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Windows 8 Thread, Microsoft reveals Windows 8 & Surface RT Product Lifecycles in Technical; Originally Posted by SYNACK When it comes down to it, it does not really matter about the platform but at ...
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    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    When it comes down to it, it does not really matter about the platform but at this point I'm wondering why you threw out the C64s as that is obviously the level that is being aimed for. Base level computer - that is all.
    We have windows XP because it is a) supported b) runs everything we need c) is as fast as Win7 on our hardware d) saved us a huge amount of time money and stress by upgrading to every new windows since e) users don't even USE the operating system.

    Lets face it - windows explorer and notepad are the only useful native windows applications anyway.

  2. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    Lets face it - windows explorer and notepad are the only useful native windows applications anyway.
    IE is fine and the rest got stripped out thanks the courts and EU. Besides stuff like RDP7/8 RemoteApps are all windows integrated, sure you can get a low rent uncompressed unaccelerated version through Linux but it's just not the same. Synchronised files, automated system repair, DirectAccess, centralised management are all nice features that may not be directly exposed to the user, they just work behind the scenes making things easier for everyone and making for less work.

    Half the stuff that used to break in XP either does not break or fixes itself. Its nice that you have time to squander tracking down drivers and hacking solutions together for old stuff. I deal with a stack of schools and need things to work without fluffing and fix itself if it can..

    Users do USE the OS, to login and as the platform for all their Applications, dirty slow unreliable web-apps are another story but that is largely thanks to powergrabs by various other companies and the shoehorning of interactivity into a document markup language and protocol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    IE is fine and the rest got stripped out thanks the courts and EU. Besides stuff like RDP7/8 RemoteApps are all windows integrated, sure you can get a low rent uncompressed unaccelerated version through Linux but it's just not the same.
    We use Chrome and ICA. IMO they are both better than their windows counterparts. They are both cross platform.

    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    Synchronised files, automated system repair, DirectAccess, centralised management are all nice features that may not be directly exposed to the user, they just work behind the scenes making things easier for everyone and making for less work.
    From a management perspective I'd rather just plug them in and forget about it. Chromebooks look way better for scenario!. but hey -I'm lazy

    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    Half the stuff that used to break in XP either does not break or fixes itself. Its nice that you have time to squander tracking down drivers and hacking solutions together for old stuff. I deal with a stack of schools and need things to work without fluffing and fix itself if it can..
    I don't. it gets Virtualised. Did you know that Virtual XP boots faster than virtual windows 7 on the same hardware?

    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    Users do USE the OS, to login and as the platform for all their Applications, dirty slow unreliable web-apps are another story but that is largely thanks to powergrabs by various other companies and the shoehorning of interactivity into a document markup language and protocol.
    you got me on the login. The login processes is way too slow.


    Anyway -I'm still wondering if we should go straight to windows 8. I still don't see any advatages of moving to windows 7. TIFKAM would be the biggest advantage so far and I don't even like it.
    Last edited by CyberNerd; 29th November 2012 at 10:17 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    We use Chrome and ICA. IMO they are both better than their windows counterparts. They are both cross platform.
    Matter of opinion, I hate Chrome, buggy POS has crashed more times on me on various machines than Firefox and way more than the latest IE.

    ICA is better, it is also more expensive and can be harder to manage.
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    From a management perspective I'd rather just plug them in and forget about it. Chromebooks look way better for scenario!. but hey -I'm lazy
    If you can stand webapps sure
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    I don't. it gets Virtualised. Did you know that Virtual XP boots faster than virtual windows 7 on the same hardware?
    That's great, you've fashioned adapters to put your favourite wooden wheels on the new cars you are forced to buy. New cars are heavier than old ones too, its all the extra safety and power that they build into them. Windows 95 should boot really fast on the same environment, it does not mean that it is better at anything but boot speed.
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    you got me on the login. The login processes is way too slow.
    Guess what, its faster in Windows 8 but yes logons can be slow
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    Anyway -I'm still wondering if we should go straight to windows 8. I still don't see any advatages of moving to windows 7. TIFKAM would be the biggest advantage so far and I don't even like it.
    Well you've left it this long, if you are going for another whole decade without upsetting anyone with little changes or improvements you may as well go as new as you can now, if your lucky you will have retired by the time you get around to it again.
    Last edited by SYNACK; 29th November 2012 at 11:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    Well you've left it this long, if you are going for another whole decade without upsetting anyone with little changes or improvements you may as well go as new as you can now, if your lucky you will have retired by the time you get around to it again.
    We've hardy made 'little changes'. We just adopted a different methodology that centered around what SLT and users wanted to do (BYOD, webapps) before MS 'allowed' us to do it.
    The other side is that we have to continue to support legacy windows apps.

    My question was really whether we should adopt windows 8 to keep pace with TIFKAM apps (as i mentioned all our other apps are supported on XP) or whether we should ignore them. Others suggested ignoring them - which leaves me to think there is no reason to upgrade XP if I can put it on ICA or virtualised.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    My question was really whether we should adopt windows 8 to keep pace with TIFKAM apps (as i mentioned all our other apps are supported on XP) or whether we should ignore them. Others suggested ignoring them - which leaves me to think there is no reason to upgrade XP if I can put it on ICA or virtualised.
    Here's my thoughts...

    I currently use Windows 8 at work and have used it at home since the Customer Preview.

    EVERYTHING I do at work, including using Office 2013, is run through the desktop. Maybe occasionally I'll view a photo in TIFKAM, but I've redirected most image types to the 'regular' Windows Photo Viewer, as I find that the TIFKAM Photos app is clunky to use.

    To help me use Windows 8 on a day-to-day basis, I've installed ClassicShell, a link to which can be found in other posts here, which gives me a 'regular' Start Menu.

    Have I seen anything exclusively TIFKAM that I can't do with desktop software? Not yet.

    Am I open-minded about TIFKAM? I'd like to think yes, but I'm still waiting to be convinced to adopt it for day-to-day use on my desktop.

  7. Thanks to VeryPC_Tom_M from:

    gshaw (17th December 2012)

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    Quote Originally Posted by VeryPC_Tom_M View Post
    Here's my thoughts...

    I currently use Windows 8 at work and have used it at home since the Customer Preview.

    EVERYTHING I do at work, including using Office 2013, is run through the desktop. Maybe occasionally I'll view a photo in TIFKAM, but I've redirected most image types to the 'regular' Windows Photo Viewer, as I find that the TIFKAM Photos app is clunky to use.

    To help me use Windows 8 on a day-to-day basis, I've installed ClassicShell, a link to which can be found in other posts here, which gives me a 'regular' Start Menu.

    Have I seen anything exclusively TIFKAM that I can't do with desktop software? Not yet.

    Am I open-minded about TIFKAM? I'd like to think yes, but I'm still waiting to be convinced to adopt it for day-to-day use on my desktop.
    This pretty much describes my feelings, except that I found myself not using TIFKAM at all in the past few months, and I found myself getting more and more annoyed with those tiny little things that just felt wrong with Windows 8 to the point where I gave up and rolled my home machine back to windows 7. And frankly, it's real good to be 'home'.

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    So, remind me - How is moving up to <Insert new fangled OS> going to up student grades? show more Value Added?

    Shouldn't we be discussing what Browser we should be using ? you know Fluffy Cloud / Web apps / Martini Teaching / BYOD ?

    Or even, what your school is doing about moving to everything / everywhere / any device / anytime / IlovemyiPhone / ihateAndroid / canIusemyXbox ?/ whataboutCatchupTV - canIviewLessonsonthat / WhaatDoYaMeenNoSupportItsOnly1am?

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    Quote Originally Posted by daveyboy View Post
    So, remind me - How is moving up to <Insert new fangled OS> going to up student grades? show more Value Added?
    Because since moving to Windows 7, I've never had a quieter month in IT support than this last month.

    How much of this is from the Win7 system being all of my own creation, instead of inherited as the XP was*, and how much is just integral to Win7 I can't say, but overall the network provision here is much more stable and capable and staff can rely on it being available for lessons. Sometimes, as support staff, all you need to do to contribute is support.



    *Not saying that I am inherently brilliant (although, y'know...) - just that I know the ins and the outs of the system now rather than having to work them out and discover surprises in the setup.

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    Maybe thats just down to your 'inherent brilliantness' ..... I wonder, would it have been the same if you had done the same with XP?

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    Quote Originally Posted by daveyboy View Post
    Maybe thats just down to your 'inherent brilliantness' ..... I wonder, would it have been the same if you had done the same with XP?
    Well who knows, that was the caveat I lumped in; but even if the same would be true of XP now, I think you're going to have a much harder time justifying it in two years once it's out of extended support and the target of every hacker (low hanging fruit and all that) and increasingly having software compatibility issues (as software will be targeted at 6.0 and derivatives).

    Personally I think 7 is a superior OS to XP anyway; PITA to administer sometimes, but to use it's much friendlier, with the searchable start menu, snappable Windows, Aero Peek... they're all little things, but they're little things I use a lot.

    And I still like Aero Glass, even if MS are taking it away from me in future

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    I have no complaints about moving either way - I just think that as we move toward all our software being via a web browser the OS will become less important. What will be paramount is compatibility with all or devices......

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    Quote Originally Posted by daveyboy View Post
    So, remind me - How is moving up to <Insert new fangled OS> going to up student grades? show more Value Added?

    Shouldn't we be discussing what Browser we should be using ? you know Fluffy Cloud / Web apps / Martini Teaching / BYOD ?

    Or even, what your school is doing about moving to everything / everywhere / any device / anytime / IlovemyiPhone / ihateAndroid / canIusemyXbox ?/ whataboutCatchupTV - canIviewLessonsonthat / WhaatDoYaMeenNoSupportItsOnly1am?

    I suspect it is because I have been 'doing the BYOD thing' (at the direction of our senior teachers) it is why I have been neglecting MS operating system upgrades.
    Now we have this all in place with web apps, cloud storage and so on I'm now looking at the windows side of things.
    The only pressing reason we have to upgrade is XP support ending in 2014.

    I'd sooner look after 200 BYOD's than 100 Windows domain computers. Users take more responsibility and tune the device to their liking, it costs less and software is easier to deploy.

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    CAM
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    SIMS is not supported on Windows 8 yet. If I were you, I'd go Windows 7 if you have to make the jump right now. Windows 8 is in the "let's iron out the bugs and make it more compatible" phase. 6 months down the line the time will probably be ripe for a Windows 8 jump, and just in time for the holidays too.

    The biggest barrier will be the interface!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael View Post
    Never heard of a TIFCAM app, what is it? I just think Windows 8's going to be even more floppy than a floppy disk...
    Oh I really hope you are wrong.

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