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Hardware Thread, Softxpand Miniframe in Technical; Originally Posted by Bluetooth But what about those of us who dont use vista at all? purely xp across all ...
  1. #31

    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluetooth View Post
    But what about those of us who dont use vista at all? purely xp across all my schools currently.
    You can still purchase the Vista (or 7) Enterprise license but not install Vista(/7). Stick with XP - that's what the downgrade rights are for. The license is the important part. Once you've got that you can pretty much run whichever OS you like.

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    Bluetooth, did M$ come back to you yet....? Another 650 boxes shipped this month all with 1 copy of XP guys.

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    All very well shipping 650 boxes per month - not going to be much use is MS say it's illegal and you have to un-ship them!

    Butuz

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    Butuz, who are M$ to make the law!? You're right though, UK penetration is getting higher daily. After meeting with John Suffolk the Government CIO yesterday, we've got their support & have taken legal advice ourselves already so are confident in our offering. That's not to say it'd be a nice thing for M$ to come out one way or another to appease the most important side of the equation which are the customes. Our stance is 1 copy of the OS, and 1 per seat of application software. In wales I think SoftXpand has been rebranded as "Hydra"?

  5. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by miniframeuk View Post
    After meeting with John Suffolk the Government CIO yesterday, we've got their support & have taken legal advice ourselves already so are confident in our offering.
    I'm sure your shipped boxes properly meet the licensing requirements for Microsoft's OEM manufacteruers (i.e. one box, one copy of Windows), but it's going to be the responsibility of each individual school to ensure they are properly licensed. As tmcd35 has pointed out, for a 6 or 8 workstation machine this would seem to simply involve buying a Windows Vista Business upgrade license and a couple of Vista Enterprise Licenses, which comes in quite reasonably at under 200 for the lot at educational pricing.

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    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Also EULA it self would not come under criminal law. You bought a copy of Windows, so it's not piracy/theft. If M$ were truely unhappy they'd have to take you to a civil court. As far as I'm aware this has never been done. It's very similar to the who hackintosh scene. Apple EULA states 'only on Apple hardware'. A case is going through in the states against Psystar to test this. A separate case would need to be brought over here to test the 'legality' of the EULA in our courts.

    Something tells me that M$ are unlikely to bring civil action against any school any time soon for using SoftXpand. Can you imagine the publicity.

    As far as I'm concerned I'm happy using this until either M$ threaten us directly with the lawyers or a test case is brought against another SoftXpand end user and the complaint is held up by the courts.

    So long as you have your licenses covered I can't see the problem in using this. As far as I can tell the Window Enterprise Edition will cover upto 5 licenses.

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    Cheers David, thanks Terry. I'd be gutted if the worst case scenario happened but legally we've secured the argument, now it's time to cover our end users.

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    dhicks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    As far as I can tell the Window Enterprise Edition will cover upto 5 licenses.
    I thought there was something in the EULA that stated that if you used the virtual copies of Windows you could only use the "base" copy of Windows to run the virtual machines? This would seem to imply that you're okay for 4 "workstation" licenses per copy of Windows Enterprise Edition.

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    Quote Originally Posted by miniframeuk View Post
    now it's time to cover our end users.
    It's the end user's responsibility to cover themselves as regards licensing. It'd be nice if you could get a nice, clear, definitive statement out of Microsoft so those of us extra-paranoid about licensing can reassure ourselves that we are properly covered.

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    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhicks View Post
    I thought there was something in the EULA that stated that if you used the virtual copies of Windows you could only use the "base" copy of Windows to run the virtual machines? This would seem to imply that you're okay for 4 "workstation" licenses per copy of Windows Enterprise Edition.

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    To be honest, haven't read the EULA word for word. Just picking up bits and pieces from across the net (as you do). To be honest I can't see this as a problem. 99.999% of the time you are going to want either a 4, 6 or 8 user system. I can't think why you'd go for an odd number with dual head graphics cards.

    For the 6 user system you'd need to buy a second Business OEM and second Enterperise Edition license anyway. Thus covering you for up to 8 machines.

    If you are right then a 5 user, and possibly 6 user, machine would be quite expensive and not very cost effective.

    Maybe a 1:4 ratio is ideal?

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    dhicks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    If you are right then a 5 user, and possibly 6 user, machine would be quite expensive
    For a 5-workstation machine say 200 for Windows licenses, 500 for the PC, 100 for 3 dual-head graphics cards, 50X5=250 for monitors plus cost of Miniframe (er, 100?) = 1150 - say 1,200, divided by 5 = 250-odd per workstation, all-in, which is still pretty good value.

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    Hi Guys.

    Yes MS have come back to me today. I spoke with Alfie again in Microsofts UK Licensing team, however everything that he said is unofficial.

    Basically what was said that it had gone away to "RMT"(Who?) for a decision regarding miniframe, they had come back with an incorect response that it should have server licences and cals etc, they sent back the right info stating that it was not a server OS and such and thus they needed to re evluate, the licensing team are still waiting for an OFFICIAL response from them, however the UK licensing team got together and are advising the following:

    For however many systems etc you are using through miniframe you should have 1x CoA. So 1 miniframe with 6 useable systems means you have to have 6 CoAs. This is not an official response and cannot be quoted as such but this is what the UK licensing team are currently adivising that everyone does.

    I asked for an ETA from RMT however Alfie said that he will be contacting them to push them along or receive the answer tuesday and he will contact me either tuesday or deffinitely on the wednesday next week.

    Thats all i have guys, please dont quote anything as i have mentioned several times, its all unofficial at the moment but it is sound advice.

    B

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    Hi there,

    That's kind of what we expected as it's the same answer we've been getting. For some reason there is never an official response, so we maintain the 1 copy of XP.

    SoftXpand 3 is in the office being tested to billy O right now and it looks like we'll release before Windows 7 which is a shame...... or is it? It may give them the chance to complete their EULA.?

    We've just announced a partnership with NetOp. Do any of you guys use that? It's a bit of a coup as some of our competitors wanted it but we got chosen which keeps the momentum. Items

    Cheers,
    Col

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    Anyone worked out what RMT is yet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluetooth View Post
    they had come back with an incorect response that it should have server licences and cals etc, they sent back the right info stating that it was not a server OS and such and thus they needed to re evluate
    But if Miniframe could be got to work with Server 2003 / 2008 then you could simply buy the appropriate number of device CALs and be done with it?

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    David Hicks

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