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How do you do....it? Thread, Install Colour printer only for staff - but flexibly... in Technical; You can run Group Policy Preferences fine with Windows XP Clients and on a Windows 2003 Domain. We have been ...
  1. #16

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    You can run Group Policy Preferences fine with Windows XP Clients and on a Windows 2003 Domain.

    We have been using this, doing exactly what your after; deploying printers (with targeting) amongst other things like mapping drives etc.

    The only extra item you may need is one Windows 7 Pro Client to configure / create the new GPO (admx) policies.

    1) Install Group Policy Preference Client Side Extensions for Windows XP (KB943729) on every Windows XP Client (can also deploy via WSUS)
    Download details: Group Policy Preference Client Side Extensions for Windows XP (KB943729)

    2) Create a Group Policy Central Store
    Creating a Group Policy Central Store
    http://download.microsoft.com/downlo...step_guide.doc

    3) Install RSAT and GPMC on your Windows 7 Client (this will allow you to manage the policies)
    Download details: Remote Server Administration Tools for Windows 7

    You could create GPOs that reside within the Computer Accounts OU and enable Loop Back Processing (with Merge enabled) or you could have 1 GPO for the domain, that uses Targeting (ie check computer name / username / security group member etc) to map the correct printer.

    Within the policy, i normally have remove all network printers first, then map each printer accordingly (with remove item when no longer required enabled). This ensures only your required printers are added and is also helpful if you rename or reconfigure printers; or even change print server.
    Last edited by MYK-IT; 16th November 2010 at 08:30 PM.

  2. #17

    sonofsanta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MatthewL View Post
    If you use PCounter you can put a rule in to disallow colour and allow if for a certain group of users.
    I'm on PCounter 2.40c (and no maintenance, so no free upgrade) and I can't see groups in the rules anywhere - I can see all the stuff for "if colour, delete/forward/etc." but nothing that would let it decide based on group. Am I just looking in the wrong place? PCounter can see groups for the accounting, but they don't show up in PControl anywhere.

    VBS scripts might be worth a bit of investigation, I am rusty beyond belief with them but there's no difference in deployment between them and pushprinterconnections as far as GPOs are concerned. Should be a man from the printer company coming in today/tomorrow to discuss how we can go about this anyway, and show me a bit more of PCounter, so I might ask him on the best way he knows of doing this.

  3. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by MYK-IT View Post
    You can run Group Policy Preferences fine with Windows XP Clients and on a Windows 2003 Domain.

    We have been using this, doing exactly what your after; deploying printers (with targeting) amongst other things like mapping drives etc.

    The only extra item you may need is one Windows 7 Pro Client to configure / create the new GPO (admx) policies.
    I'd pretty much come to the conclusion that to do it the way I wanted - i.e. pure GPO - was going to have to wait till 2008R2 over the summer (if the financial gods are kind, anyway). I'd look at doing it now except I don't have anything Windows 7 Pro lying around (home machines are on Home cos I cheaped out ) and I need to start rolling the printers out today/tomorrow, so I really need to make do with what I have lying around at the moment for now.

    Once we get 2008R2 in, though, I thoroughly intend to use GPP to do this, from what I've seen it looks wonderfully useful, I just can't believe it took them so long to get them in place!

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    Wouldn't a better solution be as follows...

    Default all the devices to mono so that users have to select colour in the printer properties. Then only allow certain users access to colour printing via PCounter. If a user is not allowed to print colour, the job will be deleted.

    Seems obvious to me and you use a simple login script of Goup Policy to deploy your printers.

  5. #20

    sonofsanta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ric_ View Post
    Wouldn't a better solution be as follows...

    Default all the devices to mono so that users have to select colour in the printer properties. Then only allow certain users access to colour printing via PCounter. If a user is not allowed to print colour, the job will be deleted.

    Seems obvious to me and you use a simple login script of Goup Policy to deploy your printers.
    This is broadly the route I'm going down now, given my lack of group policy preferences. Printers will be defaulted to mono duplex, and the cost of colour printing will be set to 51x the cost of mono. Doing this, students (with 50 credits) will be automatically denied, but teachers (with unrestricted) will be fine. We don't use PCounter for accounting so the effect on the figures isn't important. The advantage of this is that if a student needs to print in colour, we can temporarily grant them unrestricted printing, or if a classroom needs it, we can change the weighting from 51x down to a normal level. The disadvantage is chiefly in the confusion this might create, with students trying to print colour and coming to complain that they can't, but hopefully the message will spread (and I will use PCounter's messaging service to help) that this is the intended functionality.

    It would be nice if PControl could see user groups but sadly it can't, at least not as far as I can tell in 2.40c.

    The other disadvantage is that it just doesn't seem as neat to my mind, but I shall have to deal with my personal issues myself I fear!

  6. #21
    browolf's Avatar
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    I'm amazed the teachers aren't insisting that kids need to print colour sometimes.

  7. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by browolf View Post
    I'm amazed the teachers aren't insisting that kids need to print colour sometimes.
    Perhaps largely because I haven't broken the news to them yet...

    Kids will need to print in colour sometimes, so if they do, they can either give the work to their teacher (e-mail or using the shared Submissions folder) or get the teacher to email us asking for it to be enabled for that student. The real advantage of the PCounter method is that by restricting colour through credits, it's an instant solution. No logging off and on again to get the colour printer added; instead, they send us an email, we tick a box and they can print in colour immediately.

    If we left colour on all the time, the lunchtime printing would be enormous, and although we could restrict that with timings in 2k3, you would still get plenty of waste in lessons. Students printing powerpoints out at one slide per page, full colour, are the bane of my printing existence. By deliberately making it a bit awkward we're creating a sort of "soft" restriction, and introducing a policing step with the teachers, where any time a student asks to print in colour, the teacher can make sure they are really ready to print in colour.

    It remains to be seen how well all this will go down!

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by plexer View Post
    Deploying printer information using a vbs as we do aloows us to set the default printer to whatever we require.
    Same here. The script detects which OU the computers are in and installs the printers accordingly and there is a shortcut to the script on their desktop in case it doesn't work for any reason (script itself is in a folder on the network with appropriate permissions set to allow access but prevent tampering, etc). This is only done for student installs as the teacher can install printers manually.

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    Quote Originally Posted by browolf View Post
    most of our colour printers default to mono but the kids can change it themselves but they're restricted by how many pages they can do at a time, and it's low. 8 pages mono, 5 colour I think. Actually the staff are restricted like that too. We want them to use photocopiers...not printers as photocopiers. (we use papercut), You should be able to do that with p-counter. You have to be careful not create too much work, otherwise on balance the cost of teacher's time and your time outweighs the cost of excess printing.
    Yeah, PCounter can reject on number of pages or number of copies. I certainly intend to restrict on copies, but not on pages, as some of the coursework grows, and can be large. I don't want to create a queue of 30 kids at Repro every time ICT finishes up their coursework.

    The balance is the tricky thing here, and what I'm trying to work out. Nothing is set in stone, though; if there is sufficient demand for colour that it's imposing on staff time too much, I'll happily review it. I want to keep costs down, but I also don't want to limit the use and growth of ICT in the school. Should it start becoming an issue, I can just change the weighting on colour printing so that students can print a few pages of colour, but they have to weight that against the potential loss of printing further down the line.

    I should note that there will also be a few printers in school without these restrictions, so that Art (for example) can print freely to colour without involving the teacher, and the colour printer just outside our office will be unrestricted so kids can just come to us and print in colour hassle free.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonofsanta View Post
    Perhaps largely because I haven't broken the news to them yet...

    Kids will need to print in colour sometimes, so if they do, they can either give the work to their teacher (e-mail or using the shared Submissions folder) or get the teacher to email us asking for it to be enabled for that student. The real advantage of the PCounter method is that by restricting colour through credits, it's an instant solution. No logging off and on again to get the colour printer added; instead, they send us an email, we tick a box and they can print in colour immediately.

    If we left colour on all the time, the lunchtime printing would be enormous, and although we could restrict that with timings in 2k3, you would still get plenty of waste in lessons. Students printing powerpoints out at one slide per page, full colour, are the bane of my printing existence. By deliberately making it a bit awkward we're creating a sort of "soft" restriction, and introducing a policing step with the teachers, where any time a student asks to print in colour, the teacher can make sure they are really ready to print in colour.

    It remains to be seen how well all this will go down!
    I think it auto-posted that previous reply I abandoned. damn you ajax.

    You got to be careful with stuff like that, teachers will soon work out its easier for them to send kids to you than do anything themselves. You might save on printing costs but overall the cost of everyone's time dealing with it might be more.

    We find the most efficient system overall is to default to mono, allow people to change it themselves but restrict (low) how many pages they can do. That applies to teachers too. In some respects teachers are worse culprits for wasting prints. Teachers have photocopiers they can use for bulk printing.

    One way to improve efficiency of having teachers do colour printing for students is allow them read only access to kids user areas through a distributed file share.
    Last edited by browolf; 17th November 2010 at 11:11 AM.

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    Hi there

    I've just bought papercut for exactly that reason. It's quite inexpensive, but it allows you to deny colour printing based on groups (which can be pulled from an OU). You can also deny all sorts of other random things (not the right papersize - you know for when staff insist on trying to send a non-standard paper size through because they wanted to adjust margins but changed the papersize and you end up walking to the printer telling it to print the job to A4 ..)

    Industry - Education - Print control software software for schools, colleges and Universities. - PaperCut - they do a free 40 day trial which is great for seeing if it does what you want ..

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by aptproductions View Post
    you know for when staff insist on trying to send a non-standard paper size through because they wanted to adjust margins but changed the papersize and you end up walking to the printer telling it to print the job to A4 ..)
    usually it's letter/a4, u can make HP printers auto-override it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by browolf View Post
    usually it's letter/a4, u can make HP printers auto-override it.
    Oh, I have the override (using Olivetti Kit) but the standard forms staff create to make like easier aren't anything like Letter or A4 sadly. I'm slowly educating them when they come and ask me why their new form won't print.

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    I used a registry snapshot program to find out which registry key gets changed when you enable or disable colour in printer preferences .... I then ended up with 2 keys .. one black and one colour .. I then pushed the keys out using regedit /s and gpo's depending on the user/group or computer ... this works fine in XP and Ive not tried any other printers other than HP

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