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Network and Classroom Management Thread, Network Collapsed in Technical; Originally Posted by Grommit You don't really need a ups in a School.. a surge Protector will do... With many ...
  1. #31

    GrumbleDook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grommit View Post
    You don't really need a ups in a School.. a surge Protector will do...
    With many new schools being built on the edges of towns or in areas of development / redevelopment you end up with brown outs due to the local sub-station not handling the growth in the area. This can lead to difficult times and power dropping off for up to 10 seconds.

    UPS are essential for times like these, even in the edge cabs too. I know network hardware can be happy with the occasional turn off and on again, but power spikes / drops / brown-outs happening frequently *will* cause problems.

    This is one of the *hidden* costs of school networks. When you purchase hardware you should also ensure that you include a percentage to cover UPS too, in the same way you would for backup of the server, warranty, etc.

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    so whats the name of the company supplying the crap service.
    I have a funny feeling I would only need one guess.
    If a vanilla system keeled over you could have it backup in under 4 hours flat using your own knowledge.
    Makes me glad we are in the process of removing this stuff. ( if its what I think it is ).

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by elsiegee40 View Post
    papakura says he's HoD ICT... can't help wondering if a recommendation for a website from someone in that position might not go down to well with the NM.

    WE know it would help him, but the NM's probably thinking that a teacher's sticking his nose where it's not wanted... Hope he does come and visit. He needs some sympathy on an FFS thread!
    The real question here should be is Why was the NM unable to Restore/Repair/Resolve/Patch his network.. ?

    If my network went down and it wasn't back up for more than 2 days I would have hell coming down on me and on the carpet..

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumbleDook View Post
    With many new schools being built on the edges of towns or in areas of development / redevelopment you end up with brown outs due to the local sub-station not handling the growth in the area. This can lead to difficult times and power dropping off for up to 10 seconds.

    UPS are essential for times like these, even in the edge cabs too. I know network hardware can be happy with the occasional turn off and on again, but power spikes / drops / brown-outs happening frequently *will* cause problems.

    This is one of the *hidden* costs of school networks. When you purchase hardware you should also ensure that you include a percentage to cover UPS too, in the same way you would for backup of the server, warranty, etc.
    A good Surge Protector will protect against Brown outs and spikes... so why do you need to spend 2k on a 16000mv UPS ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by papakura View Post
    The middleware company - the largest supplier to the UK education market I believe - have finally got the network up and running with the new High Spec servers.

    There is talk of compensation etc. From what I can glean, and I have yet to be fully briefed, there was a problem with the power supply that corrupted the AD which was replicated and destroyed the server hard drives - multiple times.

    I can not tell you how amazed I am. These two servers were installed last May and for our whole system (even the old servers) to go down at such a critical time after several warnings points to a very poor service from this company.

    Some students will fail their exams because of this. I will make a serious complaint against this company but will also no longer defend them against detractors.

    Thank you all for your help.

    Yes we all try to avoid this company but unfortunately they are taking over ICT in the schools in England via the BSF and we will have no choice but to be assimilated into the Collective
    Last edited by Grommit; 23rd May 2008 at 11:56 AM.

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grommit View Post
    A good Surge Protector will protect against Brown outs and spikes... so why do you need to spend 2k on a 16000mv UPS ?
    No surge protector will provide coverage against 10 second cuts. And as I said, what about servers being randomly shut off? The damage to disks and data can be huge.

    2k is not much to protect that data, considering schools have a legal responsibility to ensure the integrity of the data they hold.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    No surge protector will provide coverage against 10 second cuts. And as I said, what about servers being randomly shut off? The damage to disks and data can be huge.

    2k is not much to protect that data, considering schools have a legal responsibility to ensure the integrity of the data they hold.
    We dont have power tripping off and on all the time so I doubt if disks will get damaged for a pow er cut once a year ...



    We have massive UPS's in the Server Racks but none in the coms cabinets....

  8. #38

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    But some schools do have the problem ... and it is not to say that the electric company are not going to shift things around so you are on the tail of a sub-station feed and end up with more problems too.

    UPSen are a good thing. When you are in the middle of a DS restore and the power drops you have the chance of saving the situation rather than end up with a botched restore and a corrupted restore file.

    The Cabs ... again, from bitter experience ... and if you happen to be in a school that does a chunk of internal moving of rooms (drama room one year, ICT Suite the next) the internal boards may also be a problem ... especially in late 60s / early 70s schools that have not had a complete overhaul.

    There is a cost ... and you have to weigh up the cost of sorting out a problem should it arise. Thankfully we do not have to worry about it anymore as we have sufficient coverage.

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    You're right there...

    If we have a cut, the UPS are lifesavers..but we still have to run around after resetting breakers on various floors to bring different room sections back up. I think me and the NM are the only ones who know where each wall is supplied from. It boggles the mind that to power up the back of IT1 and the aircon controller you need to go down to food and flick breaker 13 on DB12, marked "lighting, F13".

    We've had a rewire, but there are so many "Unknown destination" markers on the board diagrams, it's scary.

    Last power cut we had, UPS did their job well, but it took us an hour to bring the infrastructure back online..so many odd breakers in so many odd places.

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    Sounds like an intrusive head of ICT sticking his/her nose in where it's not wanted.

    Leave your NM to their job and I'm sure they will leave you to yours. If there are repercussions to the way your NM has handled the whole situation then leave those to the people in charge of the school.

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    After two weeks (now more than that since the original post) I'd have expected the network to be back up, missing exam deadlines etc is where the intrusion would (and in my opinion be justified) creep in.

    The OP complains of poor communications from the top so its no wonder he's struggling and looking here for advice.

    I work closely with my head of curricular ICT keeping him involved of any potential downtime, upgrades etc and by doing so we keep a good working relationship.

    RM screwed our FRDC migration recently and we were 'down' for several days during which time we were building in a contingency plan and keeping SMT/ICT staff aware of what was going on. Had the curricular network downtime stretched into a second week, we'd have rebuilt a suite onto a vanilla provision allowing 'key' work to be completed. - Obviously we're not privvy to the particular circumstances here but it does beg the question of what on earth is going on.

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    papakura (24th May 2008)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oops_my_bad View Post
    Sounds like an intrusive head of ICT sticking his/her nose in where it's not wanted.

    Leave your NM to their job and I'm sure they will leave you to yours. If there are repercussions to the way your NM has handled the whole situation then leave those to the people in charge of the school.
    When something is this bad, ie. 2 weeks of dead network, it is only normal for the head of a department that entirely relies on the infrastructure to be asking questions! He can't do his job, as the NM hasn't done his (it seems).

    The whole 'sticking his nose in where it isn't wanted' attitude is a poor one to say the least.

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    papakura (24th May 2008)

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    When something is this bad, ie. 2 weeks of dead network, it is only normal for the head of a department that entirely relies on the infrastructure to be asking questions! He can't do his job, as the NM hasn't done his (it seems).

    The whole 'sticking his nose in where it isn't wanted' attitude is a poor one to say the least.
    It's not just "ICT" that relies on the infrastructure - indeed the entire school population depends on it - what a selfish and dated attitude by the OP

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oops_my_bad View Post
    It's not just "ICT" that relies on the infrastructure - indeed the entire school population depends on it - what a selfish attitude by the OP
    English aren't affected as badly, nor are maths, science, history, geography, re, french, german, or any other subject. ICT requires access to computers far more than any other subject. If the network goes down in our school, the people affected most are our admin team and the ICT teachers. Everyone else can get on just fine without it.

    Why are you being so negative? Seems pretty weird to me.

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    Whilst the entire school population depends upon it, students who _need_ ICT to pass their exams (which deadlines have been missed) should be certainly in my opinion at the highest priority.

    If there was a flood and PE students couldn't use the field for their practical exams, I'd expect the HOD PE to be involved if after an unreasonable amount of time has passed with apparently no progress or communications.

  19. Thanks to kmount from:

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