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Hardware Thread, Ridiculously low pricing on Surface RT for UK Edu this summer in Technical; Originally Posted by Arthur An iPad with everything will set you back over $1,800 ! You do realise that you ...
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    m25man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    An iPad with everything will set you back over $1,800! You do realise that you don't have to spend that much?
    The Pro 2 doesn't even have Cellular! So I have to carry a Mifi or get a tethering plan! Oh No!

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    Quote Originally Posted by m25man View Post
    So I have to carry a Mifi or get a tethering plan!
    Or just use your smartphones 3G/4G Internet connection? There's no need for a tethering plan either if you know how to bypass the checks your network does.

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    @Arthur multi quote on phone is a pain so used the mention instead

    Pro work on an 11" tablet or a convoluted mess of docking cables, nahhh I'll pass thanks. At that point a laptop with a decent screen makes more sense and then back to the question of why you want a tablet in the first place... portability.

    So what about those who want Win8 Pro for their existing apps but don't want to carry around a brick with poor battery life? MS have no offering and Lenovo aside the other manufacturers don't have a quality offering, RT far too limited but lovely form factor, shame.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    @Arthur multi quote on phone is a pain so used the mention instead

    Pro work on an 11" tablet or a convoluted mess of docking cables, nahhh I'll pass thanks. At that point a laptop with a decent screen makes more sense and then back to the question of why you want a tablet in the first place... portability.

    So what about those who want Win8 Pro for their existing apps but don't want to carry around a brick with poor battery life? MS have no offering and Lenovo aside the other manufacturers don't have a quality offering, RT far too limited but lovely form factor, shame.
    for day in day out stuff my atom based tablet is enough don't need an i5 when i need the grunt for vms and the like i have an xps17. it does depend what you want from a tablet but an atom runs all my legacy stuff windows 8 non rt and has a days use on battery

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    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    Pro work on an 11" tablet or a convoluted mess of docking cables, nahhh I'll pass thanks.
    Connecting a single Mini DisplayPort to DisplayPort or HDMI cable to an LCD or projector is hardly what I call a pain. Microsoft are also going to sell a proper dock for it too...







    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    At that point a laptop with a decent screen makes more sense and then back to the question of why you want a tablet in the first place... portability.
    By decent screen, do you mean physically larger, higher resolution (as in 3200x1600) or something else?

    Regarding portability, it looks alright to me...



    The Surface Pro 2 is about the same weight (0.9kg-1.1kg) as the 11" MacBook Air (1.08 kg).

    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    So what about those who want Win8 Pro for their existing apps but don't want to carry around a brick with poor battery life?
    8-9 hours battery life is not what I would call poor. With the 'Power Cover' you get ~22 hours in total. Is that still not good enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    RT far too limited
    It's not that bad...



    Quote Originally Posted by sted View Post
    it does depend what you want from a tablet but an Atom runs all my legacy stuff and has a days use on battery
    Indeed. There are some who would prefer more speed over battery life. With the Core i5, I think people will use the Surface Pro 2 more like a laptop than a tablet.
    Last edited by Arthur; 23rd September 2013 at 10:10 PM.

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    Regarding screen, physically larger, 11" at high resolution isn't comfortable for long term Win8 desktop mode imo

    Regarding weight, too heavy to use comfortably as a tablet holding it up etc. The RT is no lightweight but is usable, the added bulk of the Pro makes it laptop esque so you may as well have... a laptop?

    As for power are you quoting Surface2 as reviews never got those stats out the original Pro?

    I know MS were betting on Pro as a one device to replace tablet, notebook and tablet but seems people aren't buying it (literally). Wouldn't fancy taking a nearly 1000 device around the way you do with a tablet and by the time you add the power cover and eveything else the weight and cost go right up, most of the time wasted on web browsing with the odd burst of desktop mode.

    The funny thing is on one hand I'm not a typical user as I run more specialised techie apps than say the average iPad buyer but yet as a "Pro" user find it unsuitable. When I want to do VM work, lots of typing or a spot of Photoshop I use a ThinkPad with a proper keyboard and screen, HDD + SSD and so on, not a tablet.

    Yet at the same time I want a thin / light Windows tablet that can do 80% of the work with Win8 desktop apps (hence no RT) but without the crazy Pro price tag, is that so crazy? Shame MS can't offer a full range as that's where their strength should lie in theory, the ability to offer a device spec and price point that suits every need but with a unified OS across them all.
    Last edited by gshaw; 23rd September 2013 at 10:52 PM.

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    I really wish Microsoft would just admit that windows RT (ARM) is a waste of time at this point. I can understand that 2-3 years ago they were concerned about the x86 CPU's ability to be competitive in terms of battery life but Intel proved with the last generation clovertrail atoms that their performance and battery life was on a par with ARM chipsets. People complain about fragmentation in Android but if anything the Windows desktop/Metro divide that MS has created with RT is even worse.

    MS missed a trick by not fitting an Intel Bay Trail chipset to the new Surface tablet in place of the Tegra 4 in my opinion. A full-fat Windows 8.1 tablet with a quad core CPU, 4 Gb of RAM and a 400 price tag could have turned around peoples opinion of Windows 8. As it stands the Tegra-based surface RT is still a waste of time and the haswell Surface Pro (as nice as it is) is too expensive and bulky/heavy.

    I can't help but feel that Microsoft are holding back on bringing out the perfect tablet to give the OEM's a chance to catch up. There are far better hardware solutions available (bay trail & ULV fanless haswell CPU's) which would be a far better fit for their tablets but they seem reluctant to use them! I'm guessing they shied away from bay trail because they felt it would be too close in terms of pricing to the Tegra 4 Surface. I expect they probably have some kind of special deal with Nvidia or feel the need to keep the trainwreck that is Windows RT rolling on the tracks a bit longer to save face.

    On the plus side taken in isolation the Surface Pro 2 is substantial improvement on the previous generation. The battery life is now on a par with other ultrabooks and ,whilst expensive for a 'tablet', given the specs and build quality if I were looking to spend 800-900 on a laptop I'd definitely consider it as an alternative.
    Last edited by flyinghaggis; 24th September 2013 at 12:42 AM.

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    while rt has been a commercial flop its not a bad os granted it has limitations bit so do most things and from what ive used of it its not bad. i suspect its kept so that ms can merge windows phone and rt at some point as smartphones become ever bigger and more powerfull

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    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    Yet at the same time I want a thin / light Windows tablet that can do 80% of the work with Win8 desktop apps (hence no RT) but without the crazy Pro price tag, is that so crazy?
    Probably (crazy that is - at least for a few more years). My experience of tablets (iPad, RT, Nexus7, Galaxy) is they are good for consuming content and absolutely abysmal when it comes to creating anything more than a one line email (and sorry Mrs Structures, but I don't count Draw-It as creating content!). My typical tablet use is reading email, web surfing and TV/Radio/Film catchup. The RT does that very well for me and, the touch keyboard cover makes it a viable alternative to a laptop for short trips. But if I need to do any serious work, or if I will be away for any great length of time, I take a laptop.

    I think the big failure of Windows 8 as a has been the inconsistencies between the platforms. It should be possible to move from phone to tablet and have the same gestures available (it's not). It should be possible to take your code and compile it to the target processor without having to do extensive re-work for the specific device (it's not). One of Windows huge strengths has been backwards compatibility and compatibility across different hardware. RT and Phone have diluted that.

    That said, out of the tablets I have played with - and for what I use those devices for, the RT is my preferred device for now. It's not perfect but it does exactly what I want and in a way I think is very usable.

  10. #115
    zag
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    Quote Originally Posted by gshaw View Post
    Shame MS can't offer a full range as that's where their strength should lie in theory, the ability to offer a device spec and price point that suits every need but with a unified OS across them all.
    Actually Microsoft's strengths lie in creating software, they are rubbish at building hardware!

    Personally I think I would much rather have an apple air than a Microsoft surface pro.

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    Any idea if the offer is still on?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamin100 View Post
    Any idea if the offer is still on?
    Doesnt look like it. The Blog page hasnt been updated with any new dates.

    Academic pricing on Surface RT - Microsoft UK Schools blog - Site Home - MSDN Blogs

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamin100 View Post
    Any idea if the offer is still on?
    No it isn't. I spoke to one of their representatives just before the end of september about it as my original order of a test machine had taken so long to come I wanted to see if there would be an extension to the offer so that I would have time to test it in my school, but he said there wouldn't.

    I finally recieved the one that I ordered in July at the end of September. I placed an order for 30 around that time also, and that order was passed onto Softcat. I recieved the keyboards over a couple of days last week, and am supposed to recieve the tablets today, but we will see!

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    I received a call from Softcat today, informing me that we'd now have to pay a 7.50 delivery charge to get the tablet we've been waiting for since July! Absolute codswallop - why should we have to pay extra to a middleman who has been brought in because Microsoft dropped the ball. I asked to speak to someone at MS, who told me that the order could be passed back to them and I wouldn't have to pay the charge (the person from Softcat who was also on the call didn't sound happy about this!).

    They did say that it might take a couple of days longer, but that it was 2 weeks either way, so I went for it. I'm curious if anyone else has been asked to pay these charges, because in my opinion it's just plain wrong.

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    Gotta say I'm using the Surface RT as a replacement for my iPad and Nexus 7. Just found the 7" display too small. The Surface 2 looks a big improvement over the RT, and I hope there will be price reductions in the next six months or so.
    We bought about 20 RT's in my place, over different centres.

    I was talking to a Microsoft Edu Sales guy in Ireland around the end of September, and he was fairly confident that they would continue the educational pricing for the original Surface RT as an ongoing basis.
    They got huge orders from all over Europe, for the Surface RT. They were finding it hard to keep up with the orders, giving the fact that MS Edu sales don't have great experience in shipping hardware. So I can see where the problems can be. He told me that they got one order for 30,000 RT's.

    We are looking at getting 1:1 device for students, hopefully starting next September, maybe on a pilot basis. I don't think that the RT is there yet for this year.
    The Surface RT is the front running for us at the moment on price and security, but if MS don't get the O365 as a Microsoft login, this would be a deal breaker.
    Last edited by scadden; 18th October 2013 at 11:43 PM.

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