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Mac Thread, Anyone buy Apple machines just for the build quality? in Technical; Originally Posted by ICTDirect_Dave True, we do ram and CPU kits for Mac Pros all the time but we're cheaper ...
  1. #196

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
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    Anyone buy Apple machines just for the build quality?

    Quote Originally Posted by ICTDirect_Dave View Post
    True, we do ram and CPU kits for Mac Pros all the time but we're cheaper than Apple.
    @ICTDirect_Dave ??
    For which year mac pro's , how much for and how much are each mac pro's etc etc. PM me if thats easier etc
    Last edited by mac_shinobi; 16th April 2014 at 11:43 AM.

  2. #197

    ICTDirect_Dave's Avatar
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    To clarify,

    we have components that will fit any mac pro that fits in the massive aluminium tower. So if you need an ECC RAM or Xeon CPU upgrade I'm your man

  3. Thanks to ICTDirect_Dave from:

    mac_shinobi (16th April 2014)

  4. #198

    seawolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nephilim View Post
    Forever a Mac Fan -

    Yes, Mac Pros have always been expensive, but there are a few reasons for that and a few things that make this (VERY dated, Circa 2010 at best) analysis overly simplistic and actually pointless.

    1. The Mac Pro has one of the best designed and solidly built cases of any desktop computer ever made. It's a tank with very nice drive caddies, easy to add extra cards, drives, and RAM and a very effective, very quiet fan. It's also very nice looking.

    2. ECC RAM is server-grade and not cheap. Xeon processors aren't cheap, especially when the Nehelem was just released. Who ever upgrades RAM from the manufacturer anyway when it's as easy to upgrade as it is in the Mac Pro?

    3. Who buys 4 HDDs from the computer manufacturer unless it's for a server, SAN, or high-end NAS? It's always cheaper somewhere else. And it only takes a few minutes to install drives in the drive caddies in a Mac Pro.

    4. Complaining about a small price premium over the best retail price available (or vs used GPUs no less) for GPUs, on a $3,000+ computer - give me a break. But, hey the author of this comparison is in luck now because they can save $2,000 off the retail price for the 2 GPUs offered in the new Mac Pro...

    5. The Mac Pro lasts for eons, as it should for the price. The build quality is absolutely outstanding on them and I (or companies I have managed them for) have owned 12 PowerMac G5s and Intel Mac Pros since 2006. Each one lasted 8-9 years before I sold them or gave them away in the end. Only one had a hardware failure of any kind and that was in a G5 model that had the power supply go after 5 years. Repaired it and sold it 3 years later still going string. I have two early 2010 models that have not had a single problem and I expect they won't until I retire them in 2 years or so.

    So, yes you do pay a premium for a Mac Pro, but this is one case where you do get what you pay for. The new Mac Pro appears to make that case more than any Mac Pro before it too.

  5. #199

    matt40k's Avatar
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    I'm actually getting tempted to get a Mac after reading this. Don't get me wrong, I love my Windows PC and it'll always be no1, but its tempting me. Can't decide if I should get a MacBook Air or a Mac Mini - the mini has the upgradable RAM, it's just the whole monitor issue. Urks me the new laptops don't even allow you to upgrade the RAM, just seems insane!

  6. #200

    ICTDirect_Dave's Avatar
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    Get a Mac Mini, Direct connect to your TV using HDMI and then use your smartphone and the RemoteMouse app for control (or get the bluetooth keyboard and trackpad). They're great for a media hub, and just all round lovely really.

  7. #201

    synaesthesia's Avatar
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    That whole infographic thing is correct but the monitor thing is a little OTT. Yes, you can easily double the price for another 6".

    By the way, you've clearly never seen any of the older Gateway PC's. If you call a Mac a tank, then those old gateways would have been tank busters.

  8. #202

    seawolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt40k View Post
    I'm actually getting tempted to get a Mac after reading this. Don't get me wrong, I love my Windows PC and it'll always be no1, but its tempting me. Can't decide if I should get a MacBook Air or a Mac Mini - the mini has the upgradable RAM, it's just the whole monitor issue. Urks me the new laptops don't even allow you to upgrade the RAM, just seems insane!
    Yes, the lack of an easy* RAM upgrade on the MBA and rMBP is annoying. At least the upgrade cost for RAM is more reasonable than it used to be. The Mac Mini is a great little unit. You can upgrade the drive and even install a second drive in them with a bit of patience and skill - I've upgraded over 30 myself.

    *The RAM can actually be upgraded, but only with great skill and some definite risk. Not recommended.

  9. #203

    nephilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    Yes, Mac Pros have always been expensive, but there are a few reasons for that and a few things that make this (VERY dated, Circa 2010 at best) analysis overly simplistic and actually pointless.
    I agree, it is overly simplistic, but it was aimed at making people think about their purchase more than anything else.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    1. The Mac Pro has one of the best designed and solidly built cases of any desktop computer ever made. It's a tank with very nice drive caddies, easy to add extra cards, drives, and RAM and a very effective, very quiet fan. It's also very nice looking.
    Going to have to say no here. I have had an alienware which took a literal beating when I moved house from the UK to Belize and then 6 months later back to the UK, and barely a scratch or a dent on it (that said, Alienware is the Windows Equivalent to a Mac, and I was a teenager at the time).

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    2. ECC RAM is server-grade and not cheap. Xeon processors aren't cheap, especially when the Nehelem was just released. Who ever upgrades RAM from the manufacturer anyway when it's as easy to upgrade as it is in the Mac Pro?
    No argument about ECC Ram and Xeon Processors, but this machine is more server than it is a desktop PC, and they're branding it a desktop PC. If you took a look at the specs without knowing the maker, you would have probably said it was a server than a desktop.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    3. Who buys 4 HDDs from the computer manufacturer unless it's for a server, SAN, or high-end NAS? It's always cheaper somewhere else. And it only takes a few minutes to install drives in the drive caddies in a Mac Pro.
    Yes it is cheaper elsewhere, I agree. It also only took seconds to install HDDs in my alienware and in my current case, literally unplug sata cable and power cable and slide out, no need for screwing in etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    4. Complaining about a small price premium over the best retail price available (or vs used GPUs no less) for GPUs, on a $3,000+ computer - give me a break. But, hey the author of this comparison is in luck now because they can save $2,000 off the retail price for the 2 GPUs offered in the new Mac Pro...
    Got nothing on this, the guy was being a bit of an idiot comparing to 2nd hand cards, no doubt. But even brand new cards, they were using dated and rebranded old ones at the time of this picture creation.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    5. The Mac Pro lasts for eons, as it should for the price. The build quality is absolutely outstanding on them and I (or companies I have managed them for) have owned 12 PowerMac G5s and Intel Mac Pros since 2006. Each one lasted 8-9 years before I sold them or gave them away in the end. Only one had a hardware failure of any kind and that was in a G5 model that had the power supply go after 5 years. Repaired it and sold it 3 years later still going string. I have two early 2010 models that have not had a single problem and I expect they won't until I retire them in 2 years or so.
    Got no issue on the longevity of SOME macs, I've said previously I have had a few, some were great, some not so great. Much of a muchness, they had hardware failures as any machine would.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf
    So, yes you do pay a premium for a Mac Pro, but this is one case where you do get what you pay for. The new Mac Pro appears to make that case more than any Mac Pro before it too.
    There is paying a premium, and then there is being ridiculous. Apple were grossly overcharging for office software done by MS (Mac versions of it in my local PC world are the same price as PC versions). One option they don't have on there, but they do resell is adobe creative suite. The Apple store in Milton Keynes (nearest apple store) and the Apple Premium reseller store (StormFront) in Luton (nearest reseller, not actual Apple store) wanted nearly 2000 (MK) and 1700 (Luton) for the package when adobe offer it out for 1200. Talk about a high priced mark up!

  10. #204

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    Quote Originally Posted by ICTDirect_Dave View Post
    Get a Mac Mini, Direct connect to your TV using HDMI and then use your smartphone and the RemoteMouse app for control (or get the bluetooth keyboard and trackpad). They're great for a media hub, and just all round lovely really.
    I'm clearly in the wrong job, cost of Mac Mini - 500, cost of RaspBerry Pi - 30, Cost of Google thingy - 30. Yer, not sure I have the kinda money to waste on a media centre lol. Still tempted tho, certain things tend to be Mac-centric, I'm not saying the Windows version is difficult, it's just some things are not always as refined, that's all. Plus I can say I'm educating my son in all things non-MS

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    *The RAM can actually be upgraded, but only with great skill and some definite risk. Not recommended.
    I've done one before, Intel Solo, and that was ok, bit of a faff, but I was under the impression the new one you just turn the bottom to open it then the RAM slots are right there - HDD is a bit of pain.

  11. #205

    ICTDirect_Dave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nephilim View Post

    No argument about ECC Ram and Xeon Processors, but this machine is more server than it is a desktop PC, and they're branding it a desktop PC. If you took a look at the specs without knowing the maker, you would have probably said it was a server than a desktop.
    Just because the architecture is similar to the server doesn't mean a thing. It's being sold as a workstation class desktop, and all OEMs sell similar specs. HP, Dell, Lenovo, all sell the same machines. they're aimed at professionals who need high compute and graphical power. Apple never branded this as a consumer desktop, it's always been for professionals.

    I'd also like to point out that I specced a HP Z820 up and got a price of over $80,000! Price is always relative.
    Last edited by ICTDirect_Dave; 16th April 2014 at 12:34 PM.

  12. #206

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt40k View Post
    I'm clearly in the wrong job, cost of Mac Mini - 500, cost of RaspBerry Pi - 30, Cost of Google thingy - 30. Yer, not sure I have the kinda money to waste on a media centre lol. Still tempted tho, certain things tend to be Mac-centric, I'm not saying the Windows version is difficult, it's just some things are not always as refined, that's all. Plus I can say I'm educating my son in all things non-MS
    Just suggesting that if you're planning on getting one anyway, that it's a useful additional use for it I'd never buy one purely for that purpose.

  13. #207

    nephilim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICTDirect_Dave View Post
    Just because the architecture is similar to the server doesn't mean a thing. It's being sold as a workstation class desktop, and all OEMs sell similar specs. HP, Dell, Lenovo, all sell the same machines. they're aimed at professionals who need high compute and graphical power. Apple never branded this as a consumer desktop, it's always been for professionals.

    I'd also like to point out that I specced a HP Z820 up and got a price of over $80,000! Price is always relative.
    I stand corrected.

  14. #208

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    Quote Originally Posted by nephilim View Post
    I stand corrected.
    I'm sitting down corrected :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Norphy View Post
    Yes, I'd be able to upgrade the CPUs, RAM etc to whatever the motherboard supports but I could do that with a Mac Pro.
    Not any more, they solder them in to the new rubbish tins.

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    No they don't

    Socketed CPU, standard DIMMs and a removable SSD

    http://d3nevzfk7ii3be.cloudfront.net...VD1AnbWMo.huge

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