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IT News Thread, Apple have been 'inventing' again... in Other News; Originally Posted by seawolf Yes, but we all know Android also would have looked like the Blackberry if the iPhone ...
  1. #31

    nephilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    Yes, but we all know Android also would have looked like the Blackberry if the iPhone had never existed.
    Can I point out that androids first public release was September 2008 as its own OS from google, but the OS was formed shortly after the Android company was formed (before the google buyout), in 2003, they just couldn't find anyone willing to release a phone with a touchscreen and an untested OS, so developed the OS for digital cameras and had to wait for the phones.

    Its first phone iteration was then adopted by LG in 2005 (shortly before the google buyout) and frankly bastardised into the LG FlashUI OS which was on the LG Prada in 2006. So how you can say that the OS would have looked like blackberry, when in fact it was its own legit OS for LG, which looked nothing like blackberry, BEFORE the iPhone was announced, I will never know
    Last edited by nephilim; 1st April 2014 at 09:19 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nephilim View Post
    So how you can say that the OS would have looked like blackberry
    Perhaps because the prototypes of Android before Apple announced the iPhone seemed to strongly copy the Blackberry OS:

    Android: Before and After the iPhone | TechnoBuffalo
    What Android Looked Like Right Before the iPhone Launched

    ...when in fact it was its own legit OS for LG, which looked nothing like blackberry, BEFORE the iPhone was announced, I will never know
    Settling this iPhone vs. LG Prada Nonsense

    My bad, back in 2005/2006 Android looked like Palm OS not the Blackberry...back when Palm was making a little traction. Except, then they were mimicking the Blackberry in 2006/2007 when the Blackberry was popular. But, then they decided to mimic the iPhone interface when that was announced. Android is certainly a chameleon I'll give you that.

    All the while, iOS for all of its changes still strongly resembles that of the original iPhone. For good or bad, Apple has remained pretty steady in its approach to OS development. No one can claim they are like a ship being tossed to and fro as fickle consumer tastes change (so far).

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    I think you're missing a slight issue here - no-one wanted to build a touchscreen phone - it was a huge risk, so they went with what people would build. Apple changed that by making other manufacturers want to build a touchscreen device. Android could then do what they actually wanted to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    I think you're missing a slight issue here - no-one wanted to build a touchscreen phone - it was a huge risk, so they went with what people would build. Apple changed that by making other manufacturers want to build a touchscreen device. Android could then do what they actually wanted to do.
    apart from the windows phone 6 htc i had (first example i could think of) that was pre iphone

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    nephilim's Avatar
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    So was the LG Prada (iPhone was released in 2007, Prada was released in 2006)

    *edit*

    Prada was released to tech review sites in December 2006, and on sale in January 2007
    iPhone was released to tech review sites in March 2007, and on sale in June 2007
    Last edited by nephilim; 1st April 2014 at 10:17 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    I think you're missing a slight issue here - no-one wanted to build a touchscreen phone - it was a huge risk, so they went with what people would build. Apple changed that by making other manufacturers want to build a touchscreen device. Android could then do what they actually wanted to do.
    Fortune favours the bold.

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Having a 1 or 2 touchscreen phones on the market doesn't negate the point - they were niche products. They were a risk. Not to mention the difference between resistive and capacitative screens for an end user.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    Fortune favours the bold.
    Fortune favours those with lots of money in the bank.
    Last edited by localzuk; 1st April 2014 at 10:21 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    Having a 1 or 2 touchscreen phones on the market doesn't negate the point - they were niche products. They were a risk. Not to mention the difference between resistive and capacitative screens for an end user.

    Fortune favours those with lots of money in the bank.
    You do realise Apple did not have "lots of money in the bank" in early 2007 compared to other phone companies. Blackberry had 1.5 times the revenue of Apple, Nokia had over 3 times the revenue of Apple in 2006 - Revenue for Apple (AAPL) 2006 - Wikinvest

    So, if anything Nokia should have been as bold as a drunken sailor...

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    OK. As you still seem to be missing my point.

    The tiny little company making Android comes along, designing an OS that it thinks is the future. They believe touchscreen phones are the future. They're small and have basically no money.

    They go to phone manufacturers, who have a traditional phone selling style. They have their own OS implementations and ecosystems. They are risk averse as they don't want to lose their current dominant positions with something new. They tell the little start-up "we're not going to make a touchscreen phone".

    So, the little company has to adjust and creates an OS that fits with those companies' existing styles and eco-systems.

    End result, even though Android was innovative and future thinking, they were hamstrung by not having a) money or b) companies wanting to risk their own money.

    That changed when someone came along called Google, who has bucket loads of money and could work with a manufacturer to get their work out there.

    The point is this - Apple did not invent the touchscreen phone. They didn't invent the user friendly UI for such devices either. They merely managed to market them well, polish them well and beat the competition by being cool.
    Last edited by localzuk; 1st April 2014 at 10:51 AM.

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    and lets be honest Apple always had a following before they were cool and trendy in a way that no company mass producing x86 PCs could ever manage

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    Perhaps because the prototypes of Android before Apple announced the iPhone seemed to strongly copy the Blackberry OS:

    Android: Before and After the iPhone | TechnoBuffalo
    What Android Looked Like Right Before the iPhone Launched
    To me it looks like the software on those older phones is still Android, its just they have hardware keyboards and different hardware, which lets face it has, its always been a selling point that you can choose different hardware in your phone if using Android.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    OK. As you still seem to be missing my point.

    The tiny little company making Android comes along, designing an OS that it thinks is the future. They believe touchscreen phones are the future. They're small and have basically no money.

    They go to phone manufacturers, who have a traditional phone selling style. They have their own OS implementations and ecosystems. They are risk averse as they don't want to lose their current dominant positions with something new. They tell the little start-up "we're not going to make a touchscreen phone".

    So, the little company has to adjust and creates an OS that fits with those companies' existing styles and eco-systems.
    Hmmm. I'm thinking that I had a Handspring "phone" back in the day called 2002 (still have it today and it still works, along with the niftiest little Targus folding keyboard you've ever seen). The Handspring was an offshoot of the Palm devices, which had a touchscreen in the Treo 650 in 2004. So, I'm not sure how innovative or original the company that originally made Android was as they were "standing on the shoulders" of others just like most other people before them.

    Oh, and there was that Newton thing that Apple started in 1987, which was a pre-cursor to the PDA that came to market a decade later. It's interesting how so many things are forgotten with the passage of time. Or, perhaps it's just selective memory. I don't know, I forget...

    End result, even though Android was innovative and future thinking, they were hamstrung by not having a) money or b) companies wanting to risk their own money.

    That changed when someone came along called Google, who has bucket loads of money and could work with a manufacturer to get their work out there.
    Hmmm. It seems that Google actually played it pretty safe after buying Android in 2005 as in 2006/2007 their prototypes looked for all the world like a Blackberry.

    The point is this - Apple did not invent the touchscreen phone. They didn't invent the user friendly UI for such devices either. They merely managed to market them well, polish them well and beat the competition by being cool.
    You are correct, the touch screen was invented in 1971 and I used many variants of touchscreens in defence and retail applications in the 80s, 90s, etc.

    Apple did however do a great deal toward perfecting the implementation and UI for touchscreens and bring it to mass market. Before the iPhone they were mostly lacking, non-responsive, and sucky. So, when did Apple (or I) ever imply that Apple invented the touchscreen? Interested to know so I can redact that remark.

  13. #43

    localzuk's Avatar
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    The entire thread is about Apple claiming to invent things!!!

  14. Thanks to localzuk from:

    nephilim (1st April 2014)

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    The entire thread is about Apple claiming to invent things!!!
    Another good one, in Steve Jobs' key note speech announcing the iPhone back in 2007, he claims that Apple invented multi-touch; completely untrue. The term has been around since the 70s, various proof of concept designs and many different prototypes also existed long before the iPhone. On top of all this, Apple didn't even 'invent' the specific multi-touch screen in the iPhone; it was made by a company called Fingerworks, whom Apple acquired in 2005.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    The entire thread is about Apple claiming to invent things!!!
    Actually, what Apple most often says is that it "reinvented" or "reimagined" a product or feature.

    https://www.apple.com/pr/library/200...th-iPhone.html

    reinvented-100039261-large.jpg
    Not my shirt, BTW.

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