+ Post New Thread
Results 1 to 14 of 14
Windows Thread, Weird Problem or Unexpected Bonus in Technical; Long story condensing a go go... Kids comes in saying his quota is full. Checked his H drive (redirected via ...
  1. #1

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    51
    Thank Post
    4
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0

    Weird Problem or Unexpected Bonus

    Long story condensing a go go...

    Kids comes in saying his quota is full. Checked his H drive (redirected via AD to a network share) and found a hidden RECYCLER folder full of all the stuff he'd studiously tried to delete to free up space.

    Did a test where he went to a room, deleted his stuff, went to another machine and recovered it so I know it's a fully functioning recyle bin.

    Now this is super, but... I have no idea how it's working. I thought it wasn't possible using XP and Server 2003?

    I've gone thorugh a process of elimination and took the profile out of the equation, leaving only the GPO settings. But other than Desktop (network share), Start Menu (network share) and Application Data (C:\Appdata) re-directions, I can't see what's making it work.

    Like I say, it's a good thing as it means no more 'can I get all my work back I just did this second and deleted it' problems, but it does mean my file server is rapidly filling up with RECYCLER folders in each users area.

    Any ideas... anyone?

  2. #2

    dhicks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Knightsbridge
    Posts
    5,654
    Thank Post
    1,258
    Thanked 781 Times in 678 Posts
    Rep Power
    236
    Quote Originally Posted by hagridsbeard View Post
    Any ideas... anyone?
    A nightly, or maybe weekly, scheduled task that runs a script that simply deletes, or empties, all RECYCLER folders on the server? Frees up your disk space, but the pupil can still get their work back if they have an oops-didn't-mean-that moment.

    --
    David Hicks

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    51
    Thank Post
    4
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    I was thinking something like that.

    We have incremental backups each night (except a full on Friday) so I could run a cleanup script of all RECYCLER folders after the backup, meaning that students can restore their own work if they catch it during that day, or, we can pretty much get any work back at any time from the backup (restore the RECYCLER folder from the day they deleted it).

    Quite a good position to be in really, but still two questions:

    • Any ideas of a simple script to do what we're suggesting and...
    • Any ideas why has this suddenly started working (WSUS update maybe - at a stretch)

  4. #4

    powdarrmonkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Alcester, Warwickshire
    Posts
    4,859
    Thank Post
    412
    Thanked 777 Times in 650 Posts
    Rep Power
    182
    This is standard behaviour. You will find that if files are removed from the My Documents path, they are recycled, but if removed from a mapped drive they are destroyed immediately. I preserve the disk space by 'emptying' the recycle bin for the user with a logoff script (the deltree command is your friend, as long as you're nice to it).

  5. Thanks to powdarrmonkey from:

    hagridsbeard (28th April 2009)

  6. #5

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    London
    Posts
    3,157
    Thank Post
    116
    Thanked 529 Times in 452 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2
    Rep Power
    124
    You've redirected "my documents" to a network share. By default, anything deleted from "my docs" goes in the recycle bin and that's still true even if it's now on a network share.

    I don't think this is well documented (and I may not have it completely right; I'm just writing from my experience)

    There's an equally poorly documented registry value which stops this behaviour; create a DWORD value called NukeOnDelete at the registry key HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\Explorer\BitBucket and set its value to 1 (0 or absent means files go in the bin)

    having the recycle bin is not necessarily a bad thing as long as your users know about it and you give them a way to get at the bin and empty it or get files back from it.

    If you want to script emptying it then something like this would work (put it in a batch file)

    Code:
    d:
    cd \home
    for /d %%i in (*) do rd "%%i\recycler" /s /q
    This assumes that your user home folders are something like d:\home\user1; d:\home\user2 etc. If you have them a level further down then you could do:

    Code:
    d:
    cd \home\year9
    for /d %%i in (*) do rd "%%i\recycler" /s /q
    cd \home\year10
    for /d %%i in (*) do rd "%%i\recycler" /s /q

  7. Thanks to srochford from:

    hagridsbeard (28th April 2009)

  8. #6

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    51
    Thank Post
    4
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by powdarrmonkey View Post
    This is standard behaviour. You will find that if files are removed from the My Documents path, they are recycled, but if removed from a mapped drive they are destroyed immediately. I preserve the disk space by 'emptying' the recycle bin for the user with a logoff script (the deltree command is your friend, as long as you're nice to it).
    Think I'm getting you here, just tested and:

    • A file deleted from 'My Computer - student on 'server\students$\student' ( H: )' won't go into the recyle bin
    • A file deleted from 'My Documents' will and can be restored


    This kind of explains why when I was trying to eliminate profiles and GPO it was a bit erratic as sometimes I deleted via 'My Computer' and sometimes 'My Documents'.

    Ok, in that case a new healthy blast of questions:

    • Why do they differ when they go to the same place?
    • How can the My Computer drive be made to work the same way?


    And actually, why the hell am I working on this at this time anyway?

  9. #7

    elsiegee40's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Kent
    Posts
    9,759
    Thank Post
    1,813
    Thanked 2,225 Times in 1,643 Posts
    Rep Power
    800
    The answer I think is to scrap the recycling bin completely and use volume shadow copy. Set up properly it'll hold a couple of weeks worth of backups of network and home drives...

    Admitting that the Previous Versions tab is on folder properties is up to you. It's my little secret ... the bit of magic Mrs G uses to recover work deleted in error (and to prove that pupil x couldn't possibly have saved her work at 12.25 before going to lunch last week ... Volume Shadow copies taken at 12.30pm and 7pm here!)

  10. #8

    powdarrmonkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Alcester, Warwickshire
    Posts
    4,859
    Thank Post
    412
    Thanked 777 Times in 650 Posts
    Rep Power
    182
    Quote Originally Posted by hagridsbeard View Post
    Think I'm getting you here, just tested and:

    • A file deleted from 'My Computer - student on 'server\students$\student' ( H: )' won't go into the recyle bin
    • A file deleted from 'My Documents' will and can be restored


    This kind of explains why when I was trying to eliminate profiles and GPO it was a bit erratic as sometimes I deleted via 'My Computer' and sometimes 'My Documents'.
    Yeh, I spent hours one day trying to convince myself I wasn't going mad, until I worked out what the difference was!


    Ok, in that case a new healthy blast of questions:

    • Why do they differ when they go to the same place?
    • How can the My Computer drive be made to work the same way?
    Well, although the storage location is identical, the My * folders have always been treated differently and I think it's just The Way Things Are. I did try and make a mapped drive behave the same using the BitBucket settings in the registry, but it didn't work very well and I didn't have much time to spare for it, so we left it as it was. I just emptied the bin during logoff so that, as long as the circumstances were right, users at least got a second chance at their deleted documents during that session.

    And actually, why the hell am I working on this at this time anyway?
    As to that, I can't help you

  11. Thanks to powdarrmonkey from:

    hagridsbeard (28th April 2009)

  12. #9

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    51
    Thank Post
    4
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by elsiegee40 View Post
    The answer I think is to scrap the recycling bin completely and use volume shadow copy. Set up properly it'll hold a couple of weeks worth of backups of network and home drives...

    Admitting that the Previous Versions tab is on folder properties is up to you. It's my little secret ... the bit of magic Mrs G uses to recover work deleted in error (and to prove that pupil x couldn't possibly have saved her work at 12.25 before going to lunch last week ... Volume Shadow copies taken at 12.30pm and 7pm here!)
    Hmm, I dunno. Considering what the others guys have mentioned, I think I'll have a go at hiding the mapped drive from 'My Computer', that way, they can only ever delete from 'My Documents' and always have the option of immediate recovery.

    Add that to the backup and cleanup method I banded around earlier, and I think I've got a pretty damn flawless recovery setup.

    Weird that they work so differently even though both locations are doing exactly the same re-direction.

    Windows is a crazy beast.

  13. #10

    powdarrmonkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Alcester, Warwickshire
    Posts
    4,859
    Thank Post
    412
    Thanked 777 Times in 650 Posts
    Rep Power
    182
    Quote Originally Posted by hagridsbeard View Post
    Hmm, I dunno. Considering what the others guys have mentioned, I think I'll have a go at hiding the mapped drive from 'My Computer', that way, they can only ever delete from 'My Documents' and always have the option of immediate recovery.
    That might cause more problems than it solves. Some poor software, for example, can't deal with redirected folders or UNC paths and insists on saving to a mapped drive (in some strange delusion that it's a physical drive). You'll have to give it a go and see what doesn't work.

    You might be able to do away with home drives altogether if you can configure folder redirection with a %USERNAME% variable and you have your share laid out in a sensible way. I don't know, I've never tried it.

  14. #11

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    51
    Thank Post
    4
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by powdarrmonkey View Post
    That might cause more problems than it solves. Some poor software, for example, can't deal with redirected folders or UNC paths and insists on saving to a mapped drive (in some strange delusion that it's a physical drive). You'll have to give it a go and see what doesn't work.

    You might be able to do away with home drives altogether if you can configure folder redirection with a %USERNAME% variable and you have your share laid out in a sensible way. I don't know, I've never tried it.
    All food for thought. At least I've got a better idea why it's happening now, like you said, I was going round in circles trying to understand what was going on and it was driving me mad.

    Think for now I'll just clear the RECYCLERs periodically and leave it up to the more aware students to recover files that they delete.

    Cheers for all your advice/pointers, at least I'm not completely crazy.

  15. #12
    leco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    West Yorkshire
    Posts
    2,026
    Thank Post
    595
    Thanked 125 Times in 119 Posts
    Rep Power
    41
    Quote Originally Posted by hagridsbeard View Post
    Cheers for all your advice/pointers, at least I'm not completely crazy.
    Only a bit crazy - like the rest of us - for working on it at this time of night

  16. #13

    dhicks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Knightsbridge
    Posts
    5,654
    Thank Post
    1,258
    Thanked 781 Times in 678 Posts
    Rep Power
    236
    Quote Originally Posted by elsiegee40 View Post
    The answer I think is to scrap the recycling bin completely and use volume shadow copy.
    Needs to be in there overnight (or whenever your backup job runs) for the file to get in to the backup copy, which still leaves plenty of opportunity for pupils to delete stuff they've been working on all lesson/day. Could make your deleting script check the modification date of each item in the RECYCLER folder and only delete stuff that's more than or equal to two days old.

    --
    David Hicks

  17. #14
    ascott2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    181
    Thank Post
    18
    Thanked 37 Times in 29 Posts
    Rep Power
    20
    I haven't teste this yet but, as far as I am aware, if you do not want this to happen you can enable in group policy to bypass the Recycle bin and delete files. This will disable the RECYCLER folder being created in the first place.

    User Configuration > Administrative Templates > Windows Components >Windows Explorer > Do not move deleted files to the Recycle Bin
    Last edited by ascott2; 29th April 2009 at 01:51 PM. Reason: missed out Windows Components

SHARE:
+ Post New Thread

Similar Threads

  1. Weird Word problem
    By localzuk in forum Windows
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 2nd April 2009, 03:53 PM
  2. weird Logon Problem
    By timbo343 in forum Windows
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 16th September 2008, 11:08 AM
  3. Weird problem
    By akatuk in forum How do you do....it?
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10th October 2007, 08:30 PM
  4. Promethean weird problem
    By sbutterworthtj in forum Windows
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 19th June 2007, 09:37 PM
  5. Weird AD problem
    By SpuffMonkey in forum Windows
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 29th March 2006, 10:57 AM

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •