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Virtual Learning Platforms Thread, EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribute in Technical; Because Open Source products are more often driven by community wants / needs they are perfect for this group IMHO ...
  1. #16

    GrumbleDook's Avatar
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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribute

    Because Open Source products are more often driven by community wants / needs they are perfect for this group IMHO ... but ... because they are community driven, the community needs to say they want to join in.

    If you are involved in those communities, push from your end too.

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribu

    Unfortunately I don't, but it would be a shame to leave them out.

    Maybe it should be for the SALTIS members to ensure compatability with Open Source products within education, and open up a working relationship with project communities.

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribu

    Open Source members would be very welcome. Membership is free and all you have to do is register your interest with Mark Rosser at BESA (MarkR@besa.org.uk).

    Formal acceptance procedures require your application to be discussed at the next meeting - but I am trying to fast-track this procedure by giving members a few days to object to any application on-line: any objection means the application is put back to the meeting, otherwise you can be accepted inside a week.

    The criterion for membership (with voting rights) is that you must have a business supplying education-specific technology to compulsory education; partnership is for any other organisation which is considered by members to have a contribution to make - so there is more discretion on the admission of partners than of members.

    As for business models, SALTIS is entirely neutral on how the product is structured or sold or owned or whether it is any good: it is purely interested in how products talk to each other.

    Crispin.

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribu

    Quote Originally Posted by alan-d
    Maybe it should be for the SALTIS members to ensure compatability with Open Source products.
    It can't work that way round. There has to be a tightly defined, agreed specification (while Open Source communities are by nature diverse - that is their strength). Also, no product or application can *be* the standard - the standard must be something that is product/application-neutral.

    But I think that SALTIS can certainly be flexible in the way it defines an "organisation", as it has been with EduGeek.

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribu

    Quote Originally Posted by crispinw
    .........As for business models, SALTIS is entirely neutral on how the product is structured or sold or owned or whether it is any good: it is purely interested in how products talk to each other.Crispin.
    That is commendable and I support that. However, from what I can see so far you will have a membership that will have products that are happy to work together within a Windows or Mac environment at a time when educational establishments will not be able to cover the spiraling costs of those operating systems or the applications.

    Remember that being a member of SALTIS is of benefit to the profit making companies financially ie if product 'A' can work with products 'B' and 'C' then more sales of Product 'A' can be produced. The bottom line is that educational establishments will still have to pay for those products and no doubt a percentage of the developement time. Therefore would it not be in the interests of the member companies to enourage a working relationship with open source project managers/members so that the poorer establishments can still afford 'product 'A''.

    Hope that makes sense - bit of a looney asylum here today

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribu

    Product "B", which may compete with OS product "A" may not like it. But product "C", which works with "A" or "B" will certainly want to work with "A" as well as "B".

    Moodle has been mentioned several times in SALTIS meetings by commercial companies (mainly publishers, I think) as a product which needs to be involved and which they want to work with. Commercial companies still want to sell into schools even if some or a significant part of their systems are open source.

    As for the operating system, all of the specifications we are looking at at the moment are XML or web-services based: i.e. entirely operating system neutral.

    Crispin.

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribu

    Its easy to be cynical after dealing with school IT for so long, but to be given a chance to change things should not be pushed aside.
    For me the word is "realistic" based on a decade or so working on what I suppose is a kind of MIS system, albeit a bit bigger than a typical schools, with lots of interoperability, data interchange, formats and protocols to deal with or make. Was working with the same concepts/tech I read here at the turn of the century i.e. education isn't exactly trail-blazing. Interoperability standards were a regular feature, with occasional involvement in their making.

    Anyway sometimes these things work, sometimes they get bogged down for the kind of reasons I mentioned. I wish this initiative well, but couldn't pass by without asking something that was likely to result in an interesting response.

    What I don't know much about is where you get that Edugeek consensus? I imagine most want everything to be admin-trouble-free and as interoperable as possible. But do you care much about the details of how product A talks to product B?

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    Re: EduGeek has joined SALTIS as a partner - please contribute

    Ah ... the elusive 'consensus' ...

    As with all community based groups there is a cabal of people ... erm ... group of people who eventually put forward a professed serious of opinions, ideas or suggestions.

    At the moment this tends to be the Site Admins, the staff and a few other regulars who have put their hands in the air to say that they will take part in things like this.

    We have had a varied group of people put their hands up before and there will be plenty of opportunities for people to put forward their opinions (when backed by valid evidence), their experience and put forward ideas and suggestions.

    Unfortunately, as with all projects / groups like SALTIS, what you get is representation. If you are not happy that what is being put forward to the project is what people are truly saying then the community needs to change the representative. This is why you get groups that have annual boards.

    EduGeek is not a narco-cynicalist commune, but the playpen of one man who has let us into a magical world. Ultimately, he is the person to draw the line.

    For EduGeek ... a consensus is drawn from the experience and discussed opinions of its members ... and as long as people are happy with that then the Boss does not step in.

    Sometimes a consensus is not reached (anyone want to discuss vi or emacs) and people agree to disagree ... as long as both views are treated as equal. This is the approach EduGeek have taken on a number of occasions (Mac OS / Windows / Linux for a start!)

    Once the launch of SALTIS is completed we can get into the serious discussions about what works, what needs to change and how we get from where we are to where we should be ... not forgetting about what the impact of it all on a school is!

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