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Windows Thread, Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted in Technical; always glad to help stewart Nath...
  1. #16
    tarquel's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    always glad to help stewart

    Nath

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    mark's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    To come back to this...

    I thought this was a very good idea [giving teachers read only access instead of full] for the reasons outlined above. I now have my Head of IT on my back trying to force me to reinstate full permissions for staff.
    His reason: He has some pictures on a camera he wants to put into the kids folders.

    I too have always had a whole school access share I open up for full access to students when needed [if I leave it open it just gets abused, although of course the ownership of the files always gives away the culprit :twisted:], Year Group read only shares, and a For Marking drop folder - write only.

    So the Head of IT could always drop the files in one of the read shares for the kids to pick up themselves.

    I intend to air the issue with the Head to get a policy statement on this. Just wondered if anyone could think of reasons for and against so we can make a more informed descision. [Not that I don't think the temptation to cheat argument isn't very good reasoning.]

    Cheers.

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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    The arguement goes something like this.

    The understanding of correct file management is essential for students, both as part of their ICT lessons and in the general world outside when they seek employment.

    It is common practice for resources to be place *once* in a central store that users then access and collate only the exact resources they need (ie only 10 of the 24 files made available). The choosing of the correct files constitutes a valuable skill of research.

    In addition to this, although the price of storage has seriously decreased, would it be fair to allow a teacher (or HoD) to place 30 1 MB photos on a central store when they know students will only use 3 or 4 pictures, or should the teacher put all 30 on each home area of 200+ students. The difference is around 200 MB (after the students have of course only chosen the pictures they need, and then converted them to jpeg files of the relevant quality to save space - another valuable skill they should be demonstrating) or 6 - 8 GB ...

    Also, there is the small matter of the valuable time of teaching staff. It is far quicker and more efficient for a teacher to leave the files in a central location once, than to copy them to 200 locations. To copy them to this many would be an admin task, and probably have the unions demanding that you subsequently give that teacher 3 days to lie down afterwards (ok ... getting silly now ... but you get the idea)

    Educationally ... a teacher might say that they want to make sure the student really gets the files ... the response is "yes ... the student may have them in their home area now that you have put them there, but there is nothing to say that they know they are there or that they will use them. By forcing them to collect them from a central read only store then you know that they know what they are and what they are for."

    I have more arguements on this if needed ... I have been collecting them from uk.ed.schools-it for the last few years.

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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    I have resisted having an area 'open' for all students as these quickly fill up with junk. Staff have write access to an resources folder which the kids have read access on. This folder is organised into subject areas so i know who to nag if it starts getting messy/bloated (especially this time of year, when shrek2.avi files start appearing on network shares)


  5. #20
    mark's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Just had the meeting to make a policy descision on staff write access to student home folders.

    The very strong thrust of the discussion was that teaching staff should be allowed write access to mark childrens work. They should be able to open a word file for example, even if the work wasn't completed but a work in progress, add comments to that file for the student to see.

    The Head want's to talk with people that have read only access rights for Teachers so that she can see the educational reasoning. Any offers?

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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Quote Originally Posted by mark
    Just had the meeting to make a policy descision on staff write access to student home folders.

    The very strong thrust of the discussion was that teaching staff should be allowed write access to mark childrens work. They should be able to open a word file for example, even if the work wasn't completed but a work in progress, add comments to that file for the student to see.

    The Head want's to talk with people that have read only access rights for Teachers so that she can see the educational reasoning. Any offers?
    How can you prove is its been commented rather than changed? This leaves staff free to modify work to improve grades does it not? I can also see work being inadvertantly damaged.

    Will they only be able to modify existing work or write new files, what level of auditing will be in place to prove who wrote files to the students folder in the case of inappropriate material? Read only access protects the students and the teachers. I can't justify write here plus I also got fed up of searching for students folders after teachers dragged and dropped them elsewhere when we had write access on netware.

  7. #22
    mark's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Thanks very much DMC - very good points

  8. #23
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    hehe No thanks

    I have no need for it and you can tell her that not one of the teachers has asked me why they cant write to the pupils folders.

    The logical way to do it is on a "pool"-style share mapped to a drive. Have a specific folder that both teachers and pupils can write to.

    The other way is if they want to do it digitally, send the teacher it via email with a certain dead line. The teacher can save the files from the email and then mark it and return it marked if needs be...converted to a pdf even lol

    There is plenty of ways for not needing write access to pupils folders - and i think in my earlier posts, I mentioned the possible foul play aspect - that alone is good enough reason i'd say.



    EDIT: Sorry guys - was too slow in replying yet again

    Nath

  9. #24

    Geoff's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    What about using Shadow Copy? That will enable you to restore previous versions of files.

  10. #25
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Does anyone know the configuration of RM Connect 3?

    A local school is saying they think it's staff write access by default.

    I was asked by my Head to do a survey of High Schools in our authority, and 12 out of 12 do not give write access to teachers.

  11. #26
    mark's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Russ tells me the default config of cc3 is no access, although they have some fancy shmancy shared area thing.

    An update:

    My Head has cancelled all bets and made a decision before taking up the kind offer of Tony to speak with her. She has made a ruling that any member of staff that requests it can have full write access to students work directly in thier home area.

    I set up a discussion on the topic but ended up being attacked and accused of trying to force the Head Teacher to do what I said. All along It was said that this was her descision to make. She'd asked me to gather facts which I did, and present reasons that full access shouldn't be given. In the end I think it's her that carries the can, and I said that I was happy to abide by her descision. It all went horribly wrong I shouldn't say more for fear of litigation here. Suffice to say, watch out for the politics!

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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    I feel for you Mark.

    All I can say is make sure the backups are good and plenty, document every cock-up that others make and cover your back.

    Yep ... it is the Head's decision, and if it goes wrong just make sure you are not the scapegoat ...

  13. #28

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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Make sure that you document who ha access if it is on a per user basis!

  14. #29
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Make sure you have auditing on as well so you can see who has done what.

  15. #30
    mark's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help!!! Year 10 folders have been deleted

    Ric: The write access for staff that request it is on all student files/ folders. I can't think of an efficient way of enabling access only to specific users - I only have users grouped by year. Class groups are fluid.

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