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MIS Systems Thread, New install? Where to start? Training/exercises? in Technical; Our LEA has maintained our SIMS install for years but they recently tried to get more work by taking over ...
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    New install? Where to start? Training/exercises?

    Our LEA has maintained our SIMS install for years but they recently tried to get more work by taking over school.

    When we refused to go back to a system with 30min logins as well as other schools they brought in a change to their contract. They no longer are going to support SIMS on curriculum networks.

    This leaves me to install it onto a new server in the summer.

    Problem is apart from installing the client I have no experience in the server side stuff. I have seen the server option in simsint.

    If we outsource it we cannot use the LEA's licence and the finance manager fell of his chair when he looked at Capitas quote.

    Can anyone recommend me training or some good guides for installing a new server ( probably be on server 2012 r2 as I'm hoping it will be supported by then ), and also migrating data.

    Many thanks.

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    vikpaw's Avatar
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    There's plenty of help and guides on here.

    At the moment getting the server installed to the right version might be the hardest part, only because they haven't released all the tools for it yet.
    You need an installable ISO from Capita's SupportNet. If you're not a member sign up. More guides and info there too.

    In a nutshell, install and fully patch windows. Then the same for SQL. Run the SIMS installable for the right version, hopefully summer with latest SQL version then just restore a backup of your current data.

    It's easiest if the data your restoring is from the same setup as your newly created system. You can test it out now, so if you have it on sql 2008, set up an identical virtual server and restore your data. You can use an old installable ISO release. e.g. spring 2012. You'd then have to run the intermediate upgrade ISOs to bring the version of the database up to whatever you're running now, probably Autumn 13...?

    From what i've heard there's not much that changes in SIMS from sql 2008 to 2012 and the migration doesn't appear to do much, but people are wary of it.

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    matt40k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dany2010 View Post
    If we outsource it we cannot use the LEA's licence
    Eh? Would you be forced to re-purchase the license if you don't go with the LEA solution? If you aren't, I don't see a problem with buying top-up support surely? Sure even Capita offers this - @PhilNeal

    Quote Originally Posted by dany2010 View Post
    and the finance manager fell of his chair when he looked at Capitas quote.
    Sounds about right then The core license is a really good deal, they get you on all the "extras".

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    creese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt40k View Post
    Eh? Would you be forced to re-purchase the license if you don't go with the LEA solution?


    If the LA owns the licence, which is likely, the school would need to purchase a licence.

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    matt40k's Avatar
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    That's silly, the only person that would win would be Capita. School isn't happy and stays, they don't have a good relationship, both suffer. School leaves, buys new license, Capita gets more money, School gets money from LA, both suffer.

    Wait a min, this was the whole Academy transferring of licenses subject where "Capita" put in a clause to protect the LEAs from schools running away once they invested the capital, can of worms, abort!! Abort!!

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    creese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt40k View Post
    That's silly, the only person that would win would be Capita. School isn't happy and stays, they don't have a good relationship, both suffer. School leaves, buys new license, Capita gets more money, School gets money from LA, both suffer.

    Wait a min, this was the whole Academy transferring of licenses subject where "Capita" put in a clause to protect the LEAs from schools running away once they invested the capital, can of worms, abort!! Abort!!
    The LA can transfer the licence, for a "small" administration fee (£200 I believe). But that is their choice.

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    matt40k's Avatar
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    Really? I heard they couldn't full stop. No idea how they came up with £200 for what I would assume would be standard routine. Maybe someone put the decimal point in the wrong place?

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    creese's Avatar
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    No idea why so much. I'm sure there are legal considerations, but still standard routine. There will be a fair amount of moving of places on lists, Solus etc.

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    Forget sometimes Capita (SIMS) came from local government, they probably have to have it agreed in a meeting using the standard government procedure - signed in triplicate, sent in, sent back, queried, lost, found, subjected to public inquiry, lost again, and finally buried in soft peat for three months and recycled as firelighters - this is of course before they've had it signed on by the business arm who prob doesn't look at anything less then £100.

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    creese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt40k View Post
    Forget sometimes Capita (SIMS) came from local government, they probably have to have it agreed in a meeting using the standard government procedure - signed in triplicate, sent in, sent back, queried, lost, found, subjected to public inquiry, lost again, and finally buried in soft peat for three months and recycled as firelighters - this is of course before they've had it signed on by the business arm who prob doesn't look at anything less then £100.
    You're just being ridiculous.

    Oh, hold on.... the signed in triplicate is actually true in some cases. Fill out forms. Sign. Copy. Copy. email.

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    teejay's Avatar
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    Your LEA are wrong here and are actually in breach of EU competition law, they have no right to force you to use them for support as that is regarded as anti-competitive. You can continue to use the licence from them and source your support for it from anywhere you choose. Even if the you have signed a multi year deal for support from the LEA, you could still negotiate an opt out or even buy in support alongside the LEA support contract and use that instead of the LEA one, which might actually work out cheaper than re-purchasing SIMS.

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    vikpaw's Avatar
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    But can't they insist on the basis they provide a discounted license? It's not just that they are saying all their schools must use them.

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    I can't see the LA are doing anything wrong legally. Morally??? Maybe.

    The LA owns the licence. The school and LA must have agreed the change in contract.

    Yes, the school can keep the LA licence and find other support, but how is the licence tied in with the support?

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    Quote Originally Posted by creese View Post
    but how is the licence tied in with the support?
    Define "support", I know a number of companies that offer "SIMS Support", however they have no support agreement with Capita, if they phone Capita directly, they will refuse to support them as the LA license was discounted because the LA would do the 1st line support. If the LA under funded, I suspect most small LA will be, they won't be able to deal with it if they are providing "license only" bases.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt40k View Post
    Define "support", I know a number of companies that offer "SIMS Support", however they have no support agreement with Capita, if they phone Capita directly, they will refuse to support them as the LA license was discounted because the LA would do the 1st line support. If the LA under funded, I suspect most small LA will be, they won't be able to deal with it if they are providing "license only" bases.
    I mean is there a clear line between the licence and support, or is it bundled into one package? Support being problems with the software, upgrades etc. What did the school sign for in the contract? I'm sure each LA/School agreement is different.

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