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Network and Classroom Management Thread, Need to move from RM CC3 - what should I move to? in Technical; Hi Raj We mostly use a Vanilla network with extra seperate tools that we use for ease of management ABTutor ...
  1. #16
    Steven_Cleaver's Avatar
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    Hi Raj

    We mostly use a Vanilla network with extra seperate tools that we use for ease of management ABTutor for workststion control, Papercut for printer management, WDS for Imaging, Prism for Application deployment.I have used a company called Burconix (Burconix - Professional ICT Solutions for Education and SME ) to help with some of the setups and would help you with the move if you wanted from RM, they also have some of their own management tools which would help with ease of Management of your network if you want without locking anything down that you don't want, but as people of said you can just use Vanilla just what ever you feel is best for your environment

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    It all depends on your skillset.

    If you have relevant expertise of installing and supporting Active Directory, DNS, etc. then a vanilla solution can be tailored to your specific needs. If not, you should consider migrating to to CC4.

    As already mentioned, RM usually have a significant number of "value-added" features which can be costly going the 3rd-party route. That said, there's plenty of free/low cost packages available to get you similar functionality on vanilla provided you are happy to support it if/when things go wrong.

    Regards
    John

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    synaesthesia's Avatar
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    Is there anyone in Northants with a full Win 7 CC4 network? Looking to move forward from CC3 in the near future (large secondary with 3 IT staff including the NM) and need to retain ease of management. Network infrastructure is capable, workstations are capable, and I've seen plenty of windows 7 CC4 stations: would like to see a full size network in use. We're looking at other options for the network too, but easy of management/lack of troubleshooting for a very light IT team is top priority

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    Hello everyone, I hope no one mind that I dip in the topic.

    We are in very similar position, CC3 and want to move to something different. We had look at costs for both CC4 and CSE network toolkit - both costs more than £20k for migration/licensing - we don't have that kind of money. So I setup test domain myself, created few users, created GPOs etc. All works fine with new users on that domain. But now how can I migrate pupils and staff to new domain. In normal environment, you would just move forest root from 2003 to 2008 and it would be easier.
    But I don't think I can do that with RM CC3?
    So how can I import users to new domain from old one? ADMT 3 would do it?

    If some one would share how they did it, it would be really great.

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    I did it by having a tidy up on the CC3 system, then wrote a script to copy the home folders via some external storage (external hard drive or anything that will just hold the files), then put them into the relevant place on the new fileserver(s). My situation was a little more complicated as some students had an additional home folder that would mapped as a drive when they logged on in the music department, so the script also consolidated that in and also drops things like application data on the way (we moved to mandatory profiles).

    Then when all the home folders were in place I wrote another script to recurse through the home folders and log each folder name to a text file, I then made this into a CSV file for import.

    To actually import the users and set up shares, security, groups etc I wrote a power shell script that took my CSV as an import. This was the part that was complicated as I wanted everything to be automated (and was more complicated again as I also wanted to provision a second home folder just for use by apple macs on a seperate fileserver).

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcymer View Post
    Hello everyone, I hope no one mind that I dip in the topic.

    We are in very similar position, CC3 and want to move to something different. We had look at costs for both CC4 and CSE network toolkit - both costs more than £20k for migration/licensing - we don't have that kind of money. So I setup test domain myself, created few users, created GPOs etc. All works fine with new users on that domain. But now how can I migrate pupils and staff to new domain. In normal environment, you would just move forest root from 2003 to 2008 and it would be easier.
    But I don't think I can do that with RM CC3?
    So how can I import users to new domain from old one? ADMT 3 would do it?

    If some one would share how they did it, it would be really great.

    I'm not sure how easy it is to migrate users from CC3 as I haven't tried it. That said, if you've set-up AD, DNS, GP, etc, you've already done the difficult bit. You can get away with exporting your users using CSVDE and look into scripting to automate their import (unless you only have a few). Things will get more interesting if you have >1 domain controller.

    There's also plenty of sample logon scripts out there which can map drives, add printers, etc. Provided your DNS is sound, look into desktop and start menu redirection via group policy - this should get you a working system in next to no time.

    Best of luck.

    Lest us know how you get on!

    John

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    Hi everyone,

    I'm so pleased that I'm not on my own in the minefield of upgrading/changing networks!
    I work as an IT coordinator at a small primary school and have a fairly limited knowledge about networking an IT solution for a wireless classroom and an ICT room. Our school currently runs on RM CC3 which we would like to upgrade to CC4. However, after receiving a few quotes from RM I'm more confused than I ever was and feel that their quotes are extremely overpriced. As a result, i was thinking about switching to a different network management (Vanilla, EIS, Viglen), hoping to find something cheaper and yet easy to manage. Unfortunately, we only have a technician available at our school once a week for about 4 hours, which means working with RM network makes sense.
    I was just wondering if there is anyone with some similar experience or solution to our problem. We are looking into upgrading our server along with the licenses and changing from Windows XP to 7. Also, we are looking itno buying 20 additional laptops for our classes. Those would be purchased from pc world business.
    The BIG question is - will I get a better solution than RM anywhere else, provided that my technician can only work those 4 hrs a week?
    Thank a lot for your help!

  8. #23
    cpjitservices's Avatar
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    Go Vanilla, The majority of RM's software IE for imaging etc etc you can get somewhere else anyway! Fog being one of the best in my opinion and it's free!, filtering you can also do in Linux using squid so you wont need smartcache - saving you some money, Id be seriously going down the Vanilla route - having helped a school out recently moving away from CC3 they now are a Vanilla network and they prefer it and one of the reasons is cost saving.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janyo View Post
    The BIG question is - will I get a better solution than RM anywhere else, provided that my technician can only work those 4 hrs a week?
    By your own admission, you don't know much about the network, so you need something which enables non-technical people to add users, change permissions and so on - the RMMC does this in a way that you could use, even without any knowledge of networking or Active Directory. Doing something in RMMC is often quicker than doing it straight in the Active Directory, so given the very limited amount of technician time you have available, it could be worthwhile, as it would free them up for longer to fix other things while with you. Also, better than that, since you would be able to do some of the routine tasks yourself in the RMMC, this would free your technician up even more during those 4 hours. You also need to be working with a company who you can phone up and ask a "silly" question to, and have them help you.

    I'm not saying RM are the only company who offer this, but for you, service is more important than price - better to have an expensive network which you can use than a cheap one which you can't.

  10. #25

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    There are other companies that offer a vanilla system overlaid with their own software, and more importantly - they offer tech support and remote server access which is a godsend for those who don't know too much about the actual nuts and bolts.
    Around here, a lot of schools use Schoolcare and whilst I don't use them anymore they are very good and a lot cheaper than RM!

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    **Puts RM Hat on**

    *cough* as an RM employee, I would have to recommend CC4.. TBH, whilst our school isn't using it, all the other schools here are.. without any issues with CC4 itself - lots of the issues were due to the task of converting all LA schools to RM in such a short timescale (new Servers, PCs in places, user migrations to CC4, etc..)

    From my exposure to CC4, (I believe its now on SR2?) it has been good, it is as stable as any other system can be and I think it gets a lot of undeserved critisism at times especially when it was first launched (very buggy i believe)..
    I cannot give a complete breakdown of CC4 as I don't use it on a day to day basis, but what I don't hear round here are schools complaining about how *** CC4 is - quite the opposite is true in fact

    **Takes RM Hat Off**

    I, personally, prefer a vanilla network as I find it very rewarding when I get systems such as SCCM and Exchange 2010, etc up and running
    At the end of the day - it's a choice (unless you are a BSF School where RM are contracted - i think our school is an exception since our network was shown to be so damned reliable.. )

    If you are already on CC3, and if everything is working, then I would suggest migrating to CC4.. However, If its NOT working correctly and there are lots of un-happy people out there, then maybe it's time for a Vanilla network

    Bear in mind that with Vanilla - if it goes wrong - there is no-one else to turn to (trust me - it does go wrong and I did get shouted at a lot!), with CC3/CC4 - you have the entire RM Support team who will help

    Try and weigh up the Pro's and Con's - especially financially (SLT/SMT are more interested in this part) - how mcuh will it cost to upgrade to CC4 compared to building a Vanilla Network? Migrating user accounts from CC3 to Vanilla, Do you need extra licences, software, etc that you currently use with CC3...

    It may be easy to say "Move to Vanilla" - but is it as easy to actually do that?

  12. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Janyo View Post
    Hi everyone,

    I'm so pleased that I'm not on my own in the minefield of upgrading/changing networks!
    I work as an IT coordinator at a small primary school and have a fairly limited knowledge about networking an IT solution for a wireless classroom and an ICT room. Our school currently runs on RM CC3 which we would like to upgrade to CC4. However, after receiving a few quotes from RM I'm more confused than I ever was and feel that their quotes are extremely overpriced. As a result, i was thinking about switching to a different network management (Vanilla, EIS, Viglen), hoping to find something cheaper and yet easy to manage. Unfortunately, we only have a technician available at our school once a week for about 4 hours, which means working with RM network makes sense.
    I was just wondering if there is anyone with some similar experience or solution to our problem. We are looking into upgrading our server along with the licenses and changing from Windows XP to 7. Also, we are looking itno buying 20 additional laptops for our classes. Those would be purchased from pc world business.
    The BIG question is - will I get a better solution than RM anywhere else, provided that my technician can only work those 4 hrs a week?
    Thank a lot for your help!
    Maybe talk to your Feeder secondary? Maybe they can come to some agreement where they can help out. The minimum they can do is meet with you and give some advice, maybe look at what you have and give you some options.

  13. #28

    russdev's Avatar
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    Also if primary school ask your account manager about two options about to release for primary schools first is SimpelyWorks which is a multipoint server solution and the new cc4 primary solution about to be released. If pm your customer ID will ask someone to give you a buzz about it before I leave for pastures new.

    Just for info as new do not work at RM work for RM pioneer school (well till 31st March).

    Russ

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    Quote Originally Posted by synaesthesia View Post
    Is there anyone in Northants with a full Win 7 CC4 network? Looking to move forward from CC3 in the near future (large secondary with 3 IT staff including the NM) and need to retain ease of management. Network infrastructure is capable, workstations are capable, and I've seen plenty of windows 7 CC4 stations: would like to see a full size network in use. We're looking at other options for the network too, but easy of management/lack of troubleshooting for a very light IT team is top priority
    Ask this afternoon ... I'm pretty sure there are some, but can ask RM if needed.

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    Will do cheers

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