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MIS Systems Thread, SIMS: Manage support staff absence without giving Personnel access. in Technical; I would have used the Capita KB/forums, but they appear to be unavailable atm. Our School Administrator needs to record ...
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    SIMS: Manage support staff absence without giving Personnel access.

    I would have used the Capita KB/forums, but they appear to be unavailable atm.

    Our School Administrator needs to record staff absences. This is easy for Teaching staff (Focus > School > Cover > New Absence). I can't find a comparable route for Support staff that doesn't require access to more personnel functions than we'd like*. Does it exist?


    *not a trust issue, but a policy of default deny/sufficient access only.

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    vikpaw's Avatar
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    i'm going to do this soon.
    my solution is to create a custom permission group that only allows access to the absences area of personnel 7.
    the other workaround is to put the non-teaching staff onto cover area but not available for cover unless you want that of course - i would prefer this but the cover manager is a deputy and doesn't have time to manage teaching and non-teaching absence. not that there is that much.
    i've posted a video elsewhere in MIS forum ages ago on how to make custom permission groups. i'd link but i have to dash off. try searching...

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    pete (23rd February 2010)

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    Quote Originally Posted by vikpaw View Post
    i'm going to do this soon.
    my solution is to create a custom permission group that only allows access to the absences area of personnel 7.
    t...
    Yeah - I know how to create them, just wondered if there was an existing method. Captita have a habit of breaking my custom groups.

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    Sivadam's Avatar
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    There are some Basic Personnel Groups that you can use now.
    Try Personnel Events Officer - this is what it is for!

    Failing that then you can check on the Group I created way back in the Cover7 Field Trial days.
    There is a thread re this on supportnet - Permissions (13183)
    Last edited by Sivadam; 23rd February 2010 at 02:12 PM.

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    pete (23rd February 2010)

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    perfect, forgot about that one!
    that'll save me some work

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    Currently have a ticket open with Capita re this - If I give Personnel Events Officer access + School Administrator access, SIMS crashes and dies when attempting to open a staff record. As soon as I take away school administrator access, it works fine. Checked the KB and there is a similar issue, but the cause is different.

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    Sivadam's Avatar
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    Have you tried giving School Administrator and then adding the P7 Permissions that I highlighted in the permissions thread on SupportNet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pete View Post
    Currently have a ticket open with Capita re this - If I give Personnel Events Officer access + School Administrator access, SIMS crashes and dies when attempting to open a staff record. As soon as I take away school administrator access, it works fine. Checked the KB and there is a similar issue, but the cause is different.
    I just upgraded to Autumn Update release, made a new user unknown to the system and put them in the School Administrator and Personnel Events Officer. They have perfect access to staff details. Unfortunately i dont want the task we have in mind to see the staff personal details so i'm about to remove school admin and hope they only see absence and maybe training.

    Your issue seems odd. Perhaps it's to do with the version of SIMS, or there is another permission applied to that user that has an explicit deny on certain areas of staff permission and that is causing an infarction in SIMS. It seems unlikely though unless they are members of a user defined permissions groups. As far as i know the Capita security model is based on granting access not denying.

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    Just Personnel Events Officer a great little group. On it's own all the user gets is Panel 1, 3 and 4 = Basic Info, Training and Absences.
    Also, they can't even access student info, just see group list and see teachers timetable.
    exactly what we need.

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    Sivadam's Avatar
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    That shows the REAL Value of CRs! And pushing at meetings, field trials, UATs etc. etc. by those that do attend!
    I brought it up in the Field Trial days - and it was obviously well supported.
    I also think that my Permissions thread helped to push it too!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sivadam View Post
    Have you tried giving School Administrator and then adding the P7 Permissions that I highlighted in the permissions thread on SupportNet?
    Yeah - it works. It also works fine for my test & real user if I create a new group and assign School Administrator and Personnel Events Officer roles to it (current workaround so user can get stuff done), but if I use the actual groups it breaks horribly.

    With Capita on the phone we went through the groups that the person was a member of and reapplied the default roles (School Admin roles to School Admin group etc) just in case they'd gone wonky but it didn't fix it.

    About to send the database to Capita for them to poke and prod - while we've got a workaround in place, I'd like to get it fixed/find out if it indicates a deeper problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sivadam View Post
    That shows the REAL Value of CRs! And pushing at meetings, field trials, UATs etc. etc. by those that do attend!
    I brought it up in the Field Trial days - and it was obviously well supported.
    I also think that my Permissions thread helped to push it too!
    Kind of a good point, except CRs are difficult to find and search for, there are many duplicates. I don't think they get the attention they deserve.
    It would be nice if Capita looked at them and then pushed them to users perhaps on the weekly SupportNet Update email, so all can be made aware and register their opinion on things they might not have thought of or encountered yet.
    At least they are published which is a start unlike the Schoolcomms ones, but it's a shame that users like you have to publicise them yourself here and on SupportNet forums to get the votes which will hopefully result in some action.

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    Capita run Software Consultation meetings every year to which users are invited to attend. They are always advertised on SupportNet. Part of these meetings are dedicated to the discussion of CRs. Those CRs that are debated most are obviously those that are most popular (though I often bring up those that may be are not so well supported as a result of them referring to new functionality, that few people will be using!). The various different CRs relating to similar (or the same) requests are also coordinated in this discussion.
    Capita do listen - but they can only respond to those that voice their opions in the correct manner - i.e. constructive criticism.
    So, you guys out there that sometimes criticise Capita re the SIMS Software - you can do something about it!

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    I still think not many people use SupportNet, navigation and search aren't great, it's confusing even for long standing users.
    Many many users aren't able to get to consultation events (or are these held at weekends?). It's hard enough getting permission to go to BETT!
    I'd be interested to know if all CRs are discussed or presented to the group at these things.
    Can we see minutes or at least a report of what went on?
    It's not good enough to merely 'listen', such a big player should 'ask' surely? push the info out to all users, not expect them to check a website and know what's going on.
    But, we've gone off topic here again, it's an interesting discussion. Maybe it could be split into a thread in it's own right...?

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    All CRs that have suitable backing are discussed, as far as I am aware. They certainly have been in the areas that I am interestd in. It's great when you can explain why you have voted strongly against a CR and you can explain exactly why it should not be adopted! More often than not the Product Managers already know anyway, but the look on some others' faces is a picture to behold!

    I diasgree about SupportNet - it is mainly easy to use. Solution search and the Forums are no less than brilliant but I do agree that the CR section is difficult to control. Some of the rubbish that some users request does show them up as users of SIMS who require a little extra training! The shear volume of CRs is also frightening! No wonder it is difficult to control and then act on!

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