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Mac Thread, Anyone buy Apple machines just for the build quality? in Technical; ...
  1. #46

    nephilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LosOjos View Post
    More often than not, people don't compare like for like.

    For instance, the 13" Macbook Pro costs £1,000.
    The HP ProBook 430 G1, which is identical in spec apart from an ever so slightly larger screen, costs £635 on eBuyer at the moment (HP ProBook 430 G1 Laptop - Laptops | Ebuyer.com)
    For an extra £365, the Macbook had better have impeccable build quality!
    QFT. My old boss purchased a mac pro, which admittedly looked nice and was built well. An identical spec (even down to the graphics chip etc) machine built by dell, cost less than 1/3 of the mac pro's price. It also lasted longer, not through any every day usage, in terms of the fact that it got knocked by kids, and at once point even somehow managed to fall of his desk (at which point the casing got a massive crack and a fan stopped working). I subjected the dell to the same punishment, (and kept it on almost every day) and it survived longer.

    Mac have marketed well, and the build quality is nothing more than the OS is built around the components so yes they do just work with each other, and they cost a fortune for "shiny shiny"

  2. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by LosOjos View Post
    For instance, the 13" Macbook Pro costs £1,000.
    I'm stunned that at that price you don't get a dedicated GPU and instead you have an integrated HD 4400, in My Alienware which is £300 more than the MacBook Pro I Have an Integrated HD 4600 so that's already outperformed the MacBook, 32GB Ram, SSD, Nvidia 780m Dedicated GPU 4GB GDDR5, i7 Processor.... and it's amazing quality. I'm sorry but if what @LosOjos says is true Apple are daylight robbers and I thought my Alienware was over priced :O

  3. #48

    LosOjos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by abillybob View Post
    if what @LosOjos says is true
    It's no secret: MacBook Pro - Buy MacBook Pro Notebook Computers with Free Shipping - Apple Store (UK)

    EDIT: to be fair, I have just noticed the HP is only a 1.6GHz i5 whereas the Macbook Pro is 2.6GHz, let me find a better comparison...

    EDIT2: Dell Inspiron 14 £650: http://www.dell.com/uk/p/inspiron-14...spiron-14-7437
    Still not really a fair comparison, the Dell screen is 1" bigger, it has 2GB extra RAM plus a SSD boot drive, but the processor is identical (I know which I'd buy!)

    The point is, you pay a premium for Apple and I'm not sure the extra cost equates to a significant enough increase in build quality.
    Last edited by LosOjos; 9th April 2014 at 04:14 PM.

  4. #49
    mthomas08's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LosOjos View Post
    I'll accept that malware exists (though if you have decent protection you'd have to be pretty damn unlucky to get infected by a day-0) on Windows and keep gaming
    Yeah, I don't have nay malware issues. Our students do though because they insist on trying to download games and they see "Click here/Download" and they do - they also accept/install anything they see including a ton of toolbars. All this is on their netbooks which have limitations setup.

    Had my machine at home going 2 years nearly with zero issues, accept the large amount of Windows updates.

  5. #50

    LosOjos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mthomas08 View Post
    Yeah, I don't have nay malware issues. Our students do though because they insist on trying to download games and they see "Click here/Download" and they do - they also accept/install anything they see including a ton of toolbars. All this is on their netbooks which have limitations setup.

    Had my machine at home going 2 years nearly with zero issues, accept the large amount of Windows updates.
    One of the biggest problems facing Windows is down to a bad habit that Windows has encouraged for years: logging on as admin. So many problems can be either totally avoided or made incredibly simple to fix if you simply log in under a restricted account. My memory's not so great so this may have been working as far back as XP but certainly since Windows 7, you never need to login as an administrator, you simply provide the admin password when needed to perform admin tasks, just like you would on any *nix machine.

    IMO, Microsoft need to break this habit by having the Windows installation guide users through creating an admin account and password, then setting them up a limited account, rather than defaulting the first user to admin as it has done for far too long (forever?)

  6. #51

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    Its something a myth that Apple Macs are 'better' than Windows based PC's. We've had numerous and vocal calls to kit the music labs out with Apple kit because apparently 'everyone' in the music industry uses apple. Absolute garbage. Maybe 10+ years ago when Apple was probably more stable than windows. However, these days, a decent Business range PC with Win 7 64 bit and plenty of RAM is at least equal to an Apple Mac.

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    Since we replaced our music macs with pcs, our support calls over to that dept have dropped to almost none. We only ever have to go and look at the printers now. None of us can remember the last time we had to fix a problem with the PCs.

    towards the end, we had all sorts of problems with the macs. We must have been over there every day to fix something.

    We had a few problems with sound latency in sibelius to start with, but we fixed that by adding a pci sound card. since then, nothing. They just work. Unlike the other macs we still have...

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    mthomas08's Avatar
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    To be fair to Macs, I do agree (I'm no fan as many know) that for Music they are probably the best choice. Amount of times I have seen documentaries/real life shows and at business's and offices there is a Windows PC (even if the person has a tablet) but for Music Studios there tends to be a Mac sitting on the desk. I do know a few DJs and they do all use Macs. BUT for Schools I think the IT Department should be fully responsible for putting them in place not the Head of Music who has visited another School and seen a bunch of Macs and said "I want them". If it's done properly and for real reasons not misleading information (as I said before) then there would be a lot less gripe against Apple products in Schools.

    I think at the end of the day the one question should always be asked "What do you intend to use the device for?". Regardless of preference or even the shiny factor, that one question should always be asked.

  9. #54

    ICTDirect_Dave's Avatar
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    Once upon a few years ago you'd be right, mac were better for music production, but not so much any more. I've worked in studios and as a live sound engineer and it's all about the stability of the system. A good win 7 build on a powerful pc will perform just as well as a mac. Especially since if you're using an external audio interface, which tbh you shoul be if you're doing anything more than playing with samples.

    Check out my blog (Building a Recording and Sequencing lab on a budget (And why you shouldn’t buy Apple) - Blogs - EduGeek.net) on the mertis of building an recording suite using winows workstations over Macs.

  10. #55

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    So to summarise..... No one buys Macs JUST for the build quality.

  11. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by APMerry View Post
    So to summarise..... No one buys Macs JUST for the build quality.
    Ha. No.

    1. Build quality is pretty much the same if not worse than some PC's you can get on the market
    2. It's too much money to spend to justify buying them just for the 'build quality'
    Last edited by abillybob; 10th April 2014 at 12:18 PM.

  12. #57

    SYNACK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mthomas08 View Post
    To be fair to Macs, I do agree (I'm no fan as many know) that for Music they are probably the best choice. Amount of times I have seen documentaries/real life shows and at business's and offices there is a Windows PC (even if the person has a tablet) but for Music Studios there tends to be a Mac sitting on the desk. I do know a few DJs and they do all use Macs. BUT for Schools I think the IT Department should be fully responsible for putting them in place not the Head of Music who has visited another School and seen a bunch of Macs and said "I want them". If it's done properly and for real reasons not misleading information (as I said before) then there would be a lot less gripe against Apple products in Schools.

    I think at the end of the day the one question should always be asked "What do you intend to use the device for?". Regardless of preference or even the shiny factor, that one question should always be asked.
    Everyone knows I hate Macs but for audio they can have their advantages and that is solely down to the drivers. The audio stack on a mac is more highly optimised as the hardware is known and so timing which is very important, more important than quality in many cases is better.

    You can get around this by using quality sound card with manufacturer ASIO drivers for the card which makes them behave much better. You can also get around this with some systems by using ASIO4ALL - Universal ASIO Driver but it is more hassle for those not looking deeply at the problem. Long story short a PC can be as good or better but requires a little more work than a much more expensive mac system.

  13. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by abillybob View Post
    Ha. No.

    1. Build quality is pretty much the same if not worse than some PC's you can get on the market
    2. It's too much money to spend to justify buying them just for the 'build quality'
    Have you ever owned a mac?

    Compare the quality of a MacBook pro retina with its non apple equivalent.

    The build quality and the feel of the device is far superior. On the otherhand iMacs have gone down hill in the last few years, not sure why Apple have let it slip. Every one I know with an Apple machine has had it last 5 years plus, standard laptops seem to die after around 3-4 years, and if they do last they do not work well. Maybe this is not sure these days but it was four or so years ago.

    To those that say why buy and Apple and put Windows on it, why not? Apple machines just happen to come with Mac OS.
    Last edited by spacebar; 10th April 2014 at 05:32 PM.

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    LosOjos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spacebar View Post
    Compare the quality of a MacBook pro retina with its non apple equivalent.

    The build quality and the feel of the device is far superior.
    I completely disagree - if you compare a MacBook Pro with it's equivalent, I don't think the MacBook Pro is "far superior" at all. Part of the problem is it's incredibly difficult to find an equivalent - equally specced non-Apple devices cost significantly less, as I have already pointed out, and their build quality varies from manufacturer to manufacturer, though I have to say the Dell machines, while not the cheapest, are beautifully made. Equally priced machines easily match the MacBook, if not exceed it, for build quality and have significantly higher spec components.

    So, if you buy Apple, buy because you want Mac OS, but drop the "build quality" card, it's no better than anything else in the same price range.

  15. Thanks to LosOjos from:

    abillybob (11th April 2014)

  16. #60
    flyinghaggis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LosOjos View Post
    I completely disagree - if you compare a MacBook Pro with it's equivalent, I don't think the MacBook Pro is "far superior" at all.
    For the sake of argument what would you say were better equivalents to the following in terms of better build quality and finish compared to the :-

    a) MacBook Pro 15"

    b) MacBook Air 13"

    I think we can all agree that you can buy better specced kit for less than what Apple charge but are there genuinely laptops out there that are better in terms of overall build and finish? I'm not approaching the question from a pro or anti Apple viewpoint BTW! Just opening it up for discussion as it would be nice to have some examples
    Last edited by flyinghaggis; 10th April 2014 at 05:52 PM.

  17. Thanks to flyinghaggis from:

    mac_shinobi (10th April 2014)

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