+ Post New Thread
Page 2 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 80
Hardware Thread, i-Pad vs Laptop in Technical; Originally Posted by tmcd35 I think in a school you need to settle on 1 platform, then managing the software ...
  1. #16


    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    8,202
    Thank Post
    442
    Thanked 1,032 Times in 812 Posts
    Rep Power
    339
    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    I think in a school you need to settle on 1 platform, then managing the software of the network shouldn't be all that difficult, should it?
    Just make that platform HTML and ica for remote apps and it will be a breeze.

  2. #17
    rdk
    rdk is offline

    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    128
    Thank Post
    2
    Thanked 16 Times in 15 Posts
    Rep Power
    31
    All the problems with central control and locking down devices can be solved by....not having central control and not locking down devices. Our 7s & 8s have 1:1 MacBooks, effectively leased by parents but owned by the school until the lease is paid out. We image (rather our vendor does) and distribute the machines together with a portable HDD for backup. At school kids have no access to the network or network drives other than the internet. Network printing available by Papercut web print client. Their responsibility to backup and manage their machines.

    Any problems caused by fiddling with settings or by downloading software that can't be fixed by tech dept in 2 minutes means that we go to the time machine backup. If that doesn't exist we re-image the machines. That's it. Best decision we ever made not to allow access to shared drives or home drives on the network, and not to try to manage the machines.

  3. #18

    Steve21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Swindon
    Posts
    2,689
    Thank Post
    334
    Thanked 515 Times in 483 Posts
    Rep Power
    179
    Quote Originally Posted by rdk View Post
    Our 7s & 8s have 1:1 MacBooks
    That's the exact issue there It's "their" machines. Not school ones lent/loaned etc etc.

    When you give someone a machine of their own, they naturally take better care of it, and even if they don't it doesn't affect anyone else anyway though.

    Steve

  4. #19


    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    8,202
    Thank Post
    442
    Thanked 1,032 Times in 812 Posts
    Rep Power
    339
    Quote Originally Posted by rdk View Post

    Any problems caused by fiddling with settings or by downloading software that can't be fixed by tech dept in 2 minutes means that we go to the time machine backup. If that doesn't exist we re-image the machines. That's it. Best decision we ever made not to allow access to shared drives or home drives on the network, and not to try to manage the machines.
    I wholeheartedly agree with this; problem is that many techs can't get away from having their own little AD empire and controlling everything - which usually is a job or two in itself, costing more time than it saves.

  5. #20

    localzuk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Minehead
    Posts
    17,638
    Thank Post
    514
    Thanked 2,443 Times in 1,891 Posts
    Blog Entries
    24
    Rep Power
    831
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve21 View Post
    That's the exact issue there It's "their" machines. Not school ones lent/loaned etc etc.

    When you give someone a machine of their own, they naturally take better care of it, and even if they don't it doesn't affect anyone else anyway though.

    Steve
    And... load them up with porn? Or games? I don't know what kinda kids you all look after, but child ownership of devices with no management from us would be basically bedlam here.

  6. Thanks to localzuk from:

    TronXP (11th October 2012)

  7. #21

    tmcd35's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Norfolk
    Posts
    5,620
    Thank Post
    845
    Thanked 883 Times in 731 Posts
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    326
    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    And... load them up with porn? Or games? I don't know what kinda kids you all look after, but child ownership of devices with no management from us would be basically bedlam here.
    There is a school of thought that says - it doesn't really matter what the pupil puts on the devices, it how they use them in class that matters. At the end of the day it's a classroom management issue and that's the teachers responsibility. Doesn't matter how many barriers we do or do not put in the way it is up to the teacher to make sure the pupil remains on task and is not accessing porn or playing games.

    I disagree, slightly, I think we have a duty of care to put certain barriers in place and professional curtsey to ensure software on the devices are uniform to aid lesson planning.

  8. #22

    Steve21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Swindon
    Posts
    2,689
    Thank Post
    334
    Thanked 515 Times in 483 Posts
    Rep Power
    179
    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    And... load them up with porn? Or games? I don't know what kinda kids you all look after, but child ownership of devices with no management from us would be basically bedlam here.
    That's my point He's saying the answer is don't lock them down it's not needed, but that's generally due to them owning it (renting/leasing etc etc) it.

    Generally you'll find all 1:1 devices are less locked though due to that part ownership, whether it's teacher laptops that need access to home stuff, or students.

    Don't think it's the right way to do it though, still should be locked down.

    Steve

  9. #23

    localzuk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Minehead
    Posts
    17,638
    Thank Post
    514
    Thanked 2,443 Times in 1,891 Posts
    Blog Entries
    24
    Rep Power
    831
    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    There is a school of thought that says - it doesn't really matter what the pupil puts on the devices, it how they use them in class that matters. At the end of the day it's a classroom management issue and that's the teachers responsibility. Doesn't matter how many barriers we do or do not put in the way it is up to the teacher to make sure the pupil remains on task and is not accessing porn or playing games.

    I disagree, slightly, I think we have a duty of care to put certain barriers in place and professional curtsey to ensure software on the devices are uniform to aid lesson planning.
    I would say that with the legal framework that we have to work within at the moment in the UK, that first school of thought is wrong, plain and simple.

    If a teacher brings porn in on their laptop, it is a serious issue and would most likely result in sacking. If a child does it, the issues regarding the porn still exist. It doesn't matter that they aren't sat in a classroom watching it, its when they're on the playing fields, transferring it to their mates, or whatever other time.

  10. #24

    tmcd35's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Norfolk
    Posts
    5,620
    Thank Post
    845
    Thanked 883 Times in 731 Posts
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    326
    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    I would say that with the legal framework that we have to work within at the moment in the UK, that first school of thought is wrong, plain and simple.

    If a teacher brings porn in on their laptop, it is a serious issue and would most likely result in sacking. If a child does it, the issues regarding the porn still exist. It doesn't matter that they aren't sat in a classroom watching it, its when they're on the playing fields, transferring it to their mates, or whatever other time.
    Again, personally I'd agree. However the issue here isn't how locked down the issue is one of policing and sanctions. We can put as many barriers as we like in place but the kids still find ways. It's not unknown for kids to bring albums of MP3's in on USB and dumping them in their network area, It's what we do when we find out about it that's the important part regardless of the barriers we may have in place. If it's their laptop it may need to be more open so they probably will put stuff on you won't be happy with, now how do you deal with it? Locking them down more may not be the answer.

  11. #25
    rdk
    rdk is offline

    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    128
    Thank Post
    2
    Thanked 16 Times in 15 Posts
    Rep Power
    31
    Re porn & games on 1:1 devices. Yes, the kids load them up with games, but if they are playing games in class it's the teacher's class management issue not a technology issue. And porn - they can't access porn through the school internet connection (our best efforts) which means it comes from home, which means its a parental issue if it's accessed online. Also, if a parent requests that the machine be password protected or they be made administrator we will do that.

    If we were to find porn, or pirated films etc, or if porn was being distributed around, it would be against the AUP and school rules in general and the kid would face sanctions. What's so special about computers that the school has to actively prevent them from holding porn or games? The kids have school bags supplied from our uniform shop and we don't actively prevent them from holding printed porn or games, yet all schools would have sanctions if it was found at school or passed around.

    And that's for kids - I find it difficult to credit how any reasonable person would expect to provide teachers with any machine of which they were not the administrator, and I wouldn't expect any teacher to accept that they are not even trusted to have anything but a locked down machine. If you can't trust a teacher to be their own admin we may as well fire them all and shut up shop.

  12. Thanks to rdk from:

    Sean-OC04 (16th August 2012)

  13. #26

    SYNACK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    11,072
    Thank Post
    853
    Thanked 2,676 Times in 2,270 Posts
    Blog Entries
    9
    Rep Power
    769
    Quote Originally Posted by rdk View Post
    they can't access porn through the school internet connection (our best efforts) which means it comes from home,
    Where is your non locked down utopia now?? as you said its best effort so the parents could just put the onus back on your systems. Why do teachers need to install software anyway, you end up with a pack of stuffed machines full of every little bit of cack that promises to make their jobs easier by one or two spelling checks.

    What makes teachers so different to every other employee in the world. Most places that deal with a large amount of machines and have a need to get work done lock down the machines a little just to make sure that they can do all the menial unimportant stuff - like their jobs as opposed to installing the latest Apple coffee recomendation app. What makes teachers so much better and more responcible than all the other employees in the world. Here's a news flash for you, they are not. They are generally worse, with unions so powerful they would have to murder someone on CCTV to be fired they know they can get away with almost everything and they attempt to.

  14. #27

    Steve21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Swindon
    Posts
    2,689
    Thank Post
    334
    Thanked 515 Times in 483 Posts
    Rep Power
    179
    Quote Originally Posted by rdk View Post
    If you can't trust a teacher to be their own admin we may as well fire them all and shut up shop.
    Would be nice and quiet!

    End of the day, the reason teachers have laptops to take home is for "work use", not personal use. Same reason for using a pc at school, so same rules/lockdowns should apply. Else why apply any policies at school, as they should be trusted there too?

    (Edit - Obviously applies to students etc too, not just teachers )

    Steve

  15. #28


    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    8,202
    Thank Post
    442
    Thanked 1,032 Times in 812 Posts
    Rep Power
    339
    Kids used to bring porn mags into school before the internet but the school didn't supply them. Same difference with technology in my eyes - as long as the school is taking reasonable precautions.

  16. #29

    Steve21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Swindon
    Posts
    2,689
    Thank Post
    334
    Thanked 515 Times in 483 Posts
    Rep Power
    179
    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd View Post
    Kids used to bring porn mags into school before the internet but the school didn't supply them. Same difference with technology in my eyes - as long as the school is taking reasonable precautions.
    Isn't "reasonable precautions" lockdowns though? Yes you could argue there's "over-lockdowns", but end of day any precautions for a computer is either a written policy, or software policy.

    Steve

  17. #30


    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    8,202
    Thank Post
    442
    Thanked 1,032 Times in 812 Posts
    Rep Power
    339
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve21 View Post
    Isn't "reasonable precautions" lockdowns though? Yes you could argue there's "over-lockdowns", but end of day any precautions for a computer is either a written policy, or software policy.

    Steve
    I don't think it has to go as far as locking machines down. If kids bring in porn and games to lessons then they should get in trouble for it. Teaching young people is about giving them responsibility for their actions, but also about educating them in real life situations. Whilst I agree that schools should block chat forums/porn/gambling etc from within the school, I believe that it is the schools responsibility to educate the children (and their parents) [about the internet]. Schools should be facilitating and actively encouraging BYOD as it is a better route to these goals than banning everything.

  18. Thanks to CyberNerd from:

    Steve21 (10th August 2012)

SHARE:
+ Post New Thread
Page 2 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Netbooks vs Laptops for class suite
    By Jollity in forum Hardware
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 29th June 2012, 09:00 AM
  2. New Laptop - Sticky Pad
    By Simcfc73 in forum Hardware
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 4th September 2011, 11:50 PM
  3. Laptop screen vs projector resolutions
    By maniac in forum Hardware
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 20th May 2009, 02:51 PM
  4. Chargeline vs. Smartline Laptop Trolley
    By eean in forum Hardware
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 12th December 2007, 10:36 AM
  5. Recommend a Laptop.
    By Geoff in forum Hardware
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 26th August 2005, 06:50 AM

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •