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MIS Systems Thread, Error Messages !! in Technical; Originally Posted by vikpaw Did you mean to say 'Reason 9'? Points 1 and 4 are the same. Is this ...
  1. #31

    creese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikpaw View Post
    Did you mean to say 'Reason 9'?
    Points 1 and 4 are the same. Is this from SupportNet?
    My finger missed the target of 0.

    The list is to demonstrate that most of the reasons, if not all, are down to the installer/network manager/technician not the program. If installed correctly you rarely get reason 0. I'm still waiting for someone to tell me how the client can report a better error when it cannot access the main program, or would that ruin the SIMS knocking session. I'm not a SIMS fanboy either, I currently have a complaint about helpdesk information received.

  2. #32

    creese's Avatar
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    Perhaps a SIMS error message thread should started, as most of the above is of no use to the OP.

    Check connect,ini, SQL Engine, shared drive. 3 simple checks, if it's none of those dig a bit deeper, it really is very simple 99.9% of cases and takes no more than 2 minutes as opposed to 48hrs discussing how the error would be better worded. I'm off, I have offered the OP help off-thread.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by RingOfFlame View Post
    Maybe you should re-read the post.
    It would seem that SIMS caused the issue during the upgrade, and not the user. So it might be an idea to retract your comments blaming akitajewski and look closer to to home and blame the software that is at fault!
    If you read my posts a little more carefully you will see that my comments are directed at an untrue statement.

    As for upgrades. There have been no issues here with any upgrade for a very long time. Then again - we are well covered here in the Software Working (me) and in the Technical area (My colleague!). And remember that I always take Upgrades at the earliest opportunity and they sometimes contain functionality that is not available to most other users!

    SIMS and the network should be configured so that Upgrades do not break anything! Hopefully, when we have tested SOLUS3 Part B in the summer, you will all have an easier ride re upgrades!

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    If you read my posts a little more carefully you will see that my comments are directed at an untrue statement.
    In your opinion.

    IMS and the network should be configured so that Upgrades do not break anything!
    If a SIMS upgrade breaks a SIMS installation, then that is the fault of the SIMS software, not the setup of the network.

  5. #35

    creese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RingOfFlame View Post
    In your opinion.



    If a SIMS upgrade breaks a SIMS installation, then that is the fault of the SIMS software, not the setup of the network.
    Not biting. My only concern is that the OP gets his sytem working

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    Sivadam's Avatar
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    But my opinion is based on hard facts - SIMS is not 'worst program ever'.
    Which is the statement that I have been objecting to throughout this thread and which I will come back to every single time that anybody criticises my responses!

    It is also a very long time since a SIMS Upgrade broke a SIMS Installation - we are talking 'years'! If it had been a general issue then it would have been on SupportNet a long time by now - and in extreme cases the Upgrade would have been withdrawn, patched and re-issued!
    Last edited by Sivadam; 21st July 2010 at 09:18 AM.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sivadam View Post
    But my opinion is based on hard facts - SIMS is not 'worst program ever'.
    Which is the statement that I have been objecting to throughout this thread and which I will come back to every single time that anybody criticises my responses!

    It is also a very long time since a SIMS Upgrade broke a SIMS Installation - we are talking 'years'!
    Firstly - your facts may be different to the OPs facts. Their installation of SIMS.net may be irritating, and out of their selection of applications, may be the worst program ever. You do not know their entire situation, you do not know the entire context. This means, quite simply, that you cannot turn around and tell them that they are wrong - it isn't a 'right' or 'wrong' situation.

    Second, your statement about SIMS upgrades not breaking a SIMS installation? That's a bit naive. There are multiple examples on these very forums where upgrades have gone wrong and messed up someone's install of SIMS requiring their data to be sent to Capita for repair.

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    Sivadam's Avatar
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    I've said my piece. This could go on for ever.
    So, I'll withdraw from this thread - unless of course somebody posts something that I simply have to respond to!
    'Naive' I may be but there are very many SIMS users around the country who value my 'opinions' very highly!
    But...... enough said now on this topic......!

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    Sarconia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sivadam View Post
    It is also a very long time since a SIMS Upgrade broke a SIMS Installation - we are talking 'years'!
    I seem to remember two issues, the first one, admittedly it didn't break the SIMS.net installation, it just broke the connection as the homepage kept trying to connect to the database to refresh the panels which subsequently forced the database into single user mode... not particularly hard to solve but it was a really annoying problem which I had a lot of calls about.

    Also, schools with a particular type of dataset had issues when after they'd upgraded, upon trying to log in they'd receive an error about a completely random table. Both of these schools had to have site specific patches created in order for them to log in to SIMS again so I'd say that's an upgrade breaking an installation/database.

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    I hesitate to dip my toe into this thread but here goes.

    Much as I also hate 'unhelpful' error messages, I think they have a place. As has been pointed out in this thread, the first person to see the message will be the end user who, if you are lucky, will write down some of the message. If the message is long and complex, the IT support person will only get a garbled version of it most of the time. Keep the message simple and it's easier to pass on to someone who knows what to do with it. It appears that the OP only delivered a partial error message, but they delivered that essential part that enabled those who knew what to do to find the possible answers.

    In short then, I'm with Sivadam and Creese on this one. The error should have been reported to the service desk or SupportNet where it would have been diagnosed promptly. Having said that (and having been an EduGeek participant for several years) I don't think this thread will go down as our finest hour

    (hopes not offended anyone...)

  11. Thanks to ajbritton from:

    Sivadam (28th July 2010)

  12. #41

    vikpaw's Avatar
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    But you can save the error, print the error and even, for those rare occasions when it works, 'Search for Solution'.

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    creese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikpaw View Post
    But you can save the error, print the error and even, for those rare occasions when it works, 'Search for Solution'.
    There are an awful lot of users out there press the printscreen and expect something to happen. That is the level of their knowledge. They work in a school because they want to work term time only and the hours suit. They are far from computer literate and a simple error, as in this case, relayed to a support team would get the job done a lot faster than reading out a long unintelligible computergeekspeek error message. Don't forget we don't all work for and with Secondary schools. KISS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by creese View Post
    There are an awful lot of users out there press the printscreen and expect something to happen. That is the level of their knowledge. They work in a school because they want to work term time only and the hours suit. They are far from computer literate and a simple error, as in this case, relayed to a support team would get the job done a lot faster than reading out a long unintelligible computergeekspeek error message. Don't forget we don't all work for and with Secondary schools. KISS.
    I sometimes wish I worked Term-time only!

    Then again - the system would not be as ready for September as it usually is!
    It's amazing how much you can get done when the school is (virtually) deserted. And, of course, there is more time to contribute to Forums (though there are far fewer threads to contribute to!)

    One assumes that you are generalising, creese, 'cos there are few of us that know what we are doing!
    Last edited by Sivadam; 29th July 2010 at 12:55 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sivadam View Post
    I sometimes wish I worked Term-time only!

    Then again - the system would not be as ready for September as it usually is!
    It's amazing how much you can get done when the school is (virtually) deserted. And, of course, there is more time to contribute to Forums (though there are far fewer threads to contribute to!)
    Agreed, I love working during the holidays as it's one of the few times you can get your head down and concentrate on stuff without continual interruptions. Saying that, even that is getting rarer with catch up sessions and various holdiay schools etc running.

  16. #45

    vikpaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by creese View Post
    There are an awful lot of users out there press the printscreen and expect something to happen. That is the level of their knowledge. They work in a school because they want to work term time only and the hours suit. They are far from computer literate and a simple error, as in this case, relayed to a support team would get the job done a lot faster than reading out a long unintelligible computergeekspeek error message.
    Most schools expect staff to be computer literate and take any appropriate training. We train staff to be able to print, and write things down. We even train to use print screen if they want, or can describe over the phone.

    Nonetheless, the Windows 7 record my problem feature is awesome and our teachers can't wait to use it.

    The point isn't that the error is simple, the point is that the error message could occur for multiple reasons, which has been shown can be trapped separately. The reason code could be modified to Reason 0a, Reason 0b etc. and then be even easier to diagnose.

    The thing is, for most errors the user will have clicked ok and SIMS will have crashed out before they even look closely at the error.

    In the example, they are no more likely to report Reason 0 than any other more meaningful error code, not without recreating the issue, or training them to pay attention.

    The current Fault Codes are a combination of short error code with option to show long unintelligible error data. If that occurs, and i get a call, i ask the user to show that detail and print screen it, as i can see the potential problem even when the Search for Solution button doesn't work.

    Quote Originally Posted by creese View Post
    Don't forget we don't all work for and with Secondary schools.
    How can i forget? I work for an Upper Primary School, a Lower Primary School and a creche.

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