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Windows Thread, XP availability in Technical; Originally Posted by gwendes Vista felt the need to harrass me constantly asking whether I /really/ wanted to be doing ...
  1. #16

    localzuk's Avatar
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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by gwendes
    Vista felt the need to harrass me constantly asking whether I /really/ wanted to be doing x to my computer... when I turned off this hypervisor-like feature it refused to install new software and threw up error messages.

    I just think there should be an 'admin' mode where it accepts what you are doing without question - at the moment it behaves like a 3-year-old - CONSTANT questions.

    They've made it unbearable for me to use (as an advanced Windows user) and therefore I can't help out people getting stuck with randomly moved features.
    I think that feature is actually a very good feature for the average user. OS X has a similar function and it does a good job. I don't turn it off even though I'm an 'advanced windows user' as it helps protect against software trying to install itself without my knowledge.


    While I'm at it - WHY have Microsoft been removing the 'File' toolbar? Is it THAT ugly? I find it very useful.
    It is still there - just press the alt key.

    I don't think it's a good idea for the end user to have things changed for the hell of it... that makes more work for me and my colleagues.
    That isn't the point - the point is that the new way of doing things is supposed to make life easier once you have got used to it. And in Office 2007, for example, it does. The ribbon is superb, with its keyboard shortcuts for every function.

    And btw - I don't know about anyone else but I was delighted with XP from day one... it took a little getting used to but at least there was still a 'Start' button
    I hated XP when I got it... And the start button is still there in Vista, it just isn't named Start. This shows how far you are willing to go to slag off the new OS though...

  2. #17
    gwendes's Avatar
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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by NickJones
    ... so I figured I might as well get on and learn it.
    This was exactly my thinking until it drained my energy with all it's whinging and moaning...

    I think Windows XP Ultimate (feat. DX10) is a winner

  3. #18
    enjay's Avatar
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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by gwendes
    This was exactly my thinking until it drained my energy with all it's whinging and moaning...
    I would agree with you that for someone like you or I, the feature is annoying - which is why I took the 30 seconds necessary to turn it off - but for the average home user, it seems like a good thing (how many PCs have you worked on where the owner did something daft without realising it, or without fully understanding the consequences?). The 'blind trust admin mode' which you yearn for is there, but rather than enable it, you simply disable the 'doubt everything user mode'.

    I must say, it does seem like you're overly keen to criticise without having given it a chance to get used to it, complaining about absent Start buttons (which are still there, in the same place even), removed File menus (which can be quickly returned if you wish to waste the screen space, but try right-clicking instead) and constant nags from security settings (which are easily disabled). All that said, some of the changes are purely for the sake of it (translucent title bars - why?!), but the vast majority of them are for the better, I think.

    I wonder if you had decided before using it that Vista was change for change's sake and were going to hate it, so did. Or, since you say you jumped straight into "early Beta releases" and had instability and CPU-hammering problems, perhaps its worth giving the more ironed release version a try.

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Re: XP availability

    The translucent title bars can be explained by the ipod. People buy ipod's not because they are the best music players, but because they look stylish. People want their systems to look good - and this goes down to the toolbars and other aspects of the GUI too.

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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk
    The translucent title bars can be explained by the ipod. People buy ipod's not because they are the best music players, but because they look stylish. People want their systems to look good - and this goes down to the toolbars and other aspects of the GUI too.
    Yeah, I see your point. I've got a dark wallpaper though (a black-and-white image), so they irritate me as they can make it very hard to read what they say.

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    Re: XP availability

    vistas not half bad once you work out the 100,000 preliminary kinks, just a matter of turning all the crap off, removing the pop up boxes that ask you EVERY time you do something (yes it can be turned off if you didnt know)

    a few more kinks have been worked out with the SP1 RC1 (not using that at home until its out of beta though) my biggest issue now is just the layout, the performance and overall usability is actually pretty good, its just getting to know where everything is

    and have they actually done away with thumbnail views? you can make the icons huge, but cant see the picture in a thumbnail anymore :S perhaps this is a business version thing?

    biggest issue at home is that EVERY time i boot my pc i have to F8 and select "disable driver signiture enforement" otherwise my USB devices are all completely dead

    vistas major downfall with networks is that anything under a top end single core or AMD4000/IntelE2140 is also pretty pointless and that anything under 2GB is limiting its abilities unless you spend alot of time turning off as much as physicly possible

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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by mrbios
    and have they actually done away with thumbnail views? you can make the icons huge, but cant see the picture in a thumbnail anymore :S
    "Medium" size is a reasonable thumb-nail, or try "Tiles".

  8. #23

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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by mrbios
    vistas not half bad once you work out the 100,000 preliminary kinks, just a matter of turning all the crap off, removing the pop up boxes that ask you EVERY time you do something (yes it can be turned off if you didnt know)

    a few more kinks have been worked out with the SP1 RC1 (not using that at home until its out of beta though) my biggest issue now is just the layout, the performance and overall usability is actually pretty good, its just getting to know where everything is

    and have they actually done away with thumbnail views? you can make the icons huge, but cant see the picture in a thumbnail anymore :S perhaps this is a business version thing?

    biggest issue at home is that EVERY time i boot my pc i have to F8 and select "disable driver signiture enforement" otherwise my USB devices are all completely dead

    vistas major downfall with networks is that anything under a top end single core or AMD4000/IntelE2140 is also pretty pointless and that anything under 2GB is limiting its abilities unless you spend alot of time turning off as much as physicly possible
    No offence and not trying to start a flame war but just funny how you start off with saying vistas not half bad but then you go onto explain a lot of the issues and stating how it has 100,000 kinks lol.

  9. #24
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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by NickJones
    Quote Originally Posted by mrbios
    and have they actually done away with thumbnail views? you can make the icons huge, but cant see the picture in a thumbnail anymore :S
    "Medium" size is a reasonable thumb-nail, or try "Tiles".
    well, i can get the size right but what i mean is the way it shows the actual picture rather than a file logo - sorry im really tired cant get the words out but im sure you know what i mean

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    Re: XP availability

    i guess i should retype that too "vistas not too bad once you spend a few hours fixing it, after that it runs ok" :P

    i know we expect to install things and have them work, but being experts (to some degree) at least we know what we're doing to get it to run properly

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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by mrbios
    Quote Originally Posted by NickJones
    Quote Originally Posted by mrbios
    and have they actually done away with thumbnail views? you can make the icons huge, but cant see the picture in a thumbnail anymore :S
    "Medium" size is a reasonable thumb-nail, or try "Tiles".
    well, i can get the size right but what i mean is the way it shows the actual picture rather than a file logo - sorry im really tired cant get the words out but im sure you know what i mean
    I know exactly what you mean, and for me both Tiles and Medium show the actual image. I note that under Organise > Folder Options there's a tick box saying "always display icon, not thumbnails" - might be worth checking that is clear on your PC.

    As an aside, I find the huge thumbnails really useful when trying to find the better of two similar photos, e.g. group photos on field trips or something. Much quicker than opening them both up.

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    Re: XP availability

    Quote Originally Posted by mrbios
    i know we expect to install things and have them work, but being experts (to some degree) at least we know what we're doing to get it to run properly
    Really? The first thing I do whenever I install something is dive into the options and re-configure it, anti-virus and firewall programs especially!

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    Re: XP availability

    ah ok cheers for that, didnt know about being able to turn it on and off

    I agree that everything thats ever installed is instantly modified in some way, but with vista its a bit more OTT than just changing a few settings

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    Re: XP availability

    I hated XP when I got it
    I kinda did too, although it was the look rather than the usability. Blue and green on the taskbar with "rolling hills" in the background? nasty! For as long as I can remember I've always set my PC and laptop to use the Windows Classic appearance. To me its always looked more professional. The default XP *looks* like it was made to be used at home, by children IMO.

    Maybe thats why the kids here are so much better at using it than the staff?

    I have to say, I do really like the look of Vista, but OK, I'll also admit that I'm one of those people who enjoy flashy-cool-looking things.


    vistas major downfall with networks is that anything under a top end single core or AMD4000/IntelE2140 is also pretty pointless and that anything under 2GB is limiting its abilities
    Uhuh, thats why I basically plan to make a gradual introduction of Vista to our network, only getting it when we actually *have* to replace a PC or laptop - looking like 4 or 5 planned this year, maybe more if things work well (or if existing stuff breaks!).


    The first thing I do whenever I install something is dive into the options and re-configure it
    Me too! Guess thats just my natural inclination to fiddle with things


    I read a comment by someone on a Vista review article, which said something like

    All these things people are complaining about Vista are the same things people complained about when XP first came around. Seems people like to read the same stories over and over
    Interesting point, I think.

    Whatever new invention comes around, wether its software, hardware, OS, or whatever else, its undoubtably not going to work as well as something similar which has been mass used and worked on progressively for the past 6.5 years.
    But I'll bet that Vista will surpass XP soon enough, once enough people have given it time to expand and be used and improved, and 6 years from now, we'll all be happily using Vista, worrying about the next version of Windows that is coming in 6 months time, and be wondering why we thought XP was so god-like anyway.

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    Re: XP availability

    All these things people are complaining about Vista are the same things people complained about when XP first came around. Seems people like to read the same stories over and over
    Some people ditched windows altogether after enduring XP. OSX usage is hitting 8% whilst vista adoption is stagnating.

    compare it to the first eleven months of Windows XP, back in 2001 and 2002. In that period, that operating system went from nothing to 36 percent usage on PCWorld.com--more than 250 percent of the usage that Vista has mustered so far.
    http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,137635/article.html

    At some point somebody at my school will ask for it, and I will deploy it as soon as I am qualified to do so, naturally at my employers expense. Windows stopped being fun for me a long time ago, now it's just a job. I still learn new, exciting technologies at my own expense (time). For Vista I'll need to get paid to learn it (MCP) because otherwise I will point blank refuse to have anything to do with it.

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