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Network and Classroom Management Thread, Network Collapsed in Technical; Does your NM know about this site? That may help, rather than try and muddle his way through to a ...
  1. #16
    alan-d's Avatar
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    Does your NM know about this site? That may help, rather than try and muddle his way through to a cure. At the very least he'll see that he is not alone as many of us have gone through similar experiences.

    Does your LEA offer technical assistance in the form of hiring a technician for a short period? This would help your NM. He can only work long hours for a short period before mistakes are made and he ends up taking 2 steps back to rectify a problem.

    Keep the questions coming.

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    speckytecky (20th May 2008)

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    Quote Originally Posted by papakura View Post
    I do not believe the servers start but will ask.

    I will ask the NM if he can log onto the Servers

    Can you explain the ping bit!

    We do not seem to have a redundant spare server which is what I would have expected. Both new servers have gone and the two old ones but it does seem that they have been able to get SIMs up and running.

    I would have thought the supplier could just bring in a new server and replicate what we have - but is that naive of me??
    PIng sends a packet to a device or server with a reply to see it's available...

    Ping with IP sees that the Network card is working.. Ping with Name sees that DNS is working..

    Also what your supplier does and does not do depends on the SLA that you have with them...
    Last edited by Grommit; 20th May 2008 at 10:56 AM.

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    Progress

    Thanks to all and especially Tony who has just helped me understand some key issues.

    The supplier of the original server is currently on site and installing a Higher Spec server - this will cut out one side of the triangle. I presume things might be up and running tomorrow?

    As somebody said earlier, an important next step is to explain to the staff what has happened. 4 servers going down at once seems to be improbable in the extreme?

    I will take advice as suggested and report back to you.

    Many thanks

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    A hardware failure in all four servers can only be explained by a power surge due to a lack of UPS. I can't see this being the case though, so it's most likely the whole domain is botched, with whatever controlling third-party software being unable to access it.

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    whole domain is botched - what does that mean in laymans terms?

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    mac_shinobi's Avatar
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    Botched

    Botched as in broken - not working - something went wrong with them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fafster View Post
    A hardware failure in all four servers can only be explained by a power surge due to a lack of UPS. I can't see this being the case though, so it's most likely the whole domain is botched, with whatever controlling third-party software being unable to access it.
    Have to agree here, four servers suffering hardware failure at the same time is about as unlikely as me spending the night with Kylie Minouge!

    Have to feel very sorry for your NM! Do send him this way, if only for us to help ease his pain!

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    > problems with RAID controllers <

    Hmm.. haven't seen very many, but some variations of RAID controller failure can be stealthy and extremely evil.

    > whole domain is botched <

    On your network there's a central database called "Active Directory" that holds all the information about the Windows "domain" - that's info about the user accounts, the computers, who is permitted to do what and so on and so forth. That database is critical so rather than keep just one copy on one server, it is almost certainly replicated to other servers.

    Unfortunately it is possible for broken data to get replicated, so those multiple instances of the Active Directory database aren't much use. If that had happened I might be caught saying something like the "whole domain is [something rude]!"

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    papakura (20th May 2008)

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    papakura says he's HoD ICT... can't help wondering if a recommendation for a website from someone in that position might not go down to well with the NM.

    WE know it would help him, but the NM's probably thinking that a teacher's sticking his nose where it's not wanted... Hope he does come and visit. He needs some sympathy on an FFS thread!

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    Tony which Middleware product was he using?

    Interesting that four servers went down simultaneously that would suggest power spike as others have suggested. 08:30 - 03:30 pretty extreme surprised the NM hadn't got it working though I should have thought get a cheap server setup AD get a list of users and get the data backup added to the server until the full domain infrastructure can be replaced and pulled back from the clean backup. A few days for an interim solution but it sound serious if two weeks has gone by! The NM must be dreading coming into work at the moment.

    Wes
    Last edited by wesleyw; 20th May 2008 at 08:46 PM.

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    papakura (20th May 2008)

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    Back up and running

    The middleware company - the largest supplier to the UK education market I believe - have finally got the network up and running with the new High Spec servers.

    There is talk of compensation etc. From what I can glean, and I have yet to be fully briefed, there was a problem with the power supply that corrupted the AD which was replicated and destroyed the server hard drives - multiple times.

    I can not tell you how amazed I am. These two servers were installed last May and for our whole system (even the old servers) to go down at such a critical time after several warnings points to a very poor service from this company.

    Some students will fail their exams because of this. I will make a serious complaint against this company but will also no longer defend them against detractors.

    Thank you all for your help.

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    Quote Originally Posted by papakura View Post
    The middleware company - the largest supplier to the UK education market I believe - have finally got the network up and running with the new High Spec servers.

    There is talk of compensation etc. From what I can glean, and I have yet to be fully briefed, there was a problem with the power supply that corrupted the AD which was replicated and destroyed the server hard drives - multiple times.

    I can not tell you how amazed I am. These two servers were installed last May and for our whole system (even the old servers) to go down at such a critical time after several warnings points to a very poor service from this company.

    Some students will fail their exams because of this. I will make a serious complaint against this company but will also no longer defend them against detractors.

    Thank you all for your help.
    I think that should be posted in FFS!!! I've not heard of that happening before..... and I seriously hope it never happens to me, or any others on here

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    Quote Originally Posted by fafster View Post
    A hardware failure in all four servers can only be explained by a power surge due to a lack of UPS. I can't see this being the case though, so it's most likely the whole domain is botched, with whatever controlling third-party software being unable to access it.
    You don't really need a ups in a School.. a surge Protector will do...

  17. #29

    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grommit View Post
    You don't really need a ups in a School.. a surge Protector will do...
    You need a UPS if you have a server. It ensures the server gets shut down properly in the event of a power failure! Not shutting down an AD server properly can lead to a corrupt AD.

  18. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by papakura View Post
    The middleware company - the largest supplier to the UK education market I believe - have finally got the network up and running with the new High Spec servers.

    There is talk of compensation etc. From what I can glean, and I have yet to be fully briefed, there was a problem with the power supply that corrupted the AD which was replicated and destroyed the server hard drives - multiple times.

    I can not tell you how amazed I am. These two servers were installed last May and for our whole system (even the old servers) to go down at such a critical time after several warnings points to a very poor service from this company.

    Some students will fail their exams because of this. I will make a serious complaint against this company but will also no longer defend them against detractors.

    Thank you all for your help.
    Be aware that there are many other factors that can be in play though that you may not be aware of.

    Does your school have the approprate support contracts in place with said company?

    I've been to schools that had no support contracts at all yet would still expect said education supplier to jump (how high?) if anything goes wrong, only to be dissapointed - these schools will then rant and rave about how poor said supplier is.....when really the school was at fault all along. After all if they do not pay for support why should the middleware company help out when things go wrong?

    I have also been to schools where the "network manager" has done no network management for several years, backups not taken, security updates, hotfixes, support packs not installed, antivirus protection not enforced or kept up to date, workstations or servers not maintained, infact, servers shoved in a cuboard under a desk covered with cardboard boxes and paper.... in this case the school was also very quick to blame the middlweware company when the network went down....

    I am not trying to defend what as happened in your school as I do not know the full details - I am just trying to make you aware that sometimes middeware companies supply you with goods and services but the school also needs to do it's part in order to keep these goods and services running like clockwork....

    Either way - we here at Edugeek are passionate about Educational ICT and we will be happy to provide any help or advice we can. It has been known for members to actually visit other members to help out. I believe that the pupils should come first in a disaster situation - one should not be shy to ask for help - if we can help, we will. Your Network Manager should be made aware of this site, and this thread, and that offers of help are there if he/she needs it. Don't worry about treading on his/her toes - the kids come first.

    my 2 pence.

    Butuz
    Last edited by Butuz; 23rd May 2008 at 10:26 AM.

  19. Thanks to Butuz from:

    papakura (23rd May 2008)

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