What's the minimum and recommended upload speed for hosting own servers

[HodgeHi]

Hello,

We would like to host our own servers in school and would love to hear some advice on the recommended (obviously the more the better) upload speed but also would like to know the minimum speed. A speed that will run it effectively for more than one user

We may be getting a increase to 8Mb and possibly looking to negotiate the upload speed if possible so would like to know where abouts to aim for to gat a reasonably reliable service.

Also how much does it affect your download service when running one internally?

Thanks for any feedback and advice in advance.

[kennylang74]

HodgeHi,

Can you please provide some more detail on what you want to achieve first.

I'm assuming you want to host your own web servers, and from the bandwidth you have mentioned, it's an ADSL line of some kind that you have in place.

The answer to your question is dependant on what you want to run on these servers and what traffic you anticipate. For example, is at a VLE or the school website you want to run etc and how many users do you anticipate using the service etc.

Further to this, you will need to invest in some edge security products (eg firewall etc) and implement server security best practice techniques (eg server hardening etc).

Get back to me with some more detail and I'll help where I can.

Cheers,

Kenny

[HodgeHi]

Sorry its a little vague but its only just started happening. At the moment it is an adsl line (2Mb). Our ISP is RM and we may be looking to get it increased to 8Mb.

We will be hosting out Web site (Joomla), VLE, and also mail server. (is it wise on one server?). I do not know the upload speed at the moment of the 8Mb connection. I expect if we take the total amount of pupils we have and they all connect together, 300 at a time.

We currently have an RM managed firewall router with their internet filtering on top. We also have a smoothwall school guardian box behind this firewall as well also running its own firewall. I could put it in the DMZ of the School guardian box which should result in a firewall sandwich i suppose. This is all going to be tested as i am not too sure how i will go about all of this yet?

[somabc]

If you have ADSLmax and with an 8Mbps line speed it sounds like you do then you will get 832 kbps up. ADSL2 can get you up to 2.5Mbps up generally and SDSL (synchronous i.e. same upload and download) can get you from 2Mbps up/down up to around 45Mbps in Major Cities. You can also get 10/100Mbps and even 10Gbps leased lines if you have the money. At the top end there are products like BT Wavestream using fibre.

If you want to run a small website & mail server then 1-2Mbps might be ok? Although renting a dedicated server or VPS in a data centre could be a lot more cost effective and reliable.

[powdarrmonkey]

It's upload that will kill you, on a 2Mb line it's usually pathetic (often around 448K). If you want more than one or two users, you're looking at SDSL or even multiple bonded lines.

[kennylang74]

If you upgrade to 8Mbps you might be OK (again depending on usage) but I would recommend developing a thorough test plan that would be based around the kind of load you expect for 300 concurrent connections. However, I would agree with powdarrmonkey that you might hit a brick wall with slow upload speeds and may need to head towards SDSL etc.

I don't know if you are completely tied into RM, but you can get 24Mbps download / 2.5Mbps upload speeds with Be at present for a reasonably low monthly subscription:

https://www.bethere.co.uk/

You seem to have the security components in place, but I don't know how much freedom you will get to configure the kit to match your needs given that it's RM managed.

Ideally, (in my humble opinion) it would be best to split the mail server and VLE/website components. However, if you only have funds for one server then you might not have any other choice. Again, the solution is dependant on your email setup and what kind of mail server you have etc.

Cheers,

Kenny

[tom_newton]

Also consider: would this be used during "normal hours" - if so, might be as well slinging in an extra ADSL and giving the server its own dedicated line.

As long as you are careful with size of content (I think VLE could pose a problem here) you would be surprised what you can do with DSL. Big files will wipe it out though - remember that your upstream speed is going to be lower than one user's downstream, so if you allow them a 5 min download, you'll be scuppered.

Other options.. depends on how much these servers need to "talk" to local stuff... you could always host big static stuff elsewhere....

[bizzel]

When you're hosting content, as opposed to consuming it, your bandwidth needs are effectively reversed. You'll have a small amount of requests coming down the pipe but each request requires a substantial amount of data to be sent outbound.

Like some others have said, what you really need is a symmetric connection with equal upload and download (and preferably no cap!). I'd look at a second, dedicated line otherwise your response times for the site could go through the roof when the students are saturating your connection during the day.

[Michael]

There's no reason why you can't host your Web site (Joomla), VLE, and also mail server on one server, but it really depends for how many users.

Do your LA not offer hosting in some form? Here in Birmingham all three are hosted by Birmingham Council themselves who have invested heavily in a fiber infrastructure giving schools a dedicated 10Mbps or 100Mbps for the larger establishments.

Hosting in-house does have its advantages in your situation. The majority of staff/pupils would check their e-mail and use the VLE within school time, so internet connectivity would only be used for (primarily) receiving/sending mail and internet browsing.

I think conducting a survey would be advisable to work out what percentage of users would check their mail etc outside of school. The 400K upload isn't a lot, but it may just do the job.

[HodgeHi]

Thanks for all the responses. The server that will hold the sites would be a quad-core XServe with currently 2GB RAM and a 80 GB HDD, although by the time it all comes to fruition that will change.

The main reason for hosting it in-house is because of file sizes. Some content will be podcast-based and so more than likely streaming will be involved. I will also be looking at hosting another schools' site on the box too.

We are not part of our LA's network since the school was being demolished when this was being built (yeah that long ago. Its been 12-15 years now) so they thought there would be no point putting the infrastructure in place. So we are on an RM line with a limited amount of cash at the moment. We wouldn't be paying for the upgrade to the new line as we are trying to come to a compromise with the other school that would be hosting here as well. The other reason is FTP time for the other school. Since the files they will be uploading can be quite large, then their upload the the LA's servers takes ages.

[powdarrmonkey]

[QUOTE=HodgeHi;228468]
The main reason for hosting it in-house is because of file sizes. Some content will be podcast-based and so more than likely streaming will be involved. I will also be looking at hosting another schools' site on the box too.
[QUOTE]

You're in need of some serious upload bandwidth if that's what you want to do with it. I would be nervous about putting it on xDSL, have you considered a proper leased line (caution: £££)? Or you could rent a dedicated box from a host at £50/mo.

[powdarrmonkey]

The main reason for hosting it in-house is because of file sizes. Some content will be podcast-based and so more than likely streaming will be involved. I will also be looking at hosting another schools' site on the box too.

You're in need of some serious upload bandwidth if that's what you want to do with it. I would be nervous about putting it on xDSL, have you considered a proper leased line (caution: £££)? Or you could rent a dedicated box from a host at £50/mo. (Dedicated Servers with 10,000GB of monthly data transfer | UK2)

Edit: I don't know why I have two posts...

[tom_newton]

If you have podcasts, I would forget local hosting for them - that's a lowish-bandwidth application, but it's a long runner - so a couple overlapping could really ruin your day.

What I suggest is, if you want to host locally, also get a cheap'n'cheerful webhost with a unix shell. Adapt your VLE such that uploaded content gets rsync'd to your remote host nightly. If you're really clever, you could have it serve locally until the high-speed copy was available, but that's showboating - course you might want to get really swish and go remote for remote users and local for local... eek.

I remember the "gallery" image gallery having a feature like this, you might look there for ideas.