+ Post New Thread
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 49
Internet Related/Filtering/Firewall Thread, 'Next Generation Securus' in Technical; Originally Posted by Willott Bill, Now that the pricing for the hardware version has been reduced, could you let us ...
  1. #31
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Willott View Post
    Bill,

    Now that the pricing for the hardware version has been reduced, could you let us know whether the VM version is to be reduced in cost, and if not, why not?

    Regards

    Will
    Hi Will,

    Thanks for asking. The short answer is no. The VM version is a new release and was originally destined only for LA's where there are large requirements. At BETT many of you asked if we would release a VM version for schools and after consideration we decided that it would be a good idea to do so but only after we'd made everyone aware of the risks. Our concern is surrounding the issue of what happens if Securus picks up an ILLEGAL activity? With our current offering, the police will call and take the Securus server away. Our Service Level Agreement caters for a replacement. But what about VM? This hasn't been tested and we're anxious not to expose our clients to extra risk until we know all the answers which is why we're telling everyone before we agree to supplying.

    As to the cost? We do have to put work into creating the VM ISO and after discussions with a couple of you it was deemed to be a fair price. I don't actually know what price you're referring to but am assuming you are talking about 495 for a Secondary School ISO? We did reduce the price of the Next Generation server after a fair argument from a forum member but this isn't a reason to do the same for the ISO. We do need to make money to pay for all our development and support work, vulgar as this may sound!

    Hope this helps.

    Bill

  2. #32

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    569
    Thank Post
    38
    Thanked 114 Times in 104 Posts
    Rep Power
    45
    Quote Originally Posted by billjenkins View Post
    We do need to make money to pay for all our development and support work, vulgar as this may sound!
    Hi Bill,

    Thanks for the reply... I find this part of your comment the most interesting... I thought that the Annual Support and Maintenance covered the support work, and surely any money from people purchasing Securus after you stopped developing the previous version (which I assume you must have done, considering we haven't seen any developments since we purchased in October, and the most recent V6 is from June 2009 according to your customer site) must go towards the development costs of NG.

    I'm also a little concerned by the tone of the comment, but I'll let that pass this morning.

    Regards

    Will

  3. #33

    glennda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Sussex
    Posts
    7,714
    Thank Post
    269
    Thanked 1,116 Times in 1,012 Posts
    Rep Power
    345
    Quote Originally Posted by billjenkins View Post
    Thanks for asking. The short answer is no. The VM version is a new release and was originally destined only for LA's where there are large requirements. At BETT many of you asked if we would release a VM version for schools and after consideration we decided that it would be a good idea to do so but only after we'd made everyone aware of the risks. Our concern is surrounding the issue of what happens if Securus picks up an ILLEGAL activity? With our current offering, the police will call and take the Securus server away. Our Service Level Agreement caters for a replacement. But what about VM? This hasn't been tested and we're anxious not to expose our clients to extra risk until we know all the answers which is why we're telling everyone before we agree to supplying.
    Could you not just give the police a copy of the VM files and they could boot it up in VMware player or something like that? therefore the client wouldn't need to get a new server installed/re-setup. Plus the police will have there copy for them to check through and investigate if criminal activity has happened

  4. #34
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Willott View Post
    Hi Bill,

    Thanks for the reply... I find this part of your comment the most interesting... I thought that the Annual Support and Maintenance covered the support work, and surely any money from people purchasing Securus after you stopped developing the previous version (which I assume you must have done, considering we haven't seen any developments since we purchased in October, and the most recent V6 is from June 2009 according to your customer site) must go towards the development costs of NG.

    I'm also a little concerned by the tone of the comment, but I'll let that pass this morning.

    Regards

    Will
    Hi Will,

    Firstly, let me address the last part of your email. I would never wish to offend, and the comment was made in recognition of the fact that you all have to get a gallon into a pint pot. This is always a problem with written communications, the tone that can be heard on phone call is not there and can sometimes be misunderstood. I will try to be more careful in my responses, thank you for pointing this out.

    You're largely right. The existing ASM costs are for continued support and updates to the existing version which will cease to be supported on 31st January 2013. There are fixes being published for V6 in the next month with a new client as well. These are currently in test. We also send out patches which don't necessarily go on general release when specific issues are raised and hold them back for a general release. We have just appointed a Customer Services Manager who is taking responsibility for communication with our clients, an area that has needed addressing for some time and which needed much improvement so I hope you will see some changes very quickly.

    Are you aware of our support site - Securus Support Centre | Login and do you have a login? If not please email support@securus-software.com and this will give you access to all the latest news and views.

    We continue to support, bug fix and update V6 in parallel with our work on NG.

    Bill

  5. #35


    tom_newton's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Leeds
    Posts
    4,448
    Thank Post
    865
    Thanked 839 Times in 662 Posts
    Rep Power
    194
    Bill - I can see where you are coming from. We know it takes a lot of time and money to redevelop a piece of software. Indeed we are starting some releases shortly (auth component in March) which are ground-up rewrites for the modern filter and it is awful to have to scale back dev on existing components, and to wait... and wait... until finally the new stuff is done, then all the testing.. and all this time you don't see a penny - yes, I can see why when "new securus" contains no (virtually no?) code from "old securus" you might want to charge an upgrade. We're doing our modernisation one room at a time... whereas you guys simply moved house I guess there's pros and cons to both methods. We can keep costs lower (and not charge an upgrade fee) but it takes longer.

    As for legal eagles swooping in and taking your securus away - is it possible to write the database to DVD etc. nightly? That would seem a decent fix.

    Tom

  6. Thanks to tom_newton from:

    billjenkins (8th February 2010)

  7. #36

    glennda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Sussex
    Posts
    7,714
    Thank Post
    269
    Thanked 1,116 Times in 1,012 Posts
    Rep Power
    345
    Quote Originally Posted by tom_newton View Post
    As for legal eagles swooping in and taking your securus away - is it possible to write the database to DVD etc. nightly? That would seem a decent fix.

    Tom
    The Databases are rather large (well ours is, might just be we have rather naughty kids!)

  8. #37
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by tom_newton View Post
    Bill - I can see where you are coming from. We know it takes a lot of time and money to redevelop a piece of software. Indeed we are starting some releases shortly (auth component in March) which are ground-up rewrites for the modern filter and it is awful to have to scale back dev on existing components, and to wait... and wait... until finally the new stuff is done, then all the testing.. and all this time you don't see a penny - yes, I can see why when "new securus" contains no (virtually no?) code from "old securus" you might want to charge an upgrade. We're doing our modernisation one room at a time... whereas you guys simply moved house I guess there's pros and cons to both methods. We can keep costs lower (and not charge an upgrade fee) but it takes longer.

    As for legal eagles swooping in and taking your securus away - is it possible to write the database to DVD etc. nightly? That would seem a decent fix.

    Tom
    Hi Tom,

    Yes that's totally possible. Indeed we recommend that backups are taken regularly and the way in which this is done is entirely at the discretion of the user. The 'Webmin' interface caters for this functionality.
    Thanks for your kind welcome to the forum Tom. Much appreciated. Bill

  9. #38
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by glennda View Post
    The Databases are rather large (well ours is, might just be we have rather naughty kids!)
    You're right. The database can be up to within 90% of the physical hard disk size so a DVD would be pushing it (unless there's some brand new technology out there?) Perhaps an example of typical file sizes would be useful as a very broad outline. Typically, in a Secondary school with about 1000 users, an 80Gb Hard Disk will retain about five to six months of data. Securus NG has a minimum spec of 320Gb so on that basis you'd be looking at between 20-24 months of storage. BUT (and it's a really big BUT) you can configure the software to attach to additional devices (NAS etc.) so you could potentially keep the data forever! Thank you, Bill

  10. #39
    mjs_mjs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    bexleyheath, london
    Posts
    1,004
    Thank Post
    37
    Thanked 108 Times in 93 Posts
    Rep Power
    36
    Quote Originally Posted by billjenkins View Post
    You're right. The database can be up to within 90% of the physical hard disk size so a DVD would be pushing it (unless there's some brand new technology out there?) Perhaps an example of typical file sizes would be useful as a very broad outline. Typically, in a Secondary school with about 1000 users, an 80Gb Hard Disk will retain about five to six months of data. Securus NG has a minimum spec of 320Gb so on that basis you'd be looking at between 20-24 months of storage. BUT (and it's a really big BUT) you can configure the software to attach to additional devices (NAS etc.) so you could potentially keep the data forever! Thank you, Bill
    tape/portable hard drive then if you want to move it about or multiple blu ray disks for worm.

  11. Thanks to mjs_mjs from:

    billjenkins (8th February 2010)

  12. #40
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by glennda View Post
    Could you not just give the police a copy of the VM files and they could boot it up in VMware player or something like that? therefore the client wouldn't need to get a new server installed/re-setup. Plus the police will have there copy for them to check through and investigate if criminal activity has happened
    Hi,

    It's a good idea and certainly workable so thanks for your suggestions. In reality I think we're all going to have to educate the police about VM and cloud computing as and when (hopefully never ) the need arises. We do work closely with a number of police forces who use Securus to monitor prosecuted sex offenders and it's their high tech crimes units who are responsible for seizing hardware. This is an ongoing concern and like many things, no-one is sure of the outcome until the first event occurs! Thanks, Bill

  13. #41
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by mjs_mjs View Post
    tape/portable hard drive then if you want to move it about or multiple blu ray disks for worm.
    Hi,

    Great idea that will cover off the issue entirely (assuming all the data is on the one hard disk)
    Appreciate the feeback, Bill

  14. #42

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Nottingham
    Posts
    569
    Thank Post
    38
    Thanked 114 Times in 104 Posts
    Rep Power
    45
    Hi Bill,

    It's good to know that you've appointed a Customer Service manager, communication is an area where I have found Securus to be lacking, be it a response to a support email where I had stated I had looked in the manual that told me to look in the manual and then call if it wasn't clear (I had asked for an example of management groups with regards to staff and student users), or the communication 1 month before release of NG that there was a new version of Securus to be released (only a couple of months after purchasing Securus in the first place). As Securus was a "to be bought this financial year" project, we could have held off til February to purchase if we'd known about the new version - looking through your site (including the customer support section) I can't see any news item regarding the new version.

    I do fully understand where you're coming from about needing some income to fund the development, and understand that it would always be a major development as the move from proprietary OS with propriertary hardware to more mainstream OS and hardware was made, I just hope that now this has occured future development will lean more towards Smoothwall's progression.

    I hope that you can also understand it's very difficult to have a situation where you would like to have the best solution, and where you do have it for a couple of months, then find out that to have the best solution it's going to cost you another few hundred quid to upgrade after paying out a significant sum to get what was the best solution a couple of months ago (apologies for the cyclical nature of the sentence).

    Thanks for your replies, and also for your work on Securus, it is a brilliant tool, and we find it very useful here.

    Regards

    Will

  15. Thanks to Willott from:

    billjenkins (8th February 2010)

  16. #43

    Edu-IT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    6,875
    Thank Post
    393
    Thanked 581 Times in 532 Posts
    Rep Power
    173
    I know me and you have had a chat already about this Will. As with anything as soon as you take it away, it becomes old, and there is something new in the pipeline. That's just the way with technology. If your current Securus setup is doing what you want it to do then chances are for the time being you do not need this upgrade and can continue to get some ROI so to speak from Securus LCD2. The main focus of Securus NG seems to be reporting and more granular control over policies. While this is a great addition, I wouldn't kick yourself over your purchase. It still is a great product and does what it's meant to do. Keep it for a bit then when you are next in a position to upgrade, go for it. The core monitoring is still the same it seems.

  17. Thanks to Edu-IT from:

    billjenkins (8th February 2010)

  18. #44
    Chunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Newbridge, Wales, UK.
    Posts
    164
    Thank Post
    15
    Thanked 26 Times in 20 Posts
    Rep Power
    18
    I saw this at BETT too - looks fantastic - all I need to do now is persuade the powers that be that we need to invest in it. For what it costs, it's a cracking solution. (looks luch more functional than when I saw it a few years ago)

    Chunks

  19. Thanks to Chunky from:

    billjenkins (8th February 2010)

  20. #45
    billjenkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Thorpe, Surrey
    Posts
    16
    Thank Post
    9
    Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
    Rep Power
    9
    Will,

    Please call me on my mobile 07881 980661

    Thanks,

    Bill

  21. Thanks to billjenkins from:

    Willott (9th February 2010)

SHARE:
+ Post New Thread
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Popup generation and sharepoint web parts
    By GrumbleDook in forum Web Development
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 29th August 2011, 07:40 AM
  2. Certificate Generation
    By TechMonkey in forum MIS Systems
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 23rd April 2009, 03:00 PM
  3. I despair for our countries future generation!
    By reggiep in forum General Chat
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 9th March 2009, 11:37 AM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 2nd January 2006, 05:58 PM

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •