASEs on price when you deal directly but then tell you to go to an ASE for help ... but if you buy from the ASE they will help you anyway.

 

Having a direct technical contact is fantastic ... and worth clinging on to ... have you managed to get down to Stockley Park yet?

 

Tony,

 

The reason Apple will always refer you back to an ASE when it starts to get technical is that they only have about 3 or 4 preseales technical people in the whole of the U.K. These people will only work on Apple's direct accounts ie BBC, Mirror Group, Sky.

 

I don't know what other ASE's have told you but we have lots of engineers who are Apple Certified. I myself am Final Cut Pro Certified and I am in field sales....

[GrumbleDook]

Hiya Sean ... I really meant about ASEs who understand the context of education ... and yep, yourselves, Solutions-Inc, Toucan, AT, etc are folk that are good to talk with ... but there are times when Apple will promise to deliver on stuff, then push it down to an ASE and then step back and treat it as if it was someone else's problem.

 

I've been at the end of some of theses deals ... discounted iMacs only to find they are the previous line and had been warehoused, which get delivered to the school 2 months before the agreed time and with the clock ticking on the warranty ... failing to deal with repeated support issues and pushing it back to the ASE to deal with in spite of the ASE also pushing back to Apple as a problem as it is an Apple problem ... not just a fix-up job. At that point the politics kick in and some of you are darned good of managing the relationship with Apple ... some ASEs are not. I've seen too many good folk leave the edu side at Apple over the years and have limited hope of them really understanding schools. The attitude to BSF is "hey ... we have so many answers about what the school of the future is going to look like but we aren't going to bid to get involved. You can come to us to buy kit though!" and when challenged 3 years ago about it and the attitude towards in-house support staff wanting to share expertise and do things themselves it was a categorical "Do the official training if you must, but you should be buying support in from an ASE and we can't see the point in in-house staff anyway".

 

The swipe is not at the good ASEs, but at Apple's approach to schools for such an innovative company.

[Sean-OC04]

I've been at the end of some of theses deals ... discounted iMacs only to find they are the previous line and had been warehoused, which get delivered to the school 2 months before the agreed time and with the clock ticking on the warranty ... failing to deal with repeated support issues and pushing it back to the ASE to deal with in spite of the ASE also pushing back to Apple as a problem as it is an Apple problem ... not just a fix-up job. At that point the politics kick in and some of you are darned good of managing the relationship with Apple ... some ASEs are not.

 

Buying a load of discounted iMacs only to find they had been warehoused is a practice that should have been outlawed. This is all about the difference between an ASE and Apple if you have a good relationship with an ASE and as long as they are any good this should never happen. Hey I've been telling customers about to order new kit to wait until after a press keynote in the states has happened in case there are new models about to be released....

 

 

I've seen too many good folk leave the edu side at Apple over the years and have limited hope of them really understanding schools. The attitude to BSF is "hey ... we have so many answers about what the school of the future is going to look like but we aren't going to bid to get involved. You can come to us to buy kit though!" and when challenged 3 years ago about it and the attitude towards in-house support staff wanting to share expertise and do things themselves it was a categorical "Do the official training if you must, but you should be buying support in from an ASE and we can't see the point in in-house staff anyway".

 

Apple simply do not have the in house expertise in Europe to support this type of venture, they have in the past asked ASE's like ourslves to speak to a customer who has a big project they are looking for some help with.

 

The swipe is not at the good ASEs, but at Apple's approach to schools for such an innovative company.