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General Chat Thread, London Riots in General; Originally Posted by JJonas Well said Hightower. Expect rep when I get back to a computer. Don't worry, I already ...
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJonas View Post
    Well said Hightower. Expect rep when I get back to a computer.
    Don't worry, I already neg repped him for you, I got it covered

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    Hightower's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK-2 View Post
    Don't worry, I already neg repped him for you, I got it covered
    Aye, but that was for something completely different

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    Mobile site needs a +rep button

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hightower View Post
    At the end of the day, we all should have seen this coming. We work in schools where we see the youths of today growing up and although the majority of kids are well behaved and show respect to others, the bad (to me at least) seem to be getting worse at a rate that's extremely worrying. We all see criminal behaviour like these riots every day, which is proven by me having to replace 11 mice, 3 keyboards, and 23 blanking panels in a class of 27 computers. Okay, the damage we see in the classroom is nowhere near the scale of these riots, but it shows the same lack of respect by today's youngsters for anything at all. Even their own belongings like mobile phones aren't treat with care or respect, because in today's world it's far too easy to replace it if needed.

    We need to get back to a stage in schools, where kids who want to learn are taught well, and the disrupter's are disciplined in an appropriate way (i.e. not being put in a 'behavioural room' which has a PS3 and TV). We need to get back to a stage where everything is a privilege, except education which is a right - the way I see it at the moment, using a brand new computer is a right (even for known destructor's) and being educated seems to be a privilege (for kids who want to learn but can't because the bad kids are getting all the attention).

    A lot of people here have said it is mainly down to the parents, and I'm not arguing with that. But it is also down to the educators of today to correct what is so horribly wrong with this country. It is down to the government to allow the teachers to teach again, to discipline again, to insert respect back into the community.
    Great post.

    What can parents do when they are out at work during the summer while the kids are on holiday? Without taking time off work to make sure the kids are not going out (and coming back late), what can they do?

    Why are teachers/children and MPs getting 6 weeks off work in the summer because of historical links to farm working?

  5. #290


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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    Great post.

    What can parents do when they are out at work during the summer while the kids are on holiday? Without taking time off work to make sure the kids are not going out (and coming back late), what can they do?

    Why are teachers/children and MPs getting 6 weeks off work in the summer because of historical links to farm working?

    People are going to call me all sorts for this but;

    IMO women (or men) should not be working as much once they have a child. Family is what life is all about, not work. Now obviously we've got to a point where people can't afford to live if both parents don't go out to work, but it never used to be like that. Even as recently as the 80s a lot of mums either stayed at home or had part time jobs. Now to me the main reason both parents need to work is because of house prices, but the daft thing is they couldn't have risen like they did if one parent wasn't earning a full wage.

    People can call me what they will but I honestly believe some mums need to be at home a hell of a lot more than they currently are. Other advantages to this other than more time to nurture your child is; more jobs for the young, elderly and childless, cheaper prices for certain things, less traffic congestion, more community spirit as mums have time to network with each other, better diets for the family as mum has time to prepare a meal instead of being too tired and ordering a takeaway...

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    Quote Originally Posted by j17sparky View Post
    People are going to call me all sorts for this but;

    IMO women (or men) should not be working as much once they have a child. Family is what life is all about, not work. Now obviously we've got to a point where people can't afford to live if both parents don't go out to work, but it never used to be like that. Even as recently as the 80s a lot of mums either stayed at home or had part time jobs. Now to me the main reason both parents need to work is because of house prices, but the daft thing is they couldn't have risen like they did if one parent wasn't earning a full wage.

    People can call me what they will but I honestly believe some mums need to be at home a hell of a lot more than they currently are. Other advantages to this other than more time to nurture your child is; more jobs for the young, elderly and childless, cheaper prices for certain things, less traffic congestion, more community spirit as mums have time to network with each other, better diets for the family as mum has time to prepare a meal instead of being too tired and ordering a takeaway...

    While we're living Ideal world though surely these children should be at home knitting?

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    Quote Originally Posted by j17sparky View Post
    People are going to call me all sorts for this but;

    IMO women (or men) should not be working as much once they have a child. Family is what life is all about, not work. Now obviously we've got to a point where people can't afford to live if both parents don't go out to work, but it never used to be like that. Even as recently as the 80s a lot of mums either stayed at home or had part time jobs. Now to me the main reason both parents need to work is because of house prices, but the daft thing is they couldn't have risen like they did if one parent wasn't earning a full wage.

    People can call me what they will but I honestly believe some mums need to be at home a hell of a lot more than they currently are. Other advantages to this other than more time to nurture your child is; more jobs for the young, elderly and childless, cheaper prices for certain things, less traffic congestion, more community spirit as mums have time to network with each other, better diets for the family as mum has time to prepare a meal instead of being too tired and ordering a takeaway...
    i agree in sorts, but the problem is we are now in the situation where both parents need to work.

    i know if we had a kid now, we would struggle to pay mortgage+bills+food+baby on just my wage if my wife stopped working completely.
    if gas and electric bills came down
    if mortgage rates were lower
    if petrol wasn't so expensive
    if food prices were standardised not localised....
    all these things would mean a family life would be easier to come by. but as it is (and probably always will be now) profit for these big companies will trump family life for you or i

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    Quote Originally Posted by j17sparky View Post
    People are going to call me all sorts for this but;
    Nave or overly optimistic is probably the worst I can manage

    Quote Originally Posted by j17sparky View Post
    Now to me the main reason both parents need to work is because of house prices,
    Don't forget food prices, energy prices, rent, petrol ... you get the point. The cost of living just hasn't increased in line with average wage increment. In order to keep up payments across so many rising costs often both parents are forced to work these days.

    The advantages you list fit much more with the 20th century society where consumers can drive prices and resources are local. For example today the cars will be on the road because you have to drive to the local playgroup/library/special needs unit.

    Cuts and the fake promise of the big society meeting our needs mean not working is not an option.

  9. #294

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    Of course, parent-child time is a major issue here, but the fact that parents both have to work isn't really an issue here - most of these kids out looting etc... are not from 2 parent families! I read recently that 1 in 5 kids is from a single parent family now.

    One of the old ideas used to be that the father was the disciplinarian and the mother was the caring one. I know that's ridiculously sexist and over simplified but in a way it makes sense. If one parent is all they have, it often leads to them missing out on an aspect of growing up that is needed. If they lack the discipline, they are crazy wild and immoral, if they lack the caring side (which plenty will), they can become withdrawn from society and that comes with its own problems (like them seeking out people with similar mindsets, no matter how weird, and them becoming extremists etc...).

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    One of the old ideas used to be that the father was the disciplinarian and the mother was the caring one. I know that's ridiculously sexist and over simplified but in a way it makes sense. If one parent is all they have, it often leads to them missing out on an aspect of growing up that is needed. If they lack the discipline, they are crazy wild and immoral, if they lack the caring side (which plenty will), they can become withdrawn from society and that comes with its own problems (like them seeking out people with similar mindsets, no matter how weird, and them becoming extremists etc...).
    i grew up in a single parent family (just my dad) and it done me no harm............
    *waits for comments!*

    seriously though, a lot of blame is always placed on "oh they are a single parent family lot". its crap, if the parent has morals, standards and love for the child then the child won't grow up a thug. they may become one later on in life for various reasons, but not due to upbringing.
    if anything, at school i saw a few kids whose mother/father had remarried and the kid acted out to get the attention of the parent away from their new relationship. we wouldn't be blaming marriage for any of this so don't think we should be blaming divorce/single parents for this either

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    You have to take many things into account. Poor irrisponsible parenting comes in many guises. Women also have to look after themselves financially too. If their partner decides to upgrade from software to firmware and they never got married then they are in serious financial trouble. Even more so if they haven't been in employment for several years.
    It is too easy to generalise and it is always someone elses fault.

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    ignore duplication!
    Last edited by NikChillin; 11th August 2011 at 02:55 PM.

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    Teaching has become very left-wing huggy huggy in the past decade. I don't there's enough of the older fire and brimstone scare the crap out of you teachers left. They've all just retired to protect their final salary!

    My father-in-law retired early as he had his students (all girls too!) going crazy. Not just jumping on desks, but screaming abuse at him - calling him a racist, saying they'd sue him for it. The SLT at the school didn't really care (Discipline problem? What discipline problem?!)

    I'm lucky that I've only worked in three schools, all of which are Outstanding (not only in OfSTED, but in management) so I haven't seen this first hand since coming back into education after leaving it at age 18 ten years ago. But I remember the real nasty pieces of work at my old school - the no hopers, the ones where going to jail is almost assured - still respected several of the older teachers as they took no crap off them, and also treated them well - I'm sure you all know what I mean - the I'll respect you when you respect me thing. And it worked.

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    Ignore duplication.

    Forum seems a bit jittery this afternoon!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodan View Post
    The advantages you list fit much more with the 20th century society where consumers can drive prices and resources are local. For example today the cars will be on the road because you have to drive to the local playgroup/library/special needs unit.
    Oh I agree, I wasn't saying its all down to this and this is how you fix it, it's a much larger issue. If each of my family didn't have a car we wouldn't have been able to work, go shopping, recreation, after school activities, etc. I don't live out in the sticks either, it was just a lack of local services down to the last govt. spending all their pennies on playgrounds/etc for scummy areas which got trashed and rebuilt more times than I've had hot dinners. So yeah mummy had to work to be able to afford a car. But then, the reason why all of these services have popped up out of town is because everyone has a car.



    To me the main reason for these scummy areas existing is how easy it is to stay on the dole, ironically its very hard to get on the dole if you have just lost your job as anyone who's been through it knows. Children see their parent(s) not having ever worked and think it's the norm. People are saying its because the kids are bored, well yes I agree, if you never go to school, have never had a job, and live in a council estate with the majority of people being in the same boat then you will get bored. Solution - get a job, spend your money on keeping yourself occupied, and hopefully want to better yourself and get yourself out of the council estate, or better still stay there and help bring the area up.
    Last edited by j17sparky; 11th August 2011 at 03:17 PM.

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