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Windows Vista Thread, Becta still don't like Vista. in Technical; http://publications.becta.org.uk/dow...fm?resID=35275 More obvious advice: "We advise that upgrading existing ICT systems to Vista is not recommended" "We believe that Vista ...
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    Becta still don't like Vista.

    http://publications.becta.org.uk/dow...fm?resID=35275

    More obvious advice:

    "We advise that upgrading existing ICT systems to Vista is not recommended"

    "We believe that Vista can be considered where new institution-wide ICT
    provision is being planned"

    [docx format is currently a pain etc.]

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    Quote Originally Posted by PiqueABoo View Post
    http://publications.becta.org.uk/dow...fm?resID=35275

    More obvious advice:

    "We advise that upgrading existing ICT systems to Vista is not recommended"

    "We believe that Vista can be considered where new institution-wide ICT
    provision is being planned"

    [docx format is currently a pain etc.]
    Pity EVERY SINGLE stand at BETT is using Vista (apart from apple).... talk about mixed messages
    Last edited by Grommit; 11th January 2008 at 10:09 AM.

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    talk about mixed messages
    The only message there is the vendor's "We're up to date and cutting edge, oh yes indeedy, now please give us all your money". If people are daft enough to take that as a recommendation on what to do to their networks then....

    Were there any server 2K8'S to be found (RTM build is apparently just a month away)?

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    tech_guy's Avatar
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    I saw quite a few exhibitors at Bett yesterday running good old xp. And Apple didn't like it because I lingered a bit too long on their stand wearing my ubuntu sweatshirt whilst they were having photos taken....

    :-)

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    Pete10141748's Avatar
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    Maybe its just me, but parts of that report from Becta seem to be contradictive

    There may be advantages to schools running multiple operating systems such as Windows, Linux and Mac...
    ..schools should exorcise thier downgrade rights and stick to Windows XP for a coherent ICT network
    BOTH of those phrases are from the same paragraph in the report!


    Myself and the techician here have been using Vista on our laptop here now for about 2 months, and aside from ironing out a couple of creases at the start + 3 of the schools programs not working on it (they are old prog's though), I'm really happy with using it. Plus Office 2007 is a really good upgrade too.

    I've definately decided that I'm going to slowly introduce them both to the school (getting it whenever we replace a PC or laptop), starting with replacing the 5-year-old PCs in the staffroom; that way the staff are free to have a play with Vista / Office 07 if they want to, in preperation for getting it themselves when thier own equipment is up for being replaced.

    Pete

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    Geoff's Avatar
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    I'm not putting Vista anywhere until I have W2k8 servers to support it properly.

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    I read about this last night here

    To be honest some of Becta's comments are inaccurate, in the example of the Microsoft Office 2007. Sure, by default documents are saved in *.docx, but can still be saved in *.doc and secondly, they're obviously never heard of the Microsoft Compatibility Pack which is free.

    What they also have to realise, schools get absolutely massive discounts on Microsoft software as it is. Until recently one school I work at were using Office XP and Sims.NET, however to export reports in Office you need Office 2003 or later. Buying licenses now are all going to be for the 2007 versions of Office and to be honest, other than learning the new GUI there is no difference.

    As for Windows Vista, there is no real way of getting away from it. The advice I have given schools is stick with XP and we'll review Vista in 2009, by which time it will of matured, applications will of been re-written/updated and computer hardware will be more capable of running the OS.

    I think Becta are being a little bit patronising to schools these days. All schools have computer networks of some kind and often have a permanent IT specialist or can at least buy someone in and advise them of best practices.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tech_guy View Post
    Apple didn't like it because I lingered a bit too long on their stand wearing my ubuntu sweatshirt whilst they were having photos taken....
    I think I'll wear mine too... though it's a toss between Tux top or Ubuntu top...

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    Edu-IT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by webman View Post
    I think I'll wear mine too... though it's a toss between Tux top or Ubuntu top...
    Take both and visit the stand more than once.

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    @Pete10141748 - while those two statements are somewhat contradictory, they're also both correct in some ways. How I read that bit was Becta saying not to run a mixed-Windows environment but that a Windows-and-Mac environment was okay since profiles and user settings are handled differently. You could have all sorts of fun with roaming profiles on a mixed XP/Vista network - just like we've seen with multiple Office versions - but these problems wouldn't exist with a mix of Vista and Mac since they work in completely different ways.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael View Post
    I read about this last night here

    To be honest some of Becta's comments are inaccurate, in the example of the Microsoft Office 2007. Sure, by default documents are saved in *.docx, but can still be saved in *.doc and secondly, they're obviously never heard of the Microsoft Compatibility Pack which is free.
    That is besides the point. The point is that by continuing to have to use the Office package, and upgrading to the new version, there will therefore be a need to have other stakeholders in the school to buy Office 2007 too. The point of updating a document format (ie, going from .doc to .docx) is to allow for new features. If those new features aren't available via the compatibility pack (which not all of them are) and implementing the new format is complex and difficult for competing software companies/organisations (such as openoffice) then it is in essence forcing people into that purchase.

    What they also have to realise, schools get absolutely massive discounts on Microsoft software as it is. Until recently one school I work at were using Office XP and Sims.NET, however to export reports in Office you need Office 2003 or later. Buying licenses now are all going to be for the 2007 versions of Office and to be honest, other than learning the new GUI there is no difference.
    We spend 4000 a year or more on microsoft licensing. That money could very well be spent on other things! It is all well and good saying 'massive discounts' but it still adds up.

    Add in the major interface change and you have yourself a costly upgrade. Major changes of interface require many hours of retraining or time spent 'playing' to learn the new intricacies of the system. Going from Office 2003 to 2007 will be as difficult as going from DOS to Windows was for many people.

    As for Windows Vista, there is no real way of getting away from it. The advice I have given schools is stick with XP and we'll review Vista in 2009, by which time it will of matured, applications will of been re-written/updated and computer hardware will be more capable of running the OS.
    There is a way of getting away from it! The way would be to consider an open source client system or OS X. Then any packages such as SIMS.net can be hosted on a terminal server (either 2003 with something like 2X application server or 2008 when it comes out). The change will be major, but only as major as going to vista and office 2007...

    I think Becta are being a little bit patronising to schools these days. All schools have computer networks of some kind and often have a permanent IT specialist or can at least buy someone in and advise them of best practices.
    No, Becta are not being patronising. They are doing their job - which is to advise schools about ICT. The purpose of this report is to try and help schools avoid potential problems and major costs. It also is key to pushing for an open document format within the office software world.

    Finally, many schools *do not* have permanent IT specialists. There are roughly 32000 schools in the UK (last number I read anyway) of which 4000 are high schools. Not many of those 28000 primary schools will have a permanent ICT technician! They simply don't have the money for that. That is who Becta are try to help - those who don't have people on site to help them.

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    The office compatibility pack wont work on anything pre office XP we found today...

    luckily that doesnt effect the majority of our machines..

    Can i ask what most people are running, were mainly office XP here, cept office 2k3 for all the staff laptops only because we have to be for SIMS ;\

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    Geoff's Avatar
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    We recently standardised on Office 2k3 here.

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    We are standardised, except for me, on Office 2k3. I use Office 2k7 to see how good or bad it is.

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    PEO
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    office 2k7 been standardised in the next week here

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