Hardware Thread, CCTV in Technical; We're using quite an ancient CCTV system but the school is starting too see the need to pump some money ...
18th June 2013, 10:31 AM #1
We're using quite an ancient CCTV system but the school is starting too see the need to pump some money into modernising it. Currently it's your standard couple of recording boxes sat in one room with all the video cables running back to it and each camera has a dedicated power point near each camera....so quiet expensive to add, plus the cameras themselves cost about £200 each, the ones we have currently keep dropping off and require a local firm to come in and sort them out. Basically one big PITA!
Now that they're looking to overhaul everything i was thinking of IP CCTV and using our network + PoE to solve this, can anyone recommend me an IP CCTV system with good quality cameras (both internal and external) that might fit out needs here as a starting point?
We need the recording boxes to be capable of keeping up to a months worth of video stored on them and be able to take snips of video on to CD/DVD for the police to see.
IDG Tech News
18th June 2013, 11:05 AM #2
QNAP NAS's do surveillance for IP camera's and aren't too pricey.
Thanks to mikkydoos from:
18th June 2013, 11:26 AM #3
After doing a revamp at my last place I can say I prefer Sony cameras to the Axis cameras (except the Axis PTZ-212 which has a crazily big viewing angle) as far as picture quality goes.
I built a custom server to run the cameras - a AMD Quad Core 2U rack mount using desktop PC parts, wish I had used smaller drives since we put in place the 30 day recording policy but have the details up here - Inside a new Storage Server | my world of IT
Milestone XProtect Xpress was the software that it ran off. It chewed through a lot of the server side CPU (about 60%) with 18 HD cameras running off it (but that is only due to the motion detection).
For the first batch of cameras we got the supplier to do the physical install and our cabling company to put in the cables (using PoE injectors in most places) but after that we did the camera installs in house as its little more than drilling some holes (site team did this for us) and putting up a mount.
18th June 2013, 11:30 AM #4
We've gone down the Axis route. M1054 for internal cameras and P1343-E for externals. The software is quite good, but you do need to buy a licence for each camera too.
18th June 2013, 12:22 PM #5
Thanks, i like the idea of storing the video on a NAS, and i also like the sound of something built for purpose opposed to being some prebuilt box, seems there's a hell of a lot more flexibility with an IP system than i thought!
We're probably going to be looking at a total of 40-50 cameras with a view to expand on that, both internal and external.
So next question is camera management, if you go for all of one brand is there a central management system for them so that you can setup any camera end settings globally? Can you setup most of these so that they do motion detection at particular times of day? Is it easy enough to take a piece of video, dump it on a DVD and give it to the police to watch? (when i say easy enough on the latter, i mean could any old dumbo do it without any, or at least very little, prior knowledge of how it works.....this bit is very important, else i'll be running about all the time)
18th June 2013, 12:25 PM #6
When I costed replacing the CCTV at my last place it was significantly cheaper to remain on the existing coax and 12V system with DVRs than to move over to IP units. The quality of the older style cameras is quite impressive still, yes its not mutli-megapixel but do you really need such high quality for a school, we are not RBS here!
I replaced and re-did our entire CCTV including replacing about 1/3 of cabling all new PSUs, 4 new recorders with 4TB storage in each box for about 1/4 of the price of fitting fairly entry level IP Cameras.
The DVRs are web accessible via apps for Android and iPad as well as web browser and dedicated software so the relevant people have access to the footage inside and outside of school so cannot be sniffed at really.
We got all the kit from CCTV Direct | CCTV Kits, CCTV Systems & Security Cameras for sale and got the local sparkies to fit it and cable it and I did all the DVR work for them and worked with them on focus / zoom etc...
18th June 2013, 12:30 PM #7
NAS is your central management. You'll need a few for that number of camera's tho'. The camera's record to file i.e .avi, file files can be shared from your NAS across your network.. that means anyone (or those who have permissions) can burn from their desktop PC. You view via your web browser or using e.g. a mobile app. Outward facing IP or VPN will let you view outside of hours. Quite a few NAS's do surveillance. Shop around and see whats best for you. Check the compatible camera lists/specs from manufacturers too.
Hi-Def - good for me when I come in and find one of my servers in the school sandpit !!!
Originally Posted by john
Last edited by mikkydoos; 18th June 2013 at 12:34 PM.
18th June 2013, 12:32 PM #8
Our sister company, CNS handle IP-CCTV, door entry etc and have worked in schools all around the the country.The guy who owns it is really knowledgeable with school security systems and the different options available. If you would find it helpful im sure he would be more than happy to give you a quick call and discuss your deployment and answer any questions etc? No worries if not, just thought id provide you with the option
18th June 2013, 12:39 PM #9
Through a break-in I assume? Does raise the question about how easily accessed your servers were. We have had prosecution from our old system for breakins smashed windows etc.... so you don't need multi-megapixel HD to be successful just quality images and quality footage.
Originally Posted by mikkydoos
18th June 2013, 12:41 PM #10
I'll recommend axis cameras. We use them with Zoneminder (free). Just requires a server and cameras. Very cost effective solution compared to off the shelf setups if you're willing to invest some time setting it up.
18th June 2013, 12:45 PM #11
We run Milestone with a mixture of original analogue cameras on an axis encoder chassis with other axis cameras around the school.
The original installation was just under £5K for a 12 port axis encoder, replacement IP camera for reception and all the cabling, software and server.
This was 3 years ago.
18th June 2013, 01:26 PM #12
Funny timing for me to make this page, just had another incident.....student went into staff toilets and took a **** on top of the cistern...... :| I was the poor sod that walked in on it first.
Luckily the CCTV we have in that area works so we know exactly who it is, but for an internal camera its such a poor image, can barely make out the kids face.
18th June 2013, 03:06 PM #13
Originally Posted by john
Not since then - 2" steel window bars did the trick ; )
18th June 2013, 03:07 PM #14
Originally Posted by mrbios
Lol - A trip to the student toilets is in order then ????
18th June 2013, 03:34 PM #15
Well it's a really poor design, when the building was built they decided a little alcove with two unisex cubicals would be a smarter choice than ANY other option. Honestly i avoid going for a #2 down there out of fear of one of the very flimsy feeling locks not locking properly. Plus they're the kind of door locks that can be opened in an instant with a coin.
Originally Posted by mikkydoos
But anyway....i pretty much opened the door to one, took half a step inside and went "Nope!" and quickly went into the other
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