+ Post New Thread
Page 10 of 15 FirstFirst ... 67891011121314 ... LastLast
Results 136 to 150 of 225
Mac Thread, Anyone buy Apple machines just for the build quality? in Technical; Originally Posted by spacebar On another note I think its about time Microsoft started to Make PC's, they did it ...
  1. #136

    glennda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Sussex
    Posts
    7,808
    Thank Post
    272
    Thanked 1,135 Times in 1,031 Posts
    Rep Power
    349
    Quote Originally Posted by spacebar View Post
    On another note I think its about time Microsoft started to Make PC's, they did it with game consoles so maybe they can do it with PC's.
    no its really not!

  2. #137

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    32
    Thank Post
    1
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Rep Power
    0
    The surface and surface pro are nice products

  3. #138
    flyinghaggis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    1,003
    Thank Post
    100
    Thanked 74 Times in 58 Posts
    Rep Power
    115
    Quote Originally Posted by computerguy View Post
    The surface and surface pro are nice products
    They're well made and beautifully finished products at relatively decent price points. However I wouldn't actually call either a good overall product at this point in time. The Surface RT is rendered useless thanks to the limited software available for WindowsRT. I thought the Surface Pro would be the ultimate tablet PC until I used it and realised that to make it's 10" 1080p display usable they'd set the default font scaling to 150% which would 'break' half of the desktop apps I need to use.

    It's Windows 8 that let's the side down TBH as with the Surface tablets Microsoft's had hardware that was on a par with Apple IMO. Ironic really given that Microsoft's main focus should be software! I've just installed Windows 8.1 upgrade one and it's filled me with disappointment at how little has changed I guess we'll have to hold out for Windows 9 until Microsoft get round to fixing the issues introduced by Windows8.
    Last edited by flyinghaggis; 12th April 2014 at 06:22 PM.

  4. #139

    LosOjos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    West Midlands
    Posts
    5,452
    Thank Post
    1,439
    Thanked 1,170 Times in 798 Posts
    Rep Power
    707
    Quote Originally Posted by flyinghaggis View Post
    They're well made and beautifully finished products at relatively decent price points. However I wouldn't actually call either a good overall product at this point in time. The Surface RT is rendered useless thanks to the limited software available for WindowsRT. I thought the Surface Pro would be the ultimate tablet PC until I used it and realised that to make it's 10" 1080p display usable they'd set the default font scaling to 150% which would 'break' half of the desktop apps I need to use.

    It's Windows 8 that let's the side down TBH as with the Surface tablets Microsoft's had hardware that was on a par with Apple IMO. Ironic really given that Microsoft's main focus should be software! I've just installed Windows 8.1 upgrade one and it's filled me with disappointment at how little has changed I guess we'll have to hold out for Windows 9 until Microsoft get round to fixing the issues introduced by Windows8.
    Yeah, unfortunately Windows 8 has lived up to the age old good/bad Windows cycle. 8.1 was a substantial improvement on 8, if only for allowing you to boot straight to Desktop! 8.1 update 1's (bloody ridiculous numbering scheme!) biggest change was an important one but one that most users won't notice; it detects whether you are using a touch screen or not and makes "boot to desktop" default if not - that really ought to have been the case since day one! I like that apps show on the taskbar now and that the taskbar is always available, but it annoyed me that they still won't let you properly "window" apps; they're minimized or maximized, no in between (apart from screen splitting, which is OK but not always flexible enough).

    Windows 8 has definitely improved a lot (I've been using it since dev previews became available) and the core OS really is a step up but the polarizing UI is what it will be remembered for and I'm with the majority on that one; it's a cumbersome mish-mash that's not really a good fit for mouse or touch screen users.

    Here's hoping Windows 9 follows the good/bad trend!

    EDIT: so much for me being out of the thread eh?

  5. #140

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    32
    Thank Post
    1
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Rep Power
    0
    I've started to use it again just by pushing the windows key and typing the name of whatever I want. Actually makes me work quicker than in 7 but it is still cumbersome navigating through menus to find things. Confusing for everyone I think, unfortunately!

  6. #141
    flyinghaggis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    1,003
    Thank Post
    100
    Thanked 74 Times in 58 Posts
    Rep Power
    115
    Quote Originally Posted by LosOjos View Post
    ...it annoyed me that they still won't let you properly "window" apps; they're minimized or maximized, no in between (apart from screen splitting, which is OK but not always flexible enough).
    I know what you mean. I can't believe that they don't have Windowing options for Metro apps by now. THere's still no way of combining desktop apps and Windows apps on split screen either. I notice that opening up a link in mail causes the screen to split and open the link in IE which is OK but most web pages don't really fit in a 960 pixel wide windows. Also, if you drag the IE split to full screen then drag it back to half screen it 'forgets' that the Mail was the last app you had open and displays half the screen blank. It was more effective when it opened the link full screen TBH.

    I sometimes wonder if MS actually used Windows 8 themselves before they released it!
    Last edited by flyinghaggis; 12th April 2014 at 08:09 PM.

  7. #142

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    9,756
    Thank Post
    3,265
    Thanked 1,052 Times in 973 Posts
    Rep Power
    365

  8. 2 Thanks to mac_shinobi:

    flyinghaggis (12th April 2014), synaesthesia (12th April 2014)

  9. #143

    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    679
    Thank Post
    264
    Thanked 98 Times in 81 Posts
    Rep Power
    27
    Lol love it

  10. #144

    seawolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    969
    Thank Post
    12
    Thanked 283 Times in 217 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    175
    Quote Originally Posted by spacebar View Post
    So in conclusion not many buy Apple products for the build quality.

    It seems that a person will buy an Apple product for one for the following reasons.

    A) Build quality and style.

    B) Because it has an Apple logo on it.

    C) Because "everyone else" is buying them.

    D) You want/need to use Mac OS.

    E) You are a mindless drone sucked into consumerism.
    Actually, C would be a more appropriate answer if the question were "Why do people buy an Android or Windows product?" Given the market share of the Mac, if you're just buying what "everyone else" is buying it wouldn't be a Mac.

    I'll give you my alternative list of reasons why a rational person would buy Apple products:

    1) High build quality combined with great industrial style.
    2) OS X is a Unix-based OS with a very good GUI and excellent software (iLife, iWork, FCPX, Logic Pro, etc.)
    3) Ease of visiting a local Apple Store (or Apple Care centre) for purchasing and support
    4) Apple makes their product line easy to understand for the non-technical person making purchasing decisions less confusing
    5) Full vertical integration of Apple products

    For quite a few people any or all of the first four are enough reason for them. For me, it is the the 5th reason that seals the deal.

    Good build quality and industrial styling can be found from some other manufacturers or product lines besides Apple. Microsoft and Samsung both have stores you can visit now for support, and many Linux distros have great GUIs and some great software (not as wide a selection as OSX of course). But, most manufacturers fail in comparison to Apple for number four, although there are a few smaller companies that do get it.

    However, none of them provide the level of vertical integration that Apple do, and this does make a difference. Microsoft are starting to get this, and Samsung are now doing their best to copy Apple in this regard too. If you can't beat them, join them...

  11. 2 Thanks to seawolf:

    ICTDirect_Dave (13th April 2014), mac_shinobi (13th April 2014)

  12. #145

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    9,756
    Thank Post
    3,265
    Thanked 1,052 Times in 973 Posts
    Rep Power
    365
    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    Actually, C would be a more appropriate answer if the question were "Why do people buy an Android or Windows product?" Given the market share of the Mac, if you're just buying what "everyone else" is buying it wouldn't be a Mac.

    I'll give you my alternative list of reasons why a rational person would buy Apple products:

    1) High build quality combined with great industrial style.
    2) OS X is a Unix-based OS with a very good GUI and excellent software (iLife, iWork, FCPX, Logic Pro, etc.)
    3) Ease of visiting a local Apple Store (or Apple Care centre) for purchasing and support
    4) Apple makes their product line easy to understand for the non-technical person making purchasing decisions less confusing
    5) Full vertical integration of Apple products

    For quite a few people any or all of the first four are enough reason for them. For me, it is the the 5th reason that seals the deal.

    Good build quality and industrial styling can be found from some other manufacturers or product lines besides Apple. Microsoft and Samsung both have stores you can visit now for support, and many Linux distros have great GUIs and some great software (not as wide a selection as OSX of course). But, most manufacturers fail in comparison to Apple for number four, although there are a few smaller companies that do get it.

    However, none of them provide the level of vertical integration that Apple do, and this does make a difference. Microsoft are starting to get this, and Samsung are now doing their best to copy Apple in this regard too. If you can't beat them, join them...
    I think for the most part you do get good quality however some things need to be better just as one example my 2011 mac mini which was the higher end one that comes with the AMD gpu came with hynix ram and a slow 5,400 rpm hdd

    Crucial 16 gb ram kit is about £114 and a reasonable ssd such as a 256 gb samsung 840 pro is aprox £170

    Taking into consideration I paid about £600 for it at the time and on top of that just before the first year ran out paid £140 for apple care which touch wood I don't have to use

    All I am saying is they could have used a 7,200 rpm hdd ie 750gb wd black and the crucial 16gb ram kit

    I will soon upgrade it but want to wait until apple care expires which I believe is around August this year and will then follow the ifixit guide to a T and can then use the mac mini more effectively

  13. #146

    seawolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    969
    Thank Post
    12
    Thanked 283 Times in 217 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    175
    Quote Originally Posted by mac_shinobi View Post
    I think for the most part you do get good quality however some things need to be better just as one example my 2011 mac mini which was the higher end one that comes with the AMD gpu came with hynix ram and a slow 5,400 rpm hdd

    Crucial 16 gb ram kit is about £114 and a reasonable ssd such as a 256 gb samsung 840 pro is aprox £170

    Taking into consideration I paid about £600 for it at the time and on top of that just before the first year ran out paid £140 for apple care which touch wood I don't have to use

    All I am saying is they could have used a 7,200 rpm hdd ie 750gb wd black and the crucial 16gb ram kit

    I will soon upgrade it but want to wait until apple care expires which I believe is around August this year and will then follow the ifixit guide to a T and can then use the mac mini more effectively
    The only problem I've ever had out of the 50 or so Mac Minis I've had were the DVD drives on the 2010 models. DVD drives in those models died like chooks in a hot aussie summer. I suspect that's one reason the DVD drive disappeared in the subsequent model. Otherwise, they've been faultless and the first two Mac Minis I bought in early 2008 still chugging along. So, build quality is certainly good for the cost.

    The reason for 5,400rpm drives has more to do with the physics of minimising heat in a very small internal space. If 7,200rpm drives are used they generate more heat that must be dealt with. This would require larger fans or increasing the rpm of the fans, which would either increase the size of the computer or make it noisier. SSDs solve that problem, but large SSDs are expensive and replacing a 1TB HDD with a 128GB SSD in the base model wouldn't suit a lot of people. As the price comes down, I expect that's what you'll see.

    As for RAM, that's the cheapest and easiest upgrade, I wish I could order one without any RAM and reduce the cost rather than Apple putting 16GB as the default.
    Last edited by seawolf; 13th April 2014 at 01:46 PM.

  14. #147


    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    51.403651, -0.515458
    Posts
    8,878
    Thank Post
    226
    Thanked 2,669 Times in 1,968 Posts
    Rep Power
    786
    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    The only problem I've ever had out of the 50 or so Mac Minis I've had were the DVD drives on the 2010 models. DVD drives in those models died like chooks in a hot aussie summer.
    The DVD drive on my early 2009 Mac mini also died, so I took it out and put a hard drive in its place (along with an SSD where the HDD used to go). Best upgrade ever!

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    I suspect that's one reason the DVD drive disappeared in the subsequent model.
    That, and Apple want you to buy more things from their iTunes and Mac App stores.

    Optical drives make very little sense in modern PCs anyway since most things are downloadable now.

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    The reason for 5,400rpm drives has more to do with the physics of minimising heat in a very small internal space.
    Indeed. The other problem is that Seagate have also stopped selling 7,200rpm HDDs due to lack of demand and Western Digital don't make many 7,200 rpm HDDs either.

    Switching to hybrid hard drives (SSHDs) wouldn't make sense for Apple, because they would rather sell you a Mac with a significantly faster 'Fusion Drive' instead (128GB SSD + 1TB or 2TB HDD).

    Quote Originally Posted by seawolf View Post
    As the price comes down, I expect that's what you'll see.
    With SSDs due to fall in price by another 20%-30% this year, I expect we'll see the next Mac mini (or perhaps the one that follows that) with PCIe SSDs - like the MBA or rMBP - and soldered on RAM. Once that happens, Apple can make the Mac mini a bit smaller since it's still the same size as when it came with an optical drive.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac_shinobi View Post
    my 2011 mac mini which was the higher end one that comes with the AMD gpu came with hynix ram and a slow 5,400 rpm hdd
    Macs have been coming with 5,400rpm HDDs for years.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac_shinobi View Post
    All I am saying is they could have used a 7,200 rpm hdd ie 750gb wd black and the crucial 16gb ram kit
    If Apple did that, your Mac mini would probably end up costing £1,000+.

    There's also the additional heat to deal with as @seawolf mentioned.

    The only Mac with a 7,200rpm HDD is the 27" iMac.

  15. #148

    synaesthesia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Northamptonshire
    Posts
    5,948
    Thank Post
    583
    Thanked 1,019 Times in 784 Posts
    Blog Entries
    15
    Rep Power
    464
    Prettiness comes at a price. (re crap hard drives). SSD's are a blessing for Apple.

  16. #149
    Norphy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Harpenden
    Posts
    2,309
    Thank Post
    54
    Thanked 290 Times in 227 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Rep Power
    116
    SSDs are a blessing for anyone who uses them, not solely Apple.

  17. Thanks to Norphy from:

    mac_shinobi (14th April 2014)

  18. #150

    synaesthesia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Northamptonshire
    Posts
    5,948
    Thank Post
    583
    Thanked 1,019 Times in 784 Posts
    Blog Entries
    15
    Rep Power
    464
    Obviously, but the point was it saved Apple having to continue to nerf performance by using crap hard drives.

SHARE:
+ Post New Thread
Page 10 of 15 FirstFirst ... 67891011121314 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Building Schools for the Future
    By Dos_Box in forum IT News
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 11th July 2008, 01:08 PM
  2. ICT in Building Schools for the Future
    By Squashy in forum BSF
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 3rd July 2008, 01:02 PM
  3. Looking for the VLE SEF.. anyone?
    By steele_uk in forum Virtual Learning Platforms
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 29th March 2008, 09:09 AM
  4. How to block GChat....Just for the students!
    By acrobson in forum General Chat
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 13th June 2007, 02:10 PM
  5. Need to buy a Laser Printer for the staff room.
    By tosca925 in forum Hardware
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 10th October 2006, 05:15 PM

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •