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Licensing Questions Thread, Apple stopped Volume License purchase for OSX Lion. Help! in Technical; Originally Posted by MacGeek Buy a copy of Lion via the app store. Image and restore. Make sure you buy ...
  1. #16

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGeek View Post
    Buy a copy of Lion via the app store. Image and restore. Make sure you buy enough copies of the Mountain Lion VL when it comes out and you will be fine. We run Snow Leopard on Lion generation iMacs and Apple Ok'd it.
    I thought you could only image upto 5 macs for each downloaded copy you get

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    Quote Originally Posted by mac_shinobi View Post
    I thought you could only image upto 5 macs for each downloaded copy you get
    I think you can only download it on 5 macs but you can image it to as many as you want.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamPayton View Post
    It seems to me like Apple don't really care about the enterprise and volume license areas like colleges and Universities anymore. It's like they are making too much money from the home users now with iPads and iPods etc.
    That's the impression I get too, which is why we're not bothering to upgrade from Snow Leopard and have no plans to invest any more in our mac infrastructure. If Apple don't want to sell stuff to us, we don't see why we should struggle to try and force them.

    Quote Originally Posted by GrumbleDook View Post
    I thought that you could go backwards from ML to Lion on the VL deal? At least that is what a few HE/FE folk think and have been told ...

    I'll go and ask again but now have a feeling they were told the same as you.
    As I'm from FE, I'll say we've heard a lot of stuff but no-one has ever shown me something written in black and white that confirms what my college can and can not do with OSX licences in this regard. This is crazy - you can't base a major deployment on rumour and hearsay.

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    Its the Apple way, they don't provide the required enterprise support in all areas then 'helpfully' suggest that they won't come down on you like a tonne of bricks, probably. You just have to trust them not to change their tune and come down on you like a bag of hammers at some point when they do eventually make up their minds or decide they want more money.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    Its the Apple way, they don't provide the required enterprise support in all areas then 'helpfully' suggest that they won't come down on you like a tonne of bricks, probably. You just have to trust them not to change their tune and come down on you like a bag of hammers at some point when they do eventually make up their minds or decide they want more money.
    I understand that it's the "Apple way". The point is that none of us should (and we certainly will not) work that way with any supplier. Essentially, my employer's position comes down to: proper licence agreements or GTFO.

    Software companies don't get to make dire threats about piracy on one hand and then not bother with proper licence agreements on the other, as far as we're concerned.

  6. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberto View Post
    I understand that it's the "Apple way". The point is that none of us should (and we certainly will not) work that way with any supplier. Essentially, my employer's position comes down to: proper licence agreements or GTFO.

    Software companies don't get to make dire threats about piracy on one hand and then not bother with proper licence agreements on the other, as far as we're concerned.
    I fully agree, I have lost count of the times when the certified Apple tech's main suggetion/recomendation was to pirate various titles as we were a school and that was an expected benifit. This was back in the OS9 days but they are still playing the same two faced games. The Apple crew are all for the 5 iPads to one account thing as a benifit to schools basiclly ripping off the developers to help Apple. Adding work load and putting the school at risk all because they can't be bothered to setup the propper agreements. Its all stupid games with them unless you are in the states which is the only market they actually care about. Sure they sell them elsewhere but outside the states its varying degrees of ripoff and risk.

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    Considering the price of OS X has been getting progressively cheaper over the last five years, what's the problem with just buying X copies of 10.8 from the Mac App Store?

    Code:
    Leopard          $129.00 (£83.00 inc. VAT @ 17.5% / £72.17 ex. VAT)
    Snow Leopard      $49.00 (£25.00 inc. VAT @ 15% / £21.74 ex. VAT)
    Lion              $29.99 (£20.99 inc. VAT @ 23% / £17.07 ex. VAT)
    Mountain Lion     $19.99 (£13.99 inc. VAT @ 23% / £11.37 ex. VAT)
    Code:
    Leopard Server*        $999.00 (£629.00 inc. VAT @ 17.5% / £535.32 ex. VAT)
    Snow Leopard Server*   $499.00 (£399.00 inc. VAT @ 15% / £346.96 ex. VAT)
    Lion Server             $49.99  (£34.99 inc. VAT @ 23% / £28.45 ex. VAT)
    Mountain Lion Server    $19.99  (£14.99 inc. VAT @ 23%?)
    
    * Unlimited Client Version

  8. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    Considering the price of OS X has been getting progressively cheaper over the last five years, what's the problem with just buying X copies of 10.8 from the Mac App Store?
    Because this process becomes less and less manageable as the value of X gets higher. My college has got better things for me to be doing with my time than messing around with the app store trying to buy 75 individual copies of each thing we want - is that even possible without 75 accounts, or will it just say "you've already purchased that..."?
    Last edited by Roberto; 25th June 2012 at 09:50 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roberto View Post
    Because this process becomes less and less manageable as the value of X gets higher. My college has got better things for me to be doing with my time than messing around with the app store trying to buy 75 individual copies of each thing we want - is that even possible without 75 accounts, or will it just say "you've already purchased that..."?
    Exactly, it isn't the price that is an issue, more the manageability of it. Considering the lack of serial numbers/activation, I would have no problem buying 50 individual copies, but I'm guessing it wouldnt be as easy as that

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    If you look at it from a Change Management / Project Management point of view, this is either a very naive action or one of plain disdain for large scale users on the part of Apple. You cannot plan to role out a system when you have not had training on it, have access to a final live system or have a lot of direct engagement from the OS provider on it. This is one area I have a lot more time for Microsoft over Apple any day.

    I have asked the question now and been told there are no downgrade rights (partly due to cheaper price) and it will work on any CPU running SL (having tested it on an older machine ... it doesn't run as well as SL or Lion in comparison to how ML runs on a new machine). I suppose it would be up to a school to decide whether they want to break their agreement and downgrade to Lion (should they have the VL media).

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    Quote Originally Posted by sidewinder View Post
    Exactly, it isn't the price that is an issue, more the manageability of it. Considering the lack of serial numbers/activation, I would have no problem buying 50 individual copies, but I'm guessing it wouldnt be as easy as that
    Especially not if they are only elegable for one upgrade at a time meaning your up for $20 * 100+ computers every year just for the OS let alone the Apps. Much cheaper to get an EES and some real computers

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    Quote Originally Posted by SYNACK View Post
    Especially not if they are only elegable for one upgrade at a time meaning your up for $20 * 100+ computers every year just for the OS let alone the Apps. Much cheaper to get an EES and some real computers
    Heh. I still really like Apple computers for personal use. It's just that it's clear that they feel the same way about having their products used in an 'enterprise' setting that I do about using OS/2 or Lotus Notes. And I'm not comfortable betting against the bank with my employer's money.

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    Than you very much to everyone for the replies. It's a bit easier to stomach knowing that I'm not the only one having to wade through all of this.

    I get the point about rolling out the Lion desktop from just one installer. But what about the OSX servers? Don't I need separate keys for each of them? I thought if I re-used a key, and it was connected to the internet, then the original server would be deactivated

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    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamPayton View Post
    Don't I need separate keys for each of them?
    Apps bought through the Mac App Store don't have product keys.

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    Meh....

    Schools wanting multiple licences have always had the ability to buy them either through the Apple Ed Store or their local ASE dealer so I don't understand where all the negativity comes from.

    Mass deployment of Lion or Lion Server can be done in number of ways, personally I prefer the one below using Deploy Studio.....

    Skinning a Cat: Lots of Ways to Deploy Lion

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