Oh for the crazy 1996 - 97 days of £60k for an NT4 MCSE
Oh for the crazy 1996 - 97 days of £60k for an NT4 MCSE
One of the interesting problems the industry is going to have in a few years is that there will be a shortage of truly experienced people, due to nearly all companies now demanding a huge range of skills and wanting X years of experience in that particular field, even for an entry level 'answering the phones' post. ie. there is no way for someone fresh out of uni to get in to the industry.
I think, as cookie says, the pay in IT will level over the next few years, but it will level at a good place and the industry will realise its mistakes - well we can hope anyway.
1.) How much a company is willing to invest to support a particular a particular IT functional area.
2.) The market rate for the services required. This is determined by the level of technical expertise and availability of skilled people (the old skills gap nugget)
A company could invest hundred of thousands in hardware and software that requires quite moderate investment in support staff. Storage Infrastructure for instance.
In comparision a company could invest tens of thousands in hardware/software solution that requires significant customization and has high support costs. For example a Siebel CRM system or a Business Objects product.
The whole issue of pay varies so much from role to role, company to company, and type of employment.
Yep, at the end of the day the money people hope to buy equipment that supports itself and if they need someone to maintain it they want it cheap, they don't see any money in making sure their IT is working smoothly and managed by professionals. The only time they realise this is bad practice is when things go wrong and all of their staff are sat around not 'working' because their tools aren't 'working'.Quote:
The problem is that we are at the Bottom of the IT Field.. we are just support monkeys...
Programmers and DBA's however are seen as revenue drivers so they gain more kudos with the upper levels.
1) The unix sysadmin and his unix bod chums who ensures the big milion dollar unix iron is ticking over.
2) The Oracle DBA and his DBA chums who administer the $500,000 Oracle implementation, who incidentally rely on the unix guys to allocate processors, memory and storage on the big iron for they're database(s)
3) Or the SAP admins who administer the SAP ERP installation and rely on the oracle DBA's to create and maintain for them the database(s) crucial to operation of the SAP system. We don't know how much the SAP system costs 'cos they don't tell anyone. But let's say SAP throw in a sweetener to win the business and license the product at $250,000
and again it resides in a partition or two on the big iron.
Theres no surprises who's going to get paid the most.....the SAP guys.
Followed by the Oracle guys,
Followed by the poor unix guys.
So even though the unix guys are at the root (sorry!!) of the infrastructure and to whom everyone relies.....the oracle guys, the sap guys, the siebel guys,...the unix guys are paid the least.
If we ddid a bit further digging we'd see that while the unix iron cost the most, the support costs will be the lowest....the oracle licensing was cheaper than the unix iron but the support costs are higher..,,,was sap licensing really the cheapest - why not, it's just an application server with a few modules written in java (simplified explanation).
But one things for sure it's support costs are by far the highest of the three.
II dont know what my point is.....but it's a somewhat strange answer in regards to the complexity vs pay issue. What i'm saying is at the end of the day it's all about TCO rather than how hard the different disciplines are. And IT products have differing TCO in relation to support costs, irrespective of whether we find one more complex than the other.
For that reason consultants of these business apps (sometimes mistakenly referred to as administtratos) are more valuable becuase they're skills are used to ensure these crucial systems are tailored and running as efficiently as possible, it also helps they have high level of specific training and their skills are in high demand.
Unfortunately while sysadmins are at the foundatin of what can and can't be achieved with technology....they are too far removed from the making the company money side of the business. We're too close to the engine room of the business to be noticed and acknowledged by mgmt. Exxcept they know we're there because they're paying for stuff they can't see - stuff that ensures the engine room doesnt grind to halt.....and it bugs them. Becuase these are the type of people who cn only understand something if it is presented to them as pie chart or a bar graph.
Say sexy word to them such as sap or business intelligence and they'll come over all interested. Say fiber channel or iscsi and they'll come overr all suspiciosus and begruding.
I have to say whenever I read threads like this it makes me realise how lucky I am in my school. As IT Manager I get £32k, 11 weeks holiday, total support of the head and SLT, on the whole lovely staff both in my department and amongst the teachers and lots of opportunities for training and getting involved in the wider school community, directing plays, going on outdoor pursuits weekends etc. I also get to live in the Lake District which is pretty cool too.
Surely others on here must be in similar positions?
I think you will find there arent too many in your postion. The holiday especially. I thought I was doing well with 31 days.
Errr jcollings, you live in some kind of IT heaven ;-) love it while it lasts. My pay is ok a bit behind yours but ok but i only get the standard 27 days hols and training what's that?
Just North of the Border in B&NES it's 22.5k per annum,, although I'm only paid for term times thats 46 weeks of pay + 10 days extra per year for essential works in the holidays + SNA allowance because i'm in a large special school.
I still have to work at Tesco's in the evening though to pay the mortgage!