Poll: What back-up solutions do you use? What spec?

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How do you do....it? Thread, Back-up solutions in Technical; not related to myself making backups or anywhere else for that matter but with the way storage is going ie ...
  1. #16

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
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    not related to myself making backups or anywhere else for that matter but with the way storage is going ie Solid State so normal hard drive prices are going down and if they make solid state drives that support trim with more capacity for servers etc might push sas drive prices down so will that make NAS'es, SAN's a bit more affordable so you could have a number of NAS'es or SAN's ( depending on the price factor obviously ) in different locations and get them to all synch at specific times using robocop or something else to keep permissions or whatever ??

  2. #17

    maniac's Avatar
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    I've literally just implemented a new backup solution here, which is a nice shiny new LTO4 tape changer. 800GB native, 1.6TB compressed. I did look at disk to disk to tape solutions, but to do that properly was out of our price range. To rely solely on Harddrives as your backup solution I personaly think is a bad idea.

    I'm now able to do a full backup every night, as the system only takes about 4hrs to backup 450GB of data, compared to the old AIT3 tape changer which it replaced which took over 24hrs to do the same.

    I keep 1 tape every friday which are over written every month, and 1 end of month tape which is kept for 12 months.

    Mike.
    Last edited by maniac; 11th March 2010 at 05:59 PM.

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  4. #18
    ascott2's Avatar
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    Backup exec to LTO autoloader. Friday full backup then daily incremental backups all to LTOs. All tapes taken off site for a week. Monthly backups are also done to LTO but then stored in the fireproof safe.

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  6. #19

    AngryTechnician's Avatar
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    I have a Microsoft DPM server that backs up to a 2TB iSCSI device located in the most remote building on site, which is the Sports Hall. It's 40m from the next nearest building, and over 200m from the server room. If we manage to lose both buildings in a single event, chances are we've lost pretty much the whole school and management agree we'll have bigger things to worry about.

    Changes are synchronised from protected servers every 15 minutes, checkpoints created twice a day and retained for 30 days.

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  8. #20

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maniac View Post
    To rely solely on Harddrives as your backup solution I personaly think is a bad idea.
    Mike.
    Even with the tape solutions - there is normally something in place to replace the tapes every so often ie once a year or something along those lines and am guessing you would do the same with hard drives.

  9. #21

    GrumbleDook's Avatar
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    If anyone has figures they could share about setup costs and then running costs (eg consumable cost of tapes, etc) it would also be helpful.

  10. #22

    maniac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mac_shinobi View Post
    Even with the tape solutions - there is normally something in place to replace the tapes every so often ie once a year or something along those lines and am guessing you would do the same with hard drives.
    LTO tapes have a lifetime of approximately 200 read/writes of the entire tape - to be a bit conservative I look to replace the tapes when they reach around 150 total read/writes or the tape reports its first error - whichever occurs first.

    I estimate it'll be 2 years before I'll need to replace any media unless any develops faults.

    With hard drives, it's much more difficult to estimate their lifetime as there are many more varying factors that can influence how long a Hard Drive lasts for - we've probably all had the dreaded server re-boot that's caused a drive failure. It's this sort of failure that you just don't get with tape, tape tends to degrade gradually and backup software reports errors long before the media physically fails - discs don't tend to do this and are prone to sudden failures. Knowing my data is safe on a system purposely designed and tested for backup purposes rather than a hashed together NAS box or simelar helps me sleep better at night. I think some people don't class backup systems as a priority, and will just 'make do' with whatever that have or can get their hands on, where as I see it as one of the most important componants of the system - it's the one part you really don't want to let you down - ever!

    I have suffered data loss in a previous job, and it's no laughing matter - jobs have been lost, luckily I didn't lose mine, but there were some very tough questions asked. Not a position I ever want to be in again!

    Mike.
    Last edited by maniac; 12th March 2010 at 11:59 PM. Reason: Spelling again!

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  12. #23


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    Currently:
    Disk > Disk | Encryption > Tape > Offsite.

    Windows servers backup to disk using ntbackup.
    *nix servers backup to disk using rsync.
    VMs get snapshotted and backed up to disk as well.
    Data and user areas are backed up differently depending on what they are - duplication-heavy areas get backed up using a script that calls subinacl and imagex and dumps them to .wim, generic areas are backed up using ntbackup/rsync.

    The disk-based backups are then either compressed (or not, depends if cpu/space tradeoff is worthwhile).

    Friday backups are encrypted with gpg over the weekend, dumped to tape on Monday and taken offsite Monday evening. They're also retained on disk in unencrypted format for ease of restoration.

    Mon-Thurs is incrementals
    Friday is fulls
    We keep 4 weeks of Fridays and a backup from the beginning and end of each term/half-term for a year.
    Other stuff may be kept for longer for auditing purposes.

    In the near future, disk-based deduplication is on the cards.

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  14. #24

    teejay's Avatar
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    D2D2T
    Dell Server with 10TB DAS, LTO4 Autoloader and Arcserve 12.5
    Use GFS scheme for tape rotation
    Tapes encrypted and stored in fireproof safe

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  16. #25

    plexer's Avatar
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    D2D

    2 DC's use R1Soft CDP to do a twice daily backup to NAS.
    Other servers use backup assist to do weekly full and daily diff to NAS.

    NAS located in secure air conditioned cupboard in remote part of school.

    No offsite vaulting.

    Ben

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  18. #26

    SYNACK's Avatar
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    eSATA pcie card NZD$60
    5x 1tb external usb/eSATA hds @ about NZD$220 each
    $0 on software cost as bundled

    or

    1x USB3 enclosure plus usb3 card @ about AUD$200 plus 1tb hd at about NZD$140
    4x enclosure at about AUD$120 each plus 1tb HD @ NZD$140 each

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  20. #27

    FN-GM's Avatar
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    All ours go onto LTO tapes daily. We also have Symantec CPS backing user files and shared areas continuously, 24 x 7

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    GrumbleDook (12th March 2010)

  22. #28

    mac_shinobi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maniac View Post
    LTO tapes have a lifetime of approximately 200 read/writes of the entire tape - to be a bit conservative I look to replace the tapes when they reach around 150 total read/writes or the tape reports its first error - whichever occurs first.

    I estimate it'll be 2 years before I'll need to replace any media unless any develops faults.

    With hard drives, it's much more difficult to estimate their lifetime as there are many more varying factors that can influence how long a Hard Drive lasts for - we've probably all hand the dreaded server re-boot that's caused a drive failure. It's this sort of failure that you just don't get with tape, tape tends to degrade gradually and backup software reports errors long before the media physically fails - discs don't tend to do this and are prone to sudden failures. Knowing my data is safe on a system purposely designed and tested for backup purposes rather than a hashed together NAS box or simelar helps me sleep better at night. I think some people don't class backup systems as a priority, and will just 'make do' with whatever that have or can get their hands on, where as I see it as one of the most important componants of the system - it's the one part you really don't want to let you down - ever!

    I have suffered data loss in a previous job, and it's no laughing matter - jobs have been lost, luckily I didn't lose mine, but there were some very tough questions asked. Not a position I ever want to be in again!

    Mike.
    Never said it was a laughing matter - also if you use raid 6 or something with a bit more redundancy does that not help and also once SSD's have been out for a number of years ie 5 to 10 maybe more then will those not be a good option *shrugs* ?? Guess it depends if they support trim and other feature sets and also interface ie sata, sas etc

  23. #29

    maniac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mac_shinobi View Post
    Never said it was a laughing matter - also if you use raid 6 or something with a bit more redundancy does that not help and also once SSD's have been out for a number of years ie 5 to 10 maybe more then will those not be a good option *shrugs* ?? Guess it depends if they support trim and other feature sets and also interface ie sata, sas etc
    Yes, I am watching the development of SSD's very carefully - at the moment the capacity lets them down, but 5yrs time I think we could be onto a winner with SSDs.

    My reply wasn't a dig at you by the way, there's a few people on here saying 'home built NAS box' or simelar, I just hope these devices are up to task for all those involved.

    Mike.

  24. #30
    round2it's Avatar
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    Backup Exec 12.5 with sql Add on Backing up the full cmis+sims (yes running both at the moment as 2 years with serco did not work out) backsup to Negear ready Nas 2tb

    also backup to tape as im kinda paranoid

    backupforAll to copy userdata to nas great for quick access to recover the kids stuff when the delete everything. (yes i know robocopy but it was dirt cheap and does a great job) never failed us

    Frogserver just use ntbackup to the Nas

    NTbackup for the exchange server + a ghost image of the server ready if needed running it on an old Dell GX60 with 512mb ram 300gb HD no raid or resilience hence the ghost image.

    Thats about it. but the whole backup system is in need of a huge overhaul i need to spend some money.
    Last edited by round2it; 13th March 2010 at 01:57 AM.

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